Status on Victoria-class Submarines?
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Eye In The Sky
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Not taking away from the CP-140's. Amazing and exciting upgrades. I'm a huge fan of the new capabilities. However, it is important to differentiate (for the non navy/airforce types) between catching a sub on EX vs in the wild so to speak. When you know there is a sub, the area to look for it is limited, and in some cases, the mission profile of the sub (you can extrapolate based on the exercise) the submarine loses its strategic surprise/initiative, which is probably its most important trait. This is generally what happens in an exercise.
If you don't know a sub is there, what it is doing and haven't had a sniff it's very hard. That's why submarines are strategic weapons.
If you don't know a sub is there, what it is doing and haven't had a sniff it's very hard. That's why submarines are strategic weapons.
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Underway said:
You aren’t wrong.
Although the CP-140 has, on more than one occasion (in a non-exercise environment), gotten things back on track. As you know, we usually have a good idea where the bad guys are, quite often that’s enough to generate contact. NATO does a decent job of keeping Ivan honest.
The assets we use to keep tabs submarines is astounding, they are the ultimate war machine. Which is why the Victoria is very relevant.
OceanBonfire
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HMCS Windsor has undocked:
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New batteries for the subs
https://asiapacificdefencereporter.com/pmb-defence-wins-contract-for-canadian-subs/
https://asiapacificdefencereporter.com/pmb-defence-wins-contract-for-canadian-subs/
Eye In The Sky
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I welcome any spending of $$ on keeping our SSKs capable!
Colin Parkinson
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Eye In The Sky said:
Yes we may need them sooner than expected. I hope to see another couple of long deployments again. Really pisses me off when they get slagged for everything that went wrong and then those same people have no idea what they have done since.
Colin Parkinson
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Sea trials continue HMCS Victoria
https://www.facebook.com/notes/royal-canadian-navy/hmcs-victoria-returns-to-sea-stronger-than-ever-with-new-battery-and-sonar/10158825265588270
https://www.facebook.com/notes/royal-canadian-navy/hmcs-victoria-returns-to-sea-stronger-than-ever-with-new-battery-and-sonar/10158825265588270
Ping Monkey
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War Zone picking up the story too.
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/38369/the-saga-of-this-long-busted-submarine-is-an-example-of-how-sad-canadas-tiny-sub-fleet-is
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/38369/the-saga-of-this-long-busted-submarine-is-an-example-of-how-sad-canadas-tiny-sub-fleet-is
HMCS Victoria is in the water as part of Task Group Exercise 21-01 along with two frigates and 2 MCDVs.
www.lookoutnewspaper.com
Pretty great to see it operating! BZ
The role of the Task Group Commander
Capt(N) Scott Robinson, who is the Deputy Commander for Canadian Fleet Pacific, is the Task Group Commander for Task Group Exercise (TGEX) 21-01
www.lookoutnewspaper.com
Pretty great to see it operating! BZ
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Not sure if this belongs here or not, but since we've been talking about the Aussie French Subs....
independentaustralia.net
Government submarine contract sunk and unlikely to resurface
The submarine deal France proudly called 'the contract of the Century' appears to have collapsed, reports Alan Austin.
Not everyone, it appears, believes it is that bad. https://www.aumanufacturing.com.au/...arine-construction-project-by-gregor-fergusonNot sure if this belongs here or not, but since we've been talking about the Aussie French Subs....
Government submarine contract sunk and unlikely to resurface
The submarine deal France proudly called 'the contract of the Century' appears to have collapsed, reports Alan Austin.
MilEME09
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Navy submarine suffered long-term damage to ballast tank from errant test: report
An internal Defence Department report has pulled back the curtain on the damage caused by an errant test on one of Canada's four submarines last year, suggesting some of the damage is permanent and could continue to pose a risk over the long term.
www.ctvnews.ca
HMCS Corner Brooks damage to her ballast tank determined to be Beyond economical repair. That is a heavy risk to assume depending on the damage. If she can't sail again safefy she might become a training ship.
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Conclusion of a piece at the excellent US site, The Drive's "War Zone"--good luck with any government finding the money to buy replacements any time in the foreseeable future, what with CSC and new fighter:
Mark
Ottawa
Canadian Submarine Bedeviled By Accidents For A Decade Is Finally Back In The Water
Canada’s tiny submarine fleet has been in sad shape for years. Now with the return of HMCS Corner Brook that could start to change.
...
The COVID-19 pandemic further complicated things and, although Victoria returned to the fleet last September, Corner Brook faced more delays. As of April this year, both Windsor and Victoria were in the water undergoing post-work testing, suggesting the program may, finally, have turned a corner. There seems to be some uncertainty when work on Chicoutimi might be completed, however, evidenced by the RCN’s stated aim of “having three of four submarines” back in service in the near-term.
That aspiration might also be challenged by the age of the submarines, with the oldest, Victoria, due to reach the end of its planned service life next year. A life-extension program costing roughly $1.5 billion would be required to keep the class active into the late 2030s or early 2040s. While that may not sound such a lot, it’s a significant figure in a country where annual defense spending for 2019-20 was estimated at around $26.5 billion, total. The life-extension program would equate to more than 5 percent of the entire defense budget.
It wouldn’t be altogether surprising if the Canadian government decides the funds for submarine life-extension could be better spent elsewhere. Regardless, Canada has already invested more than a billion dollars in the submarines in the past 20 years, with very little return so far. Submarines are also not the only area where Canada is struggling to modernize, with the saga of acquiring new fighter jets another prominent big-ticket example.
The RCN’s requirement for a submarine of any kind is meanwhile clear, with the strategic importance of the nearby Arctic region steadily growing and with highly advanced Russian submarines increasingly active in the North Atlantic. The result has been a revival of submarine and anti-submarine warfare across NATO, something that Canada is keenly aware of. That said, just four submarines for a country like Canada with maritime interests in the Atlantic, the Pacific, and the Arctic, as well as responsibilities as part of NATO, is an extremely small force — even if they do all work.
That Ottawa is willing to invest in high-end naval capabilities is clear by looking at its ambitious next-generation frigates, based on the British Type 26 design, which will be among the most heavily armed warships of their size.
It remains to be seen whether Canada will opt to persist with its trouble-prone Victoria class or if it will decide to invest in a new design offering better reliability and capabilities, although, so far, there doesn’t appear to be any active movements toward acquiring new submarines. Once the RCN finally has three subs back in regular service, the defense ministry might be better able to make a decision on that front.
Royal Canadian Navy
HMCS Corner Brook transported on the lift barge Seaspan Careen.
Canadian Submarine Bedeviled By Accidents For A Decade Is Finally Back In The Water
Canada’s tiny submarine fleet has been in sad shape for years. Now with the return of HMCS Corner Brook that could start to change.www.thedrive.com
Mark
Ottawa
Colin Parkinson
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We could slowly phase them out and bring in a new class of subs concurrently. Move the Victoria's to one coast and start the new Class on the other. If we bought into someone else build we could either alternate new builds if there are no changes or have ours tacked on near the end of their build program. The Taigei-Class look quite promising, although I suspect we would want US designed weapon systems.
Another option is to buy the Soryu class subs used from the Japanese, although they will generate the same "Used sub debacle" stories.
Another option is to buy the Soryu class subs used from the Japanese, although they will generate the same "Used sub debacle" stories.
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