Reserve Pension- Merged

[Rifleman62]

For your info. I have received my pay records for Cl A and Cl B service from 1972 to present. The documents are photocopies of CF pay accounts which are somewhat difficult to read. I have not yet put them together to check for gaps. The records were received from: Library and Archives Canada, Access To Information and Privacy, 395 Wellington street, Ottawa, ON , K1A 0N4. The request was made through the unit Orderly Room ( no cost), on 12 Oct 05, and mailed to me on 12 Jan 06.

The letter also stated the following: " Theses records are all that made up your file when it was transfered from DND to Library and Archives Canada for permanent custody. Please keep in mind that due to the lack of legislation governing record keeping practices prior to 1964, Militia records were often destroyed at the Unit or District level. even after that date Militia (Reserve Component ) service records in our custody have often proved to be incomplete."  Just curious,  anyone besides myself and BGen Petras go back that far?  All of my medical records are missing from the files for the period  1962 to 1986.

The letter also states; "Additional details relating to your pay while you were a member of the Canadian Armed Forces may be obtained in Department of National Defence bank DND PPE 858 Pay Records File. For this reason, you may wish to send a request to the Director, Access to Information and Privacy, National Defence Headquarters, Ottawa, On K1A 0K2, for their action and direct reply."

 

[Jonnyboy250]

so reservists are eligible for a pension if they call this number???
(2) DIRECT MEMBERS TO SEEK INFORMATION CONCERNING THE CF PENSION AND ACCESS
THROUGH THE DIRECTOR ACCOUNTS PROCESSING, PAY AND PENSIONS - PENSION SERVICES AT
1-800-267-0325, AND 

 

[Gunner]

http://www.forces.gc.ca/hr/dgcb/cfpmp/engraph/home_e.asp?sidesection=5

New CFPMP FAQs that discuss the reserve pension implementation as of March 2006.

 

[geo]

implementation of the reservist's 1.1 pension plan is deferred to March 07
until then - HQs are supposed to transfer everyone leaving to the Supp List...

 

[Rifleman62]

Also the Glossary has been updated. When viewing the FAQ's, be sure to click on "How This May Look", especially number 3 which gives an example of the I.1 pension (although I personally find it confusing). The new Powerpoint should be up within a month. The calculator will be on line in the fall (which ends 21 Dec, and it will not be up much, if any earlier). The buyback will be at the current contribution percentage ie it went up this year and will go up next year on 1 Jan 07. How is everyone enjoying accumulating the 7% compound interest on the buyback while waiting for the CIF date? If you owe $50,000, add $3500 in compound interest for each year delayed plus the interest on the interest every year. Delayed three years now? The Reserve Pension should have been in force 1/2 years after being enacted in 1999, rather than throwing it in with the CFPMP in 2002, which has caused delay after delay all costing compounded interest. The TARGET date for CIF is Mar 07. That does not mean it will CIF. Then it will take several months for each individual to have calculated by NDHQ the buyback and resulting pension ( based on hysterical results of a Reserve buying back P Res time upon joining the Reg F).

 

[geo]

Rifleman62....
Can imagine that there will be considerable grievances on the matter of compounded interest....... gonna keep the HQ Mil Inq sections going for quite some time

 

[Rifleman62]

Hello Geo,
My understanding (  I could be incorrect), is that the 7% compound interest was the give that DND gave to Treasury Board in the give and take negotiations, to enable buy back of all previous Reserve service. We are all aware that a Reserve can buy back all reserve service upon joining the Reg F, which is allowed in the CFSA, so why would Reserve pers NOT be allowed to buy back all their time in their own pension plan. Why did this have to be negotiated in the first place? The CFSA is written that all full time service under 90 days is only counted as quarter time (rip off!!), and that is still in effect even after amendments to the CFSA. The proposed buyback is all CL A days totaled; divided by 365; times 1.4; equals the number paid CF Service.
It is time we flood our MPs with letters of complaint, or at least have your beneficiary write a letter.

 

[dapaterson]

The interest rates are set by TB for all buy-backs; DND has no ability to negotiate them.

 

[Rifleman62]

DAP, you are closer to the pulse than I am. I am not disputing that Treasury Board sets the interest rates. My point is why compound interest on buy back? If you buy back P Res service upon joining the Reg F the buy back is calculated using actuary tables (Gender/age/life expectancy/etc) and you get a buy back amount. If you pay monthly over several years, you get charged interest like a loan. As far as I can find out, you are not charged compound interest anywhere in the equation.

 

[geo]

my only comment that might be a valid argument in a grievance has to do with the fact that, while the Reserve pension was announced for 05... then 06 and now 07....

Everyone acknowledges that the 1.1 pension is there and that retroactivity will apply BUT we'll be charged more interest at higher rates than would be the case otherwise.

 

[lostrover]

RFRG sounded good.............then the pension thingy..............got my medals wearing jeans, didn't have a uniform to wear them on,  been over 7 monthys since my release, still can't get a answer from anybody as to where in the puzzle my entitelments are, i couldn't care less about the RFRG or the pension...........my CF54/75 would be nice though, just my opinion..........the pension would have been nice but can the system actually make it work and administer it??  CFAO 15-2 states........."It is essential that the good and faithful service of a member departing a component of the CF on release be recognized..................."  hell one can get more recognition from fat girls...............oh yeah where is my watch from the mess???

 

[the 48th regulator]

Did you speak with your former OR about your RFRG? 

Alright Gang, today was the day...

I have officially released from the Queens Coffer's....

Ok here is the question.  Joined in 1988 decided to process out in 2002, due to the rarity of my file it has taken 4 years for me to clear....officeial release date is March 30th, 2006.  I have not paraded since 2002/03.

How do I calculate the Gratuity, so I get a rough idea what is coming to me?

don't want the process of going through the paperwork, already did all that just want to calculate what I will get from the man...

dileas

tess

 

[Gunner]

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/daod/5001/1_e.asp

more specifically the form

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/daod/5001/forms/form1_e.pdf

Tess, your gratuity should be calculated from 1988 to 2002, you will probably be deemed NES form 2002-2006 and those years of service will not be counted.  I say probably because I don't know why your released and the specifics of your rehabilitation of the wounds you sustained from UNPROFOR. 

Having qualified my opinion!  Your RFRG should be based on 14 years of service (+or- so many days based on your enrolement date) but this will give you an idea:

14 Years Service x 3.5 days pay per year of service x Sgt (IPC4 + 135.96) = $6,662.04

Pay Rates:

http://www.forces.gc.ca/dgcb/dppd/pay/engraph/NCMResFPayRate_e.asp?sidesection=3&sidecat=28

One of the very helpful RMS Clks we have on this site may be able to provide more detail.

 

[Gunner]

Tess, I thought that may be the case. 

Yes, that is my understanding and the DAOD certainly states exactly that.  Instead of 3.5 days, you are entitled to the full 7 per year of service, so you can double the amount. 

Not a large pot of gold for what you have gone through but every benefit counts.

Regards.

 

[kratz]

Tess,

Remember to have the RFRG payment rolled into an RRSP as it will be fully taxable at source otherwise.

 

[Rifleman62]

The 05 contribution rates are: 4% for everything YMPE and under; and 7.5% everything over YMPE. The contribution rates went up on 1 Jan 06, and will go up again in Jan 07 to 4.6% and 8.1%respectively. You buy back all your time at the contribution rates that are in effect at CIF. We will pay for the delay. Also add in 7% compound interest to 2007 for every year ( i.e 1962 to 2007/2008, or whatever ) you are buying back, we will pay for the delay. To buy back Reserve time now i.e. joining the Reg F is 4% simple interest.  I do not expect to get a " free" pension, but I do not expect to get ripped off, especially since this Reserve pension should have CIF a year or so after the 1999 legislation, not 05, 06, 07, 08 or whenever. One Army, One Team.

 

[geo]

Part I (Full-time Pension Plan):
+2006:  4.3% up to YMPE and 7.8% above YMPE
+2013:  6.4% up to YMPE and 8.4% above YMPE

Part I.1 (Reserve Force Pension Plan):
+2007:  4.3%
… phasing up to
+2010:  5.2%

+Start-up contribution rate requires Treasury Board confirmation

1% of pensionable earnings if the person has


ANNUITY:
+  Yearly amount is 1.5% of total pensionable earnings updated for wage growth

+BRIDGE BENEFIT:
+  0.5% of total updated pensionable earnings to the AMPE
+ Ceases at 65 or start of CPP/QPP disability

COST OF ELECTING PENSIONABLE EARNINGS FOR ANY CALENDAR YEAR
••Pensionable earnings of the calendar year updated to year of election, times
•Current contribution rate in year of election plus
•7% interest compounded annually from the middle of the year bought back to the date of the election


CALCULATION
•Pensionable earnings in 1999: $8,348
•Updated pensionable earnings from 1999 to 2007: $10,532
•Rate of contribution in 2007:  4.3%
•Interest to be added:  (1.07)8
MEMBERS COST TO BUY BACK  1999 PENSIONABLE EARNINGS
$10,532*.043*1.7182 = $778

+Members’ total cost is sum of the costs for all the years of past service

MEMBERS’ COST IN 2007 TO BUY BACK  ALL PENSIONABLE EARNINGS : $10,985

ESTIMATED TRANSFER VALUE ON RELEASE IN 2007: $32,500

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Well the last two posts made absolutely no sense to me. I guess, like everyone else, I'll have to hire some finacial SME at $100.00 an hour to explain it. Even if they've decided to give us a pension, they'll make it so difficult to understand and administer, few people will deal with it.

I've got 13 years Reg, without pension (return of contributions) and another 3 years B & C time, total 16 years. I've also got 15 years Class A time with the possibility of 8 more. Where do I stand?

How do I buy back all that time, at what cost, over how long, and at what percent?

 

[Gunner]

How do I buy back all that time, at what cost, over how long, and at what percent?

I hope you are paying into an RRSP because you will probably need somewhere around 80K to buy all that time back (note 80K is a WAG based on a colleague buying back Reserve Service after joining the Regs).  For Reservist to join Part 1.1, it will be an individual calculation as every single soldier has different earnings for each year of their service.  Depending on your age, you will have to decide if it is worth it to you to buy back a large amount of service.  Generally, it works to your favour, as Geo used as an example above:

MEMBERS’ COST IN 2007 TO BUY BACK  ALL PENSIONABLE EARNINGS : $10,985

ESTIMATED TRANSFER VALUE ON RELEASE IN 2007: $32,500

This is simple a transfer value for someone who elects to buy back service for Part 1.1 and release after paying the lump sum cost to buy back in.  In theory, they could transfer $10,985 from their RRSP, into their new pension plan.  After they released without the required time for an immediate pension or they did not want to take a deferred anuity at age 60, they elected to receive a transfer value of $32,500.  This sum would be transferred directly back into their RRSP. 

My take after reading the websites and the propaganda that has been released, is the Pension plan is an excellent plan for Reservists to take advantage of.  Unfortunately it has not been moved quickly through the bureaucracy....

As I mentioned many months ago, if you are not contributing to an RRSP right now, get your ass down to your bank and start investing in a low risk fund.  This accomplishes two things: First, it gets you in the habit of living with 5% less income and secondly, you begin accumulating funds for buying back your pension.

 

[kratz]

I agree with getting into the habit of saving. The largest benifit is having the funds to buy back your past TI.

As for getting used to living with 5% less income? Why? The missing 15% of RegF pay is the SDB (3%) and the money that the RegF are currently paying into the pension (12%). If a full-time, long term reservist is paying into the top level pension (55 months out of 60) and is doing the same job as the RegF beside him, why should the reservist's actual take home pay be worth less?

One step forward at a time, 27 years for 85% pay, 8 years (and counting) to a pension. How many years for the other 12% ?