QMI/Sun Media, 20 Mar 13A private member's bill that would strip citizenship from dual-nationals accused of treason hit roadblocks Tuesday, as expected.
Before the House committee on immigration, Tory MP Devinder Shory's Bill-425 encountered many of the challenges - constitutional and otherwise - legal experts had anticipated.
The bill proposes to remove citizenship from dual citizens who have "engaged in acts of war against the Canadian Forces" and also to expedite the citizenship process for permanent residents who've enlisted in the military.
Shory told the committee the catalyst for the bill was his belief Canadian citizenship is a privilege, not an inalienable right. Shory's conviction, however, may be at odds with the Constitution.
Opposition MPs questioned the "two-tier" citizenship system the bill would create and wondered how that would jive with Canada's being a signatory to the Geneva Convention, which dictates no person should be rendered stateless.
Also questioned was the wording of the bill, which at least one expert witness - Col. Michael Gibson of National Defence - said was "problematic."
Gibson said the term "acts of war" has not been part of the Canadian military or legal vernacular for about half a century. It's been replaced with "armed conflict" -- the term Gibson suggested using in the bill for the purposes of clarity and specificity ....
PuckChaser said:This makes sense, Trudeau wants terrorists to keep their citizenship,
Yes. It's better than letting them walk free in Canada continuing to plot ways to attack the west while living next door and collecting a government paycheck.Pusser said:That's a pretty gross over-simplification. I gather you would rather exile someone back to a place where they would be allowed to walk free and continue to plot ways to attrack the West?
Jarnhamar said:Yes. It's better than letting them walk free in Canada continuing to plot ways to attack the west while living next door and collecting a government paycheck.
PuckChaser said:You're not a second class citizen unless you were plotting to attack this country. I'm a first generation Canadian, and my immigrant father was more than happy to have convicted terrorists striped and booted because he valued so much what Canada has given him. The second class citizen thing is BS.
PuckChaser said:You're not a second class citizen unless you were plotting to attack this country. I'm a first generation Canadian, and my immigrant father was more than happy to have convicted terrorists striped and booted because he valued so much what Canada has given him. The second class citizen thing is BS.
Oldgateboatdriver said:If we can't strip them of the citizenship to deport them after they serve their time for any crime against the state, what have we got left as option? Release after their time in and spend millions in constant surveillance for the rest of their life?
Thucydides said:Getting back to the topic, most of the more recent crop of deserters were people who signed up for the pay and benefits offered by the US armed forces, but declined to carry out their part of the contract when they were activated or their units called up. Coming to Canada allows them to continue their parasitical lifestyle (get welfare or other benefits while in Canada), while not offering anything back. Taxpayers in both nations have a large enough burden without having to pay for even more freeloaders.
Regardless of our views of American foreign policy, military actions etc., this is essentially an issue between the American servicemember who knowingly signed a contract and the United States Government as the owner of the contract. (I make an exception for draftees, who did not voluntarily sign the contract). People who behave in this manner will offer nothing to our community; best to send them back ASAP.
Oldgateboatdriver said:Your examples don't pan out Pusser. Mass-muderers, child-molesters and jaywalkers ( ???) don't seek to enter the country and obtain the benefits of citizenship for the purpose of fighting against the state itself.
You state that we should instead be more discerning on who we let become citizens. But the very essence of "moles" is to have a verifiable cover that is a perfect veneer of probity. These people specifically sent to "acquire" citizenship and infiltrate society to fight it from within will meet every single requirement for citizenship and will be exemplary citizens until "activated" thereafter.
If we can't strip them of the citizenship to deport them after they serve their time for any crime against the state, what have we got left as option? Release after their time in and spend millions in constant surveillance for the rest of their life?
I swear (or affirm)
That I will be faithful
And bear true allegiance
To Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second
Queen of Canada
Her Heirs and Successors
And that I will faithfully observe
The laws of Canada
And fulfil my duties
As a Canadian citizen.
PuckChaser said:Lets just clear something up here.
By plotting/conducting an attack against Canada, you have not born true allegiance to HM QE2, or faithfully observed the laws of Canada. Your citizenship should be forfeit, as you have broken that oath, unless in removing your citizenship it renders you stateless.
Tcm621 said:It doesn't create 2 classes of citizens. It removes citizenship that should never have been granted. Anyone who becomes a Canadian citizen swears an oath that reads
"I swear (or affirm)
That I will be faithful
And bear true allegiance
To Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second
Queen of Canada
Her Heirs and Successors
And that I will faithfully observe
The laws of Canada
And fulfil my duties
As a Canadian citizen."
If it can be shown that a person became a citizen while plotting against the state, they lied on their oath and their citizenship is invalid. I think the bar should be pretty high but I think it should be on the table. It isn't revoking citizenship so much as it is annulling it due to false pretenses.
Chris Pook said:I have a bigger problem with the court decision that allows immigrants to lie when they swear that oath and then immediately forswear it after they have been accepted as a Canadian citizen. That demonstrates to me that they are untrustworty, unworthy and should be immediately deported.