Our North - SSE Policy Update Megathread

[lenaitch]

Going forward, Defence will explore ways and means of adapting our engagement approach so that more regular consultation contributes to better implementation of defence policy. We intend to continue these conversations on an enduring basis in order to collaboratively identify problems as they evolve, integrate diverse points of view, and develop new solutions in the years ahead.

That's some fine bureaucratic speechifying right there.

 

[GR66]

The best or the most interesting part I found was the idea of a sustained AFV commitment

Canada will explore establishing a light armoured vehicle production program to replenish our fleet while also enabling industry to invest in a sustainable defence production capacity to support Canada and our NATO allies.

Since we already have existing armoured vehicle production (of the literal "LAV") in London I'm guessing that they're talking about something else here.

My guess is they're looking at something like Roshel rather than new IFV's or other heavy vehicles.

The CAF - Preparing for yesterday's war tomorrow!

 

[FSTO]

Paul Wells

Shield issues

Sometimes the best offence is a long-overdue defence policy update

open.substack.com

Opening paragraph:

“On Monday Justin Trudeau published detailed thoughts about a key function of government that, in Canada, is a matter of exclusive federal jurisdiction. Also on Monday, the moon cast a daytime shadow over much of North America. One of these events was a rare and perplexing phenomenon you would be unwise to look at with unprotected eyes. The other was a solar eclipse.”

 

[suffolkowner]

Since we already have existing armoured vehicle production (of the literal "LAV") in London I'm guessing that they're talking about something else here.

My guess is they're looking at something like Roshel rather than new IFV's or other heavy vehicles.

The CAF - Preparing for yesterday's war tomorrow!

establishing a light armoured vehicle production program to replenish our fleet while also enabling industry to invest in a sustainable defence production capacity to support Canada and our NATO allies.

I took the above as being the important bit. Yes there is a factory but what is it going to do? Will GDLS-London have other customers than the CAF? The US? the Saudis?
GDLS-London may have to exist on Canadian purchases alone. It may have to expand into a tracked alternative? Are 1000 LAV's enough to keep it going with refits and new builds?
I dont know about Roshel it has its own competitors in Streit and Inkas in particular and I dont know what product niche they would fill in the CAF? Replacing the G-wagen?

 

[GR66]

I took the above as being the important bit. Yes there is a factory but what is it going to do? Will GDLS-London have other customers than the CAF? The US? the Saudis?
GDLS-London may have to exist on Canadian purchases alone. It may have to expand into a tracked alternative? Are 1000 LAV's enough to keep it going with refits and new builds?
I dont know about Roshel it has its own competitors in Streit and Inkas in particular and I dont know what product niche they would fill in the CAF? Replacing the G-wagen?

The product niche might just be Canadian industrial benefits (and related votes) rather than a clearly defined military capability

 

[suffolkowner]

The product niche might just be Canadian industrial benefits (and related votes) rather than a clearly defined military capability

I just dont see it or understand what would drive it. I guess one of Roshel/Streit/Inkas could partner with GM/Ford/Dodge/etc to deliver on the LUV replacement program and that might be worth sustaining. But I dont think Roshel originally submitted/requested on that

 

[Castus]

The product niche might just be Canadian industrial benefits (and related votes) rather than a clearly defined military capability

That's never happened before, and surely our professional, serious government would not apply such logic now.

 

[MilEME09]

Mark Norman weighs in

https://twitter.com/x/status/1777793419680559556

 

[Cloud Cover]

Most accurate summary came from him.
I was waiting for Mike Day to provide something insightful, but he just seemed to give it a shrug. Perhaps also accurate.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Mark Norman weighs in

https://twitter.com/x/status/1777793419680559556

So, a solid C+ then?

 

[McG]

Since we already have existing armoured vehicle production (of the literal "LAV") in London I'm guessing that they're talking about something else here.

My guess is they're looking at something like Roshel rather than new IFV's or other heavy vehicles.

The CAF - Preparing for yesterday's war tomorrow!

The key word is “program.” A production program does not mean a production line exists. It means we have a funded, continuous process to to have new LAV built (as opposed to our current system of running a project to get a defined quantity of LAV and then closing the project). So potentially an open ended commitment to keep new CA vehicles rolling off the London production line.

 

[Navy_Pete]

Today was interesting, no one is sure if this means we are actually getting some NP increases this year for ship maintenance to fund something like the massive shortfalls for the CPF DWP projects, or if it's just the budget getting 'increased' from the previous cut (so maybe a net zero or small increase). Or if it's actually some kind of accountant black magic for funding that was already known about on the books but not officially approved, like a half a billion dollar plus planned DWP.

Does seem like NICP buys are already blown the budget though a week into it, so may only be buying parts that come in with an HPR (which again, is why the min/max DRMIS levels are made up and don't matter) or from a mystery priority list no one knows who sets it or vets it. It's a good thing those buys are responsive and don't have 1 year+ lead time for contracting and delivery, and don't support things like DWP work, normal PM and expected CM for projected failures. Things generally become HPRs because we don't have parts on the shelf to start, and not because we didn't know it would need replaced.

Things like this directly contribute directly to attrition; you can fight through extra processes, dumb bureaucracy etc as long as there is a result at the end. If we can't buy parts at the ADM(Mat) level (again) do to funding cuts that kneecaps our entire job, and pretty dispiriting generally. On the ship side, it's frustrating to continually having to bypass and work around things instead of just fixing them and six months of freeze on NICP will have a 1-2 year tail on it even if they throw money at the problem later, as those workarounds usually just end up running other things into the ground.

Glad I'm posted, and feel bad for the team I'm leaving behind; this kind of stuff will set them back further and already way behind after a decade of bins not being filled. I'd be surprised if a few of the PS guys don't end up taking transfers to PMOs or other departments so they can actually do the job they are supposed to be doing. I think I'm going to try and finish out my career in purple jobs and see if I can recapture that sense of accomplishing something before I hit my 25 years and move on.

Here's hoping to a few ships per class getting tied up to become parts bins!

 

[Cloud Cover]

The key word is “program.” A production program does not mean a production line exists. It means we have a funded, continuous process to to have new LAV built (as opposed to our current system of running a project to get a defined quantity of LAV and then closing the project). So potentially an open ended commitment to keep new CA vehicles rolling off the London production line.

London can produce more than LAVs though.

 

[MilEME09]

So, a solid C+ then?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-blair-nato-defence-spending-eyre-recruitment-1.7168748

Interesting note within the article, CDS apparently wants to increase the reg force by 14,000 bit he and the MND agreed they need to deal with the current personal shortages first.

 

[McG]

London can produce more than LAVs though.

So what? The policy document says LAV. The given mandate is a LAV production program. GDLS could have the ability to build Gundam in London, but that doesn’t mean authority for DND to buy any.

 

[GR66]

As far as I'm concerned this document isn't worth the pixels it's displayed on. The PM's comments after the release indicate to me that he's simply mouthing words to deflect criticism from his almost criminal neglect of the CAF

Canada to seek to join AUKUS alliance, consider nuclear subs: PM

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau says Canada is exploring the possibility of joining the second phase of AUKUS, a U.S.-led alliance with the United Kingdom and Australia.

www.cp24.com

From the attached article:

Trudeau says Canada will consider whether it needs to purchase nuclear-powered submarines to better ensure it can defend Canadian sovereignty in the Arctic.

However the policy update specifically says:

Renew and Expand Submarine Fleet​

• We will explore options for renewing and expanding our submarine fleet to enable the Royal Canadian Navy to project a persistent deterrent on all three coasts, with under-ice capable, conventionally powered submarines.

Trudeau also claims:

Canada is exploring the possibility of joining the second phase of AUKUS, a U.S.-led alliance with the United Kingdom and Australia.

While on the very same day Australian PM Albanase stated:

there were no plans to add a fourth member to the pact at a news conference called hours after the AUKUS defence ministers announced they would consider working with Japan on military technology projects.

Furthermore the article goes on to state:

While the U.S. has previously raised the possibility of involving other nations, including Japan and New Zealand, expanding the pact faces hurdles from strict U.S. restrictions on sharing technology and hesitation in other capitals.

Canberra worries adding a fourth country to the alliance would complicate and take attention away from the already difficult task of acquiring nuclear-powered submarines, according to a diplomatic source.

So no mention of even the consideration of Canada joining AUKUS by Australia or the USA, yet Trudeau claims "Canada is exploring the posibility of joining the second phase of AUKUS"? Who's he exploring it with? His navel? Because clearly he's not exploring it with the members of AUKUS.

 

[daftandbarmy]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-blair-nato-defence-spending-eyre-recruitment-1.7168748

Interesting note within the article, CDS apparently wants to increase the reg force by 14,000 bit he and the MND agreed they need to deal with the current personal shortages first.

Simple... open up opportunities for troops to transfer in from the ARes.

No need to thank me

 

[FJAG]

As far as I'm concerned this document isn't worth the pixels it's displayed on. The PM's comments after the release indicate to me that he's simply mouthing words to deflect criticism from his almost criminal neglect of the CAF

There's some indication there that they are at least mouthing the words about some things that the week before they didn't even know existed. Judging by the universal reviews in the media, he failed dismally in deflecting any criticism.

Simple... open up opportunities for troops to transfer in from the ARes.

No need to thank me

And then greatly strengthen the ARes. The ARes is a proven recruiting base. One little step - design the key ARes DP1 courses so that they are equivalents of their RegF counterpart. That makes componenet transfers at the junior levels much easier and also provides a more knowledgeable augmentation base.

But I've been here before.

 

[Cloud Cover]

So what? The policy document says LAV. The given mandate is a LAV production program. GDLS could be have the ability to build Gundam in London, but that doesn’t mean authority for DND to buy any.

My primary point is that if the Feds want to keep a plant open for the purpose of continuously building armoured vehicles, the GDLS plant has produced vehicles such as MRAPs between LAV serials and sometimes even concurrently. The secondary is that it appears the army does require more than 1 type of vehicle in continuous production otherwise only LAV would be kept current and the rest of the “fleets” continue to exist in large, unconnected acquisitions that simply end (such as TAPV) until a replacement is required. It’s noteworthy that Oshkosh offered to have a continuously producing plant in London as part of their failed bid for TAPV (alongside the LMI plant).

I would note though that the LAV is simply a code word for jobs in London, where the Libs are in danger of losing all of their seats. They really don’t care if the army has an endless supply of any vehicles, they just want to hold onto the bastion in SWO.

 

[OldSolduer]

It’s all part of that pesky leadership thing. Know your troops and promote their welfare. The CO and at least the Adjutant should have insight on MELs etc

Why does the CoC need access to health records?