OCdt's vs. Senior NCO's Qualifications

[xo31@711ret]

Sounds like a an inexperienced, recently promoted master-jack on a power trip.I've always been taught / believed that if a subordinate (or what have you) frack's up, take him / her aside first, 'discuss' the who / what / why etc and take the appropiate action / corrective trg required to rectify any short-comings.  Gone are the days of screaming and belittling an individaul in front of his / her peers (or worse future subordinates). ( I still believe for example, on a parade square yelling at a troop to 'get it together' is fine, but I never believed 'name - callling' ever properly trained a soldior - it embarasses him / her in front of his peers: as a well-oiled machine / team there is no place for it: you are as strong as your weakest link). As NCO's it is our job, no RESPONSIBILITY  to help train and guide these future leaders (and our subordinate) with our knowledge and experiences. After their officier trg, it becomes our responsibility to offer sound advice / recommendations to our platoon / troop etc commanders. Any commander worth his salt will take any advice offered by his NCO's and and decide to work it into his / her overall plan. Any commander who blantently ignores the adive of his experienced NCO's ("I'm an officier mentality...") is in my book, an idiot. But the final decision is their's to make. If the platoon fails their objective, the burden of responsibilty lies with the commander (use to see a lot of 2LT's / LT's who somehow always ended up doing base duty officier every second night for a couple of weeks). If the platoon does great, a good portion of accolades fall onto the commander: nature of the beast.
Just a personal thought / thinking ahead, as a 1 hook pte, I remember a young 2LT in London (1RCR) who is now a Brig Gen.: might be good to reflect that one can possibly have friends in high places in the future !  ;D

Just my 'long-in-the-tooth' 2 cents worth
-gerry

 

[Danjanou]

Naah he was way out of his lanes there. I’d wager he’s a brand new M/Cpl with the sheen still on his leaf and full of piss and vinegar.

To draw another Officer  NCO parallel I often found a newly minted M/Cpl is often similar to a new 2/Lt in terms of both experience/expertise and attitude (ok maybe not so much the experience side of the house but you see my point). Both are on the first rung of the leadership ladder and still learning to navigate it. By the time you’ve reached Capt or Sgt/WO you should have outgrown that, or maybe you shouldn’t have made it that far.

Good point on the course atmosphere being different. I remember teaching on a old MITCIP Blk 4,5,6 in Aldershot and having to subtly remind some of the “young gentlemen” that in Leadership Company there were only two ranks “staff” and “students.”  They were addressed by their proper ranks by moi and the other D/S but they had their heels locked together when we were doing it as it should be. Funny though IIRC the ones who gave us the most grief were a clique of ex M/Cpls who took Commissions including an old buddy of mine, and fellow Oatmeal Savage, who should have known better.

Interesting thread and I’m sure all the old dinosaur Sgt and Warrant types on here have at least one horror story about the wet behind the ears full of his self importance new platoon/troop commander we were issued with by the OC., and his subsequent up commence. They are oft told tales at the BS table in any mess.

Mind most of us also have memories of new junior officers who came in with the right attitude, listened, learned, got the job done and went on to bigger and better things too.

Edit: I type slow I see two others beat me to the punch on the M/pl. Don't worry what goes arounf comes around. He'll have his heels locked together sooner rather than later saying "yes Warrant... no Warrant."  8)

 

[Quag]

I really enjoy hearing these personal stories.

These really give me hints, tips and tricks as to what to avoid doing, and what to actually do, when I start as a "wet behind the ears" Trp. Leader next year.

I want to thank everyone again who has taken the time to share with me their experiences and wealth of knowledge.

~Quag

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Being a junior officer is difficult.  You're a relatively unknown quantity.  It is easy to screw up if you go at it the wrong way.

Your Tp WO won't want to see you fail unless you give him plenty of reasons.  If you are able, spend the first few months sussing the place out.  He will guide you.  Don't sweat it when you screw up.  Its expected.  Your Tp WO will no doubt call you aside for some counselling from time to time.  Take the time to learn.

Stick together with your fellow subbies. 

Cheers,

2B

 

[geo]

Believe it or not.... the Tp WO WANTS to make you look good!
(unless, of course, you've given him grounds for him to rethnk the relationship)

 

[paracowboy]

Believe it or not.... the Tp WO WANTS to make you look good!

in fact, he wants you to BE good. The sooner you get the hang of your duties, the less extra work he has to do, and the more secure he is in his mind that you won't get him dead.  He's starting to look forward to retirement, fishing, golfing, playing with grandkids.  ;D

 

[ArmyRick]

I look at new officers (as platoon commanders) in an infantry platoon similar to Mike Corleone when he took over the family at the end of "the godfather". As platoon commander, you are the "don" but an inexpirienced one. So you have your "consigliare" (the platoon WO) and your "cappo-regime" (Section commanders). You really should listen heavily to their advice. Disregarding good NCO and WO advice can be an embarrassment or worse a career killer. 

HOWEVER no MCPL has any place bringing you to the chow unless he is an instructor on your courses (and even then when i deal with officers as candidates I still refer to them as "sir", even while they are doing push ups).

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Great analogy!

I found as a BC that the Tp WOs were quite protective of their Tp Ldrs.  As a Tp Ldr, my Tp WO saved me on a number of occasions, usually from myself.

As a junior officer you should be respectful when dealing with the "staff" at the various places in the unit and around the base, but by the same token they should be respectful of you.  Heck, that goes for everybody!  We have real enemies to worry about.

 

[paracowboy]

Is it proper for an OCdt. to come to attention to speak to a MCpl. (PRes.) at a reserve unit on a parade night.  I had to go to the reserve unit last night to settle some claims, and a MCpl. told me to come to attention and repeat his rank after everything I said. 

Sounds like some unit needs a refresher on protocol. And it sounds like someone carrying an APPOINTMENT needs some explanation on how the rank structure works, as well as how to apply the Principles of Leadership. Where did this happen, anyway? Anywhere near Edmonton? You can respond via pm if you don't want to embarrass the unit.