New Canadian Shipbuilding Strategy

[Prairie canuck]

I heard the are cutting the San Antonio's short too, also would be a good buy for us

At over $2 billion per... As a comparison Australia bought the RFA Largs Bay from Britain for about $170 million Canadian $. Not sure on the cost of modifications. (needs a permanent helicopter hangar imo)
But the San Antonio would certainly fit the role of big honkin ship...

 

[TacticalTea]

The Whitbeys and Harpers would need a (major?) refit but then it could keep Davie busy for a while. Get new capability and keep Quebec happy....
only if the LCACs come with them.

Distribution of Federal Revenues and Expenditures by Province*

Quebec falls below the national average in Federal spending per capita.

Please stop spreading divisive myths. This is not Facebook, nor is it Army.prairies.

 

[Maxman1]

At over $2 billion per... As a comparison Australia bought the RFA Largs Bay from Britain for about $170 million Canadian $. Not sure on the cost of modifications. (needs a permanent helicopter hangar imo)
But the San Antonio would certainly fit the role of big honkin ship...

The Mistrals offer the same or more capabilities at a fraction of the cost and crew requirements. In fact, they approach the capabilities of the Wasp and America class amphibious assault ships.

Even the Cavour is cheaper.

 

[Underway]

View attachment 69873

Distribution of Federal Revenues and Expenditures by Province*

Quebec falls below the national average in Federal spending per capita.

Please stop spreading divisive myths. This is not Facebook, nor is it Army.prairies.

Their comment was related to getting votes in Quebec ridings (like all ship building contracts), not regarding fairness/equity of government spending. Please read the words on the page, not what you think the words on the page said.

Moving on...

Can't just "buy an LPD" with no plan. there needs to be a plan to develop units for amphibious warfare and to get the equipment they need for that warfare. That's a 10 year commitment. And of course if its going to take 10 years why would I buy an old LPD. Get one a bit newer thanks.

 

[FSTO]

Their comment was related to getting votes in Quebec ridings, not regarding fairness/equity of government spending. Please read the words on the page, not what you think the words on the page said.

Moving on...

Can't just "buy an LPD" with no plan. there needs to be a plan to develop units for amphibious warfare and to get the equipment they need for that warfare. That's a 10 year commitment. And of course if its going to take 10 years why would I buy an old LPD. Get one a bit newer thanks.

And we'd need a complete rethink of our foreign and defence policy to justify such a capability. I don't think adjusting our Foreign and Defence policy is in our national wheelhouse right now (if ever).

 

[Czech_pivo]

And we'd need a complete rethink of our foreign and defence policy to justify such a capability. I don't think adjusting our Foreign and Defence policy is in our national wheelhouse right now (if ever).

Lol, we can't even define our current set of priorities for Foreign Affairs or Defence, let alone create new ones.

 

[KevinB]

Sentinel-class cutter - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

USCG but seems to tick a lot of the boxes, and over 60 built and current production.

Plus it's made down here by your friendly neighbor

 

[Halifax Tar]

Sentinel-class cutter - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

USCG but seems to tick a lot of the boxes, and over 60 built and current production.

Plus it's made down here by your friendly neighbor

Is the estimated endurance long enough ?

 

[Underway]

Sentinel-class cutter - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

USCG but seems to tick a lot of the boxes, and over 60 built and current production.

Plus it's made down here by your friendly neighbor

There are a lot of boats in that size range out on the market. Certainly lots of options to look at.

Edit: wrote that before I looked at the cutter. It's 360 tonnes 50m long. Smaller than the current MCDV's by quite a bit. The RCN looks like it wants to go bigger (1200-2000 ton range) for seakeeping, range, extra bunks, and diversity of payload. Which also has a lot of ships in that size range on the market.

 

[KevinB]

Is the estimated endurance long enough ?

I don't know enough about Naval matters to say -- it also has a rear entry way which may make a towed array non viable.
I suspect one could get a bunch of the for the price point though to make them more viable.

 

[TacticalTea]

Their comment was related to getting votes in Quebec ridings (like all ship building contracts), not regarding fairness/equity of government spending. Please read the words on the page, not what you think the words on the page said.

Except he specifically said Quebec, not ''Local MP'' or ''Riding this-or-that''. So it seems like you're the one reading too much into this than there really is?

At any rate, the side comment about one of Canada's provinces contributes little and adds to a common discourse bordering on conspiracy theory according to which the federal govt is somehow subservient to Quebec, which I've seen echoed multiple times on this website without any opposition. It seemed appropriate to offer a dissenting voice.

 

[Weinie]

Except he specifically said Quebec, not ''Local MP'' or ''Riding this-or-that''. So it seems like you're the one reading too much into this than there really is?

At any rate, the side comment about one of Canada's provinces contributes little and adds to a common discourse bordering on conspiracy theory according to which the federal govt is somehow subservient to Quebec, which I've seen echoed multiple times on this website without any opposition. It seemed appropriate to offer a dissenting voice.

Ummmm. I’m leaning towards giving you some credence on this topic and Underways’ support of an earlier comment. The machinations that Federal governments have undergone in the last 50 years in Canada supports and disputes both of your arguments. Welcome/Bienvenue to/au Canada.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Sentinel-class cutter - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

USCG but seems to tick a lot of the boxes, and over 60 built and current production.

Plus it's made down here by your friendly neighbor

Slightly bigger version of our "Hero Class Coast Guard Cutters" Not the most fun boats to be on in a heavy sea, I served on a 95' cutter and we damm near got laid on our side in a storm south west of the Charlottes during a SAR call, we wondered if she was coming back up.

 

[Swampbuggy]

There are a lot of boats in that size range out on the market. Certainly lots of options to look at.

Edit: wrote that before I looked at the cutter. It's 360 tonnes 50m long. Smaller than the current MCDV's by quite a bit. The RCN looks like it wants to go bigger (1200-2000 ton range) for seakeeping, range, extra bunks, and diversity of payload. Which also has a lot of ships in that size range on the market.

I believe this is another iteration of the Damen Stan patrol vessel that the HERO class is based on. I'm not certain there's too much appetite for another kick at that can, though as Kevin B points out earlier, they're probably cheap to build and could be produced in big numbers.

 

[KevinB]

I believe this is another iteration of the Damen Stan patrol vessel that the HERO class is based on. I'm not certain there's too much appetite for another kick at that can, though as Kevin B points out earlier, they're probably cheap to build and could be produced in big numbers.

It is, it’s a bigger version and a bigger version of the earlier US revision.

It’s smaller than I would think one might want for some tasks, but 22+2 crew and 28+Kts a 25mm and 4x M2 .50’s it seems fairly decent for patrol armaments

 

[Maxman1]

Basically a larger, armed version of the Orcas.

Another idea would be a steel version of the Elco 80' PT boat, with multiple .50s, side roll-off launchers for the Mark 48, a Bushmaster 25mm on the bow, and either a Bofors 40mm or Mark 32 launcher at the stern. For shorter patrols that don't require a boat that large.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Basically a larger, armed version of the Orcas.

Another idea would be a steel version of the Elco 80' PT boat, with multiple .50s, side roll-off launchers for the Mark 48, a Bushmaster 25mm on the bow, and either a Bofors 40mm or Mark 32 launcher at the stern. For shorter patrols that don't require a boat that large.

You do realize that a Mk48 torpedo is a submarine launched torpedo, right? And one does not just “roll it off“ a PT boat doing 40kts?

 

[GK .Dundas]

You do realize that a Mk48 torpedo is a submarine launched torpedo, right? And one does not just “roll it off“ a PT boat doing 40kts?

I'd love to see someone try it though
Could be rather "entertaining "to watch

 

[OldSolduer]

Just a question from a crayon eater - red ones please - can we not just contract a US shipyard to build us stuff?

As long as PQ gets to build something - industrial benefits etc - is that viable?

 

[Halifax Tar]

Basically a larger, armed version of the Orcas.

Another idea would be a steel version of the Elco 80' PT boat, with multiple .50s, side roll-off launchers for the Mark 48, a Bushmaster 25mm on the bow, and either a Bofors 40mm or Mark 32 launcher at the stern. For shorter patrols that don't require a boat that large.

Minus the fantasy Mk48 torp a whole bunch of those are what's needed to Op Caribe. MGBs.