Medical release vs retention?

[Nemo205]

I was wondering if many people have any experience with this.

I was injured in a previous trade and transferred to a lighter trade so I can stay in. However ongoing pain, surgeons prognosis of ongoing pain, have triggered a PCAT.

I am trying to figure out where I sit and what’s going to happen to me as it seems pretty unclear. I (likely) have breached UoS but guess I won’t know for sure until my PCAT is finalized.

My main question is.. if I can work in my current trade, but have breached UoS will it be a medical release or Is there a chance they will try to retain me?

I know no one knows the answer but I’m stumped because I’ve heard that they’re getting more relaxed with the UoS but also have heard that soldier first… breach UoS and you’re out. Anyone have any experience with this?

And then additionally, if it is a medical release my BPSO officer said that I can go to school through ssip funding, but I looked at the ssisp education funding and they have it worded as if they’ll only pay if it expands your current education rather than starting in a new career field, anyone know if sissp will pay for a new field?

 

[brihard]

And then additionally, if it is a medical release my BPSO officer said that I can go to school through ssip funding, but I looked at the ssisp education funding and they have it worded as if they’ll only pay if it expands your current education rather than starting in a new career field, anyone know if sissp will pay for a new field?

That’s SISIP Vocational Rehabilitation. And yeah, you don’t necessarily get what you want with that from what I’ve heard.

I don’t know how much service you have. If education is of interest to you, consider whether retention would get you over either the 6 or 12 years of service thresholds that would let you later use the VAC Education and Training Benefit. That one is much more open to whatever you might want to do.

 

[Nemo205]

That’s SIDIP Vocational Rehabilitation. And yeah, you don’t necessarily get what you want with that from what I’ve heard.

I don’t know how much service you have. If education is of interest to you, consider whether retention would get you over either the 6 or 12 years of service thresholds that would let you later use the VAC Education and Training Benefit. That one is much more open to whatever you might want to do.

Thanks for the reply. That’s what I’ve heard too about the vrpsm, I’m taking ILP for the career I want to get into if I release so I’m not sure if they’ll consider that as a new career field since it’s unrelated to my actual trade lol.

But yeah I have time in so I have money from vac either way, was just hoping to potentially double dip if I took the vrpsm route first and then if I decided I wanted to go back to school later on again fall back on the VAC education funding

But I guess it all depends what happens with my pcat

 

[brihard]

Thanks for the reply. That’s what I’ve heard too about the vrpsm, I’m taking ILP for the career I want to get into if I release so I’m not sure if they’ll consider that as a new career field since it’s unrelated to my actual trade lol.

But yeah I have time in so I have money from vac either way, was just hoping to potentially double dip if I took the vrpsm route first and then if I decided I wanted to go back to school later on again fall back on the VAC education funding

But I guess it all depends what happens with my pcat

It sounds like you have a plan, and a very good grasp of what your options are. Good luck!

 

[Zoomie]

If your PCAT MELs breach UoS, you can be offered a Period of Retention to April 2025. They are redefining UoS in the meantime - if you are still in breach under new criteria, you will be released under 3(b). Essentially the new UoS will lower the bar on medical requirements, however will also change policy so as to not permit POR files to exist.

 

[Nemo205]

If your PCAT MELs breach UoS, you can be offered a Period of Retention to April 2025. They are redefining UoS in the meantime - if you are still in breach under new criteria, you will be released under 3(b). Essentially the new UoS will lower the bar on medical requirements, however will also change policy so as to not permit POR files to exist.

Sorry what is a POR file? Person on retention ?

 

[lenaitch]

If your PCAT MELs breach UoS, you can be offered a Period of Retention to April 2025. They are redefining UoS in the meantime - if you are still in breach under new criteria, you will be released under 3(b). Essentially the new UoS will lower the bar on medical requirements, however will also change policy so as to not permit POR files to exist.

I don't know how helpful this third-party anecdote is, but a friend of ours was going to be released for a medical condition that impacted UofS. He appealed through whatever channels and while the process was playing out his career was on hold; no courses, promotions or postings. He was finally told 'all is good, they are revising UofS that will cover him'. He got his courses, a promotion and posting across the country. Felt comfortable enough to start a family. He was there about 6 months and received a notice of release.

 

[Nemo205]

I don't know how helpful this third-party anecdote is, but a friend of ours was going to be released for a medical condition that impacted UofS. He appealed through whatever channels and while the process was playing out his career was on hold; no courses, promotions or postings. He was finally told 'all is good, they are revising UofS that will cover him'. He got his courses, a promotion and posting across the country. Felt comfortable enough to start a family. He was there about 6 months and received a notice of release.

Thanks for the input. Do you know if his medical restrictions limited his ability to perform his actual job? Or was it mostly just the UoS ?

 

[brihard]

Thanks for the input. Do you know if his medical restrictions limited his ability to perform his actual job? Or was it mostly just the UoS ?

I’d want to know how long ago that was, too. My understanding is there have been some policy changes.

 

[Zoomie]

Each trade has its own medical standard - if you breach those standards DMCA 2 will look at your file and conduct an Admin Review. As long as you don’t breach UoS, they may come back and recommend retention with restrictions or COT is staffed. If you breach UoS, you can request a Period of Retention, but ultimately it will lead to a 3(b) release. Everyone, right now, has a break from being released until April 2025.

 

[lenaitch]

Thanks for the input. Do you know if his medical restrictions limited his ability to perform his actual job? Or was it mostly just the UoS ?

No to my knowledge. He was RCAF (non-flying), electronics/screen-staring-at type of trade. He became diabetic and the issue the way I understand it was deployability since insulin needs to be refrigerated.

I’d want to know how long ago that was, too. My understanding is there have been some policy changes.

He was released in 2021. I don't recall when the whole process started; it did drag out for a couple of years. There might have been more steps available to him in the process but he finally gave up. He had endured a number of years fighting an employer who clearly no longer want him. He is currently finishing out whatever paid educational release benefit he was eligible for.

 

[captloadie]

Each trade has its own medical standard - if you breach those standards DMCA 2 will look at your file and conduct an Admin Review. As long as you don’t breach UoS, they may come back and recommend retention with restrictions or COT is staffed. If you breach UoS, you can request a Period of Retention, but ultimately it will lead to a 3(b) release. Everyone, right now, has a break from being released until April 2025.

This is different then how I was hearing the new CANFORGEN will be applied. My understanding was that career shops were being told the Periods of Retention were going to be much more difficult to get approved between now and Apr 2025. I was part of the process that was looking at the new UoS changes 3 years ago, and the changes they were considering then were quite minor, and would likely have not allowed the CAF to both retain individuals who for the most part were employable and continue to use the current Charter exemption. I do hope that the work being done now will allow greater flexibility and allow more fairness in the system.

I had always hoped that they would expand the CAF to either include a new Class of Reserve Service with a different set of UoS, or expand the current regulations applied to the Rangers so we could transfer mbrs who breach UoS to that model.

 

[ModlrMike]

One of the primary missions of the Reserve Force is to generate personnel ready to augment the Regular Force. Transfering people to the Reserves who are unemployable in the Regular Force does not contribute to that mission.

 

[Furniture]

My understanding was that career shops were being told the Periods of Retention were going to be much more difficult to get approved between now and Apr 2025.

That was my understanding based on the CANFORGEN as well. I also suspect that it has to do with justifying UoS , because the current policy of retaining people essentially tells the courts that the CAF doesn't actually require UoS for all of it's pers.

I think a better solution than moving people to a new ResF type, would be allowing the creation of short term civy DND contracts to shift people into. As an example, if I was to become injured and then breech of UoS due to a PCat, the CAF could offer me a two year civy contract to do my current job, until occupation numbers increased, and they had a new PO 1/WO to fill my spot.

It would allow the member to start the transition out of the CAF, while still remaining part of a familiar team. It would also help the CAF retain the expertise of members, while they train the next generation of replacements.

 

[Staff Weenie]

A Period of Retention (PoR) is only possible if you meet several conditions. First off, you must be employable within your Medical Employment Limitations (MEL). Typically, if you can work a standard 40 hour week in an office setting without breaching your MELs it opens the door to consider a PoR. Next, the Career Manager needs to consider whether you can continue to be employed in your current unit/position. At certain rank/MOSID that isn't too hard - for example, there are typically a number of vacant Cpl HRA positions on every Base/Wing these days. However if you are an Infantry Sergeant, it becomes a bit harder. Sometimes the Career Manager also needs a position to use for promotion/posting of somebody else, so they can't offer you retention in your current location as they had planned on bringing somebody else in. In very rare cases, I have seen a Career Manager post somebody and retain them - i.e. posted from Cold Lake to Edmonton to be closer to family, and retained. Sometimes the Career Managers can find a generic position on a Base/Wing that is vacant and post you in for the duration of your PoR - they often need to negotiate this with another Career Manager. Right now, if you can work 40 hours per week, it is in your favour as the CAF is ~10,000 persons short, and there are vacancies everywhere.

For your future plans - get yourself in to the nearest Transition Centre. They can advise you on all of your options.

 

[Jarnhamar]

I thought I heard the CAF is looking at reducing how long injured people are held in the military waiting to get released after 2025. Some people have gone on 6+ years waiting, including appointments only MELs or MELs where they can't go on base/be near anyone in uniform.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Here is the latest CANFORGEN, sorry the app won’t let me copy paste text.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I’m a bit curious about this as I thought the CAF was moving to a more forgiving policy for mbrs who were on MELs that breached UoS. We have a personnel shortage situation and now won’t retain members who are employable but not deployable, even if those people aren’t needed to deploy. I’m not sure this is the best timing for this policy to kick in.

 

[Chargersfan]

Funny, I’ve wanted to get my 3b and move on for a long long time…2 1/2 years on TCat is ridiculous….

 

[MJP]

I thought I heard the CAF is looking at reducing how long injured people are held in the military waiting to get released after 2025. Some people have gone on 6+ years waiting, including appointments only MELs or MELs where they can't go on base/be near anyone in uniform.

While those are likely the outliers, the medical and admin review systems are slow and and unwieldly beasts. Any move to get folks the proper treatment and reduce the burden on the institution is welcome news.