Ottawa proposes detainee deal
Liberals admit limitations of Geneva Conventions: In talks with U.S. about special tribunals to divide terrorists from prisoners of war
Robert Fife, Ottawa Bureau Chief and Sheldon Alberts
National Post, with files from The Associated Press
OTTAWA - Canada is negotiating with the United States to set up tribunals to determine whether prisoners being held in Afghanistan and Cuba are terrorists or legitimate prisoners of war, John Manley, the Deputy Prime Minister, said yesterday.
The Chrétien government also signalled, for the first time, that Canada believes the Geneva Conventions might be out of date and do not properly cover the treatment of "unlawful combatants" such as the al-Qaeda terrorists who planned the Sept. 11 attacks.
Mr. Manley said that in recent days Canada has held discussions with the Americans to establish a legal process -- either a civilian or military tribunal -- to distinguish whether some of the captured fighters are POWs or terrorists.
Art Eggleton, the Defence Minister, discussed the issue with Donald Rumsfeld, the U.S. Secretary of Defence, last week.
"The fundamental principle is this: Do the Geneva Conventions apply? Everybody agrees on that and that hasn‘t changed," Mr. Manley said.
"Is there a process for determining who is a prisoner of war and who is an unlawful combatant? We need to be satisfied on that. It only really came into doubt in recent days and we are working with the United States to try to make sure that we see eye to eye on it. Does it require a civilian court or even a court martial proceeding [or] does it require some tribunal process that meets the requirements [of the convention]. That‘s what we seek to be satisfied on."
The United States calls the detainees "unlawful combatants" and says there is nothing for a court to consider.
"We are not going to call them prisoners of war," said George W. Bush, the U.S. President. "These are killers, these are terrorists, they know no countries." But, stung by criticism from European governments and human rights groups, he said he would further study the issue.
The United States has faced international protest, including some in Canada from backbench Liberal and Opposition MPs, over its treatment of almost 160 al-Qaeda suspects in custody at Camp X-Ray in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. Another 300 are being detained in Afghanistan.
Under the plan proposed by Canada, detainees judged to be prisoners of war would be entitled to full protection under the 1949 Geneva Conventions -- a set of rules on the conduct of warfare, designed to protect civilians and wounded or captured fighters.
Under the proposed rules, the detained fighters would be protected from detailed interrogation and be required only to provide basic information to their captors, like their name, rank and serial number.
U.S. officials fear this might prevent them from interrogating the captives to learn about any future terrorist plots.
If any of the prisoners are determined by a tribunal to be terrorists, they would fall outside the legal protections provided to captured uniformed members of armed forces.
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February 5, 2002
Ottawa proposes detainee deal
Liberals admit limitations of Geneva Conventions: In talks with U.S. about special tribunals to divide terrorists from prisoners of war
Robert Fife, Ottawa Bureau Chief and Sheldon Alberts
National Post, with files from The Associated Press
OTTAWA - Canada is negotiating with the United States to set up tribunals to determine whether prisoners being held in Afghanistan and Cuba are terrorists or legitimate prisoners of war, John Manley, the Deputy Prime Minister, said yesterday.
The Chrétien government also signalled, for the first time, that Canada believes the Geneva Conventions might be out of date and do not properly cover the treatment of "unlawful combatants" such as the al-Qaeda terrorists who planned the Sept. 11 attacks.
Mr. Manley said that in recent days Canada has held discussions with the Americans to establish a legal process -- either a civilian or military tribunal -- to distinguish whether some of the captured fighters are POWs or terrorists.
Art Eggleton, the Defence Minister, discussed the issue with Donald Rumsfeld, the U.S. Secretary of Defence, last week.
"The fundamental principle is this: Do the Geneva Conventions apply? Everybody agrees on that and that hasn‘t changed," Mr. Manley said.
"Is there a process for determining who is a prisoner of war and who is an unlawful combatant? We need to be satisfied on that. It only really came into doubt in recent days and we are working with the United States to try to make sure that we see eye to eye on it. Does it require a civilian court or even a court martial proceeding [or] does it require some tribunal process that meets the requirements [of the convention]. That‘s what we seek to be satisfied on."
The United States calls the detainees "unlawful combatants" and says there is nothing for a court to consider.
"We are not going to call them prisoners of war," said George W. Bush, the U.S. President. "These are killers, these are terrorists, they know no countries." But, stung by criticism from European governments and human rights groups, he said he would further study the issue.
The United States has faced international protest, including some in Canada from backbench Liberal and Opposition MPs, over its treatment of almost 160 al-Qaeda suspects in custody at Camp X-Ray in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. Another 300 are being detained in Afghanistan.
Under the plan proposed by Canada, detainees judged to be prisoners of war would be entitled to full protection under the 1949 Geneva Conventions -- a set of rules on the conduct of warfare, designed to protect civilians and wounded or captured fighters.
Under the proposed rules, the detained fighters would be protected from detailed interrogation and be required only to provide basic information to their captors, like their name, rank and serial number.
U.S. officials fear this might prevent them from interrogating the captives to learn about any future terrorist plots.
If any of the prisoners are determined by a tribunal to be terrorists, they would fall outside the legal protections provided to captured uniformed members of armed forces.
The International Committee of the Red Cross, a neutral Swiss-run agency, insists the Guantanamo detainees be given POW status at least until a court considers the issue.
The capture of three suspected al-Qaeda fighters by Canadian forces in Afghanistan on Jan. 21 -- and their immediate handover to the American military -- has brought Ottawa under new pressure to intervene with the United States about their treatment.
Canada has accepted U.S. assurances the detainees are being treated humanely.
Meanwhile, Mr. Eggleton and Bill Graham, the Minister of Foreign Affairs, said the 53-year-old Geneva Conventions did not envision the threat posed by modern terrorists, who do not adhere to any conventional rules of warfare and have vowed to continue killing American civilians.
The Geneva Conventions "were written at an earlier time," Mr. Eggleton said. "Not all of them are easily applicable to the conditions that exist today."
Mr. Graham said the Sept. 11 hijackers, for example, would never have been classified as prisoners of war if they had been thwarted in their mission to destroy the Pentagon and World Trade Center towers.
"I think it is fair to say that the Geneva Conventions were not drafted with this type of situation in mind. That is not to say they don‘t apply. But it does mean we have to look at them in a certain light," Mr. Graham said.
"I think there would have to be more clarity as to what is the nature of nonconventional warfare?"
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