India (Superthread)

[a_majoor]

Why "negotiating" on climate change is pointless:

http://www.the-american-interest.com/2015/12/03/india-decries-the-wests-carbon-imperialism/

India Decries the West’s “Carbon Imperialism”

U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry labeled India the biggest “challenge” in the way of negotiators trying to hammer out a Global Climate Treaty (GCT) in Paris, and predictably his comments didn’t go over well in the south Asian nation. The Telegraph reports:

…Mr Kerry’s “challenge” comment was received with fury in New Delhi. Officials here are quick to point out that it still burns less coal than the US or China – and besides, the West has been profiting from pumping out carbon for decades.

“Kerry’s comment is unwarranted and unfair. The attitude of some of the developed countries is the challenge for the Paris conclusion,” said Prakash Javadekar, India’s environment minister. India is “not in the habit of taking any pressure from anybody”, he added.

“This smacks of a ‘carbon imperialism’,” wrote Arvind Subramanian, the Indian government’s chief economic advisor. “And such imperialism on the part of advanced nations could spell disaster for India and other developing countries.”

Both sides have a point here, and that fact alone illustrates why this quest for a GCT borders on the quixotic. India is the world’s most populous country, and its 1.3 billion people won’t be keen on seeing development delayed for less tangible progress on mitigating climate change. For a country which has already struggled with massive blackouts, cheap and available energy is the name of the game, and that presents a problem for Paris delegates, because coal is as dirty and high-emitting as it inexpensive.

But from New Delhi’s perspective, there’s a deep undercurrent of hypocrisy beneath the lofty rhetoric coming out of the conference in France. After all, the developed world is responsible for the lion’s share of greenhouse gas emissions to date, a product of 20th century industrialization. For the world’s poorer countries, it’s hard to countenance the fact that they’re being told that that similar development path is no longer available.

India hasn’t shied away from insisting on its right to grow this year, staking out a clear position ahead of the ongoing Paris summit. The West hoped to buy off the developing world with the creation of a Global Climate Fund at the failed 2009 Copenhagen climate summit, but so far hasn’t followed up on its commitments to actually put up the agreed upon annual $100 billion.

Without monetary assurances, there’s no hope in convincing developing countries to curtail growth for the greater good, and going by the American example the money doesn’t seem to be in the offing. That’s what negotiators are tackling right now in Paris, and that’s why they won’t produce a robust deal.

 

[CougarKing]

More on the air and naval front:

Navy Recognition

Fincantieri to Collaborate with Indian Shipyards MDL and GRSE on P-17A Stealth Frigate Project

Fincantieri has signed a contract with Mazagon Dock Limited (MDL), one of the most important Indian shipyards, controlled by the Ministry of Defence and specialized in the building of naval and offshore units, to provide technical advice within the Project 17A. This project envisages the construction of 7 stealth frigates ordered this year in February by the Indian Navy to the two shipyards MDL and Garden Reach Shipbuilders & Engineers (GRSE). This important agreement allows the group to establish a long-term cooperation with the two shipyards and to consolidate its commercial presence in the country.

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Saab trying to lure India away from Dassault:

Times of India

IAF modernisation plan: Saab offers Gripen fighter jets under 'Make in India' with full control
By PTI | 20 Dec, 2015, 12.19PM IST

NEW DELHI: Swedish defence major Saab has offered to manufacture its fifth generation Gripen fighter aircraft here with technology transfer to India, in a renewed bid for a pie in the multi-billion dollar worth IAF modernisation plan.

Saab, which had lost out in the Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft tender in 2011 which was won by French firm Dassault Aviation, anticipates that the Indian Air Force (IAF) will need more the 36 Rafale fighter jets that India is buying from France to be ..

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[CougarKing]

Poseidons on the prowl:

Diplomat

Indian Ocean: India Deploys New Sub-Killer Planes to Counter Chinese Subs

Two Poseidon 8I aircraft have recently been dispatched to the strategically-located Andaman and Nicobar archipelago.

By Franz-Stefan Gady
January 19, 2016

India has deployed two of its most advanced maritime patrol/anti-submarine warfare aircraft, the Poseidon 8I, at a military base in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands, located in the Indian Ocean, The Times of India reports.

The deployment comes as a response to repeated forays of Chinese conventional and nuclear submarines into the Indian Ocean, according to Indian defense officials who spoke to The Times of India on the condition of anonymity.

The two aircraft are just about to complete their two week deployment at India’s farthest military outpost, 1,200 kilometers (745 miles) away from the Indian mainland.

In addition, the India has also deployed drones at the island. “Navy and IAF [Indian Air Force] are also deploying their (Israeli) Searcher-II unmanned aerial vehicles to the islands on a temporary basis,” the defense official said.

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[CougarKing]

Rafales for India's carriers?

Defense News

India To Evaluate Rafale for Navy
By Vivek Raghuvanshi 3:34 p.m. EST January 19, 2016

NEW DELHI — In an expected move, the Indian government has directed the Navy to undertake detailed briefings with Dassault Aviation regarding the  Rafale aircraft.

An Indian Defence Ministry source said the government wants commonalities between logistics and spares for fighters with the Navy and Air Force.

A detailed briefing on Rafale for the Indian Navy is planned here for Jan. 29, he said, but declined to comment if India will buy Rafales for the Navy as well.

A Navy official said the service needs 54 fighter aircraft but refused to say if Rafale has been shortlisted.

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[a_majoor]

And on again off again with the FPGA project. Now that I've seen the articel uptiread of the Indian Navy looking at Rafale, this is starting to look like some sort of negotiating ploy by India to play France and Russia off and get a better deal on new fighters.

http://nextbigfuture.com/2016/01/russia-and-india-cut-price-of-fpga.html

Russia and India cut price of the FPGA fighter which clears the way for India to eventually get 250 fifth generation stealth fighters

The Indian Air Force (IAF), once an ardent backer of the proposed Indo-Russian fifth generation fighter aircraft (FGFA), has for the last two years sharply attacked the project. Critics say the FGFA is on the back burner to clear the way for the French Rafale fighter.

President Francois Hollande of France, who arrives in Delhi on Monday, has talked up the sale of 36 Rafales to India for an estimated $9 billion (Rs 60,000 crore).

Yet the FGFA remains alive. Last month Indian and Russian negotiators achieved a major breakthrough, agreeing to develop the FGFA at a lowered cost of $4 billion (Rs 27,000 crore) in India. That would open the doors to building of 250 FGFAs to replace the Sukhoi-30MKI.

Sukhoi is already test-flying the FGFA's precursor, which Russia calls the PAK-FA. The FGFA project involves improving the PAK-FA significantly to meet the IAF's specifications. The IAF wants some 50 improvements to the PAK-FA, including a 360-degree radar and more powerful engines.

A prototype fighter flying in India within three years. In total, 11 prototypes would be built - eight of these PAK-FAs for the Russian Air Force, and three FGFAs for India.

IAF objections to the FGFA were:
(a) The Russians would not share critical design information with India;
(b) The PAK-FA's engines are inadequate, being mere upgrades of the Sukhoi-30MKI's engines; and
(c) Paying $6 billion to co-develop the FGFA would mean that "a large percentage of IAF's capital budget will be locked up."

 

[CougarKing]

Boeing's counteroffer to the Gripens and Rafales being peddled by Saab and Dassault, respectively:

Air Recognition

Boeing offers to produce F/A-18 fighter jets under "Make in India" program

The US-based aircraft manufacturer Boeing has offered to manufacture its F/A-18 fighter jets — the mainstay of the US navy — in India through the government's Make in India programme, taking another stab at winning a potential multi-billion contract from one of the world's biggest military spenders.

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[a_majoor]

India deploying a squadron of P-8i's to conduct anti submarine surveillance in the southern Indian Ocean. It is interesting that a nation like India can act quickly to acquire and deploy such systems when we have so much trouble getting routine items like boots and transport trucks to the troops. Perhaps a lesson to take aboard with our own military and political leadership:

http://nextbigfuture.com/2016/02/india-deploying-eight-p-8i-submarine.html

India deploying eight P-8I submarine detecting aircraft to counter dozens of Chinese submarines

As China continues to deploy new missile systems that can target any part of the United States with nuclear weapons, and submarines that can target any part of the trade routes from China, through the South China Sea, and into the Indian Ocean, India is preparing to defend its Andaman and Nicobar Islands in the Bay of Bengal.

India has detected Chinese naval ships coming close to the territorial waters of the Andaman and Nicobar Islands. The Chinese ships attempt to get close at least twice every three months. India is concerned that the islands are mostly undefended, and a lightning attack by the Chinese would be successful.

In response, India is deploying eight P-8I aircraft, obtained from Boeing under a 2009 deal with the United States. The aircraft will be stationed at the southern tip of mainland India in Tamil Nadu. They will serve as reconnaissance aircraft, and also will be equipped with missiles capable of neutralizing enemy submarines and warships.

India is building a satellite tracking and imaging center in southern Vietnam. Although it's billed as a civilian facility for agricultural, scientific and environmental applications, the improved imaging technology means the pictures could also be used for military purposes for both countries.

And a coment on the same site from a poster calling himself Goat Guy:

Sovereignty … not just another 11 letter word. Clausewitz (as well as Sun Tzu) both argued that central to the idea of a republic is that it asserts its sovereign interests and defends them.

So central in fact, that Clausewitz defined a failed state as one that either chose not to surveil and defend its interests, or that could not.

INDIA is doing exactly what it needs to do. Take seriously the sovereign threat which wayfaring Chinese submarines represent to her holdings and borders. Clearly the Chinese, with a gazillion dollars of real money, with a military which hasn't “seen action” for a long time, and which really needs to have a reason-to-exist, clearly China is becoming a bit more adventurist. Nicobar and Andaman look juicy.

I suppose with enough force-and-counterforce, this could remain 'in standoff' indefinitely.

Let us hope so.
GoatGuy

 

[FJAG]

. . .  It is interesting that a nation like India can act quickly to acquire and deploy such systems when we have so much trouble getting routine items like boots and transport trucks to the troops. Perhaps a lesson to take aboard with our own military and political leadership . . .

Maybe this has something to do with it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scandals_in_India

Long history of wheels being greased.

:cheers:

 

[CougarKing]

Pics at the link below: Russia trying to water India's appetite for further naval expansion?

Alert 5

Russia to offer Project 23000E for India’s fourth aircraft carrier

Russia’s Izvestia newspaper says Krylovsky State Research Center (KRSC) will be offering its Project 23000E aircraft carrier design to India. New Delhi is preparing to start construction for its second indigenous carrier.

The Shtorm-class carrier has a displacement between 90,000 – 100,000 tons and there is a ski jump plus two catapults.

Russia believes the Shtorm is a frontrunner as Moscow is willing to allow more technology transfer compared to France and United States.

 

[CougarKing]

More spare parts for the Harrier fleets of the USMC, Spanish and Italian Navies?

Defense News

Indian Navy Retires Sea Harriers
Vivek Raghuvanshi, Defense News 11:20 a.m. EDT March 21, 2016


NEW DELHI — The Indian Navy has retired the Sea Harrier fleet that operated from its aircraft carrier INS Viraat, and plans to replace them with MiG- 29Ks that India has bought from Russia.

The Indian Navy bought 30 British-made Sea Harriers in 1983 but only 11 now remain. The Navy once considered upgrading  the Sea Harriers but abandoned the plan.

The Sea Harrier pilots are now being trained to fly the Russian MiG 29K fighter aircraft. India had planned to replace the Sea Harriers with the homemade Light Combat Aircraft (Naval) version but the program is more than 15 years behind schedule, said an Indian Navy official.

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[CougarKing]

An Indian shipyard wades into the Southeast Asian shipbuilding market:

Philippine Star

Indian firm offers lowest bid for P16-B Navy frigates project
By Alexis Romero (philstar.com) | Updated April 1, 2016 - 11:16am


MANILA, Philippines — An Indian company has offered the lowest bid for the purchase of two frigates for the Philippine Navy, one of the biggest projects in the military's modernization program.

Garden Reach Shipbuilders & Engineers Ltd., a state-run firm, has been declared the lowest bidder for the multi-billion peso frigate acquisition project, Defense Undersecretary Fernando Manalo told The STAR in a recent interview.

Garden Reach offered to supply the ships for P15.047 billion, about P950 million lower than the P16 billion approved budget for the project.


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[CougarKing]

A Russian Buran or US X-37 copy?

Yahoo News

India Successfully Launches Its First Mini Space Shuttle
[Yahoo News]

May 23, 2016


India has launched its very first homegrown space shuttle, the latest bid to produce a reusable spacecraft.

Launched by the the Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO), the unmanned 7m scale model was designed to gather data on hypersonic flight and autonomous landing in preparation for a full size version due for construction within a decade.

Since NASA mothballed its space shuttle in 2011, several space agencies as well as private space companies such as Elon Musk’s SpaceX, have been working on new form of reusable spacecraft.

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[tomahawk6]

Relations between the US and India are gradually thawing.Indian support vs China would be welcome,but India is being cautious.If the US threw Pakistan under the bus military relations might improve.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/us-military-wants-india-to-counterbalance-chinas-rise-as-a-sea-power/2016/06/05/5caf6f24-280a-11e6-8329-6104954928d2_story.html

NEW DELHI — In a recent speech in New Delhi, the outspoken commander of the U.S. Pacific Command, Adm. Harry B. Harris, Jr., was nearly poetic when he discussed the growing relationship between India and the United States, saying he was a “bit moonstruck” about the possibilities.

“In the not too distant future, American and Indian Navy vessels steaming together will become a common and welcome sight throughout Indo-Asia-Pacific waters,” he said, “as we work together to maintain freedom of the seas for all nations.”

The comments struck a chord — though, perhaps, not the note Harris wanted. Just a few days later, India’s defense minister, Manohar Parrikar, publicly rebuked him, saying India does not participate in joint patrols.

 

[a_majoor]

While nominally about laser guidance kits for the 70mm Hydra rocket, the interesting part is how India is gradually opening up to free market competition, and especially in the long term effect of dismantling the bloated Ordnance Factory Board (with 200,000 employees, it is more than 3 times the size of our regular force establishment!).

http://strategypage.com/htmw/htairw/articles/20160617.aspx

Air Weapons: The Smaller And Cheaper Alternative

June 17, 2016:

India is, for the first time, allowing private firms to build military weapons. This breaks the monopoly of the state owned Ordnance Factory Board facilities which, because of politics and that fact that the Board employs nearly 200,000 people, has long been protected from commercial competition. That protection was worn down by the growing complaints from users and voters about poor quality products. This is the result of corruption and lack of competition, something that became more obvious since the 1990s when India began allowing more commercial competition for state owned firms.

One of the first weapons private firms can bid on are an Air Force request for 200,000 70mm guided rockets to be used on helicopters. Since no civilian firm has all the tech needed to produce these precision weapons it is understood that those who bid will have to obtain the needed technology from foreign firms. That should not be difficult because there are a number of foreign firms already producing such weapons and none of the tech involved is considered so valuable that it cannot be exported.

Since the late 1990s a growing number of smaller and cheaper air-launched laser guided weapons began to show up. By 2010 several different companies had developed laser guided versions of the World War II era 70mm air-to-ground rocket. Developing a guided 70mm rocket took longer than expected because the manufacturers underestimated the technical difficulties of getting the laser seeker and flight control mechanisms into that small a package, at a weight and price the customer could afford. The price of the new 70mm missile is now about $30,000 each. This is attractive to India because it is about a third less than a smart bomb and less than a third of what a Hellfire missile (longer used by American helicopters and UAVs) costs.

There are now several combat tested 70mm laser guided missiles out there. The U.S. Marine Corps have been using the APKWS II (Advanced Precision Kill Weapons System) 70mm guided rockets on their AH-1Z helicopter gunships since 2010 as has SOCOM (Special Operations Command) on its slow moving AC-130 gunships. The marines were so pleased with it that they bought APKWS II kits to convert some of their 100,000 70mm unguided rockets to laser guided ones. All this began when the marines bought fifty APKWS II missiles for testing and that proved successful. There followed the first sale for 70mm guided rockets after more than a decade of trying to get anyone to buy more than a few evaluation missiles or upgrade kits. After marine AH-1s had fired several hundred APKWS II in Afghanistan and none of them missed the U.S. Department of Defense supported modifications so APKWS could be used on fast movers (jet aircraft).

The guided 70mm rocket is used against targets that don't require a larger (49 kg/108 pound), and more expensive (over $100,000), Hellfire missile but still needs some targeting precision. In tests the APKWS hit within a meter (a few feet) of the aiming point, about what Hellfire and similar missiles are capable of. The 70mm missile makes an excellent weapon for UAVs, especially since you can carry more of them. The launcher for carrying these missiles is designed to replace the one for Hellfire but can carry four missiles instead of one. APKWS can also be used from a modified Hydra launcher (that carries seven missiles) which was long used for the unguided 70mm rockets.

All these 70mm guided rockets are basically 13.6 kg (30 pound) 70mm rockets, with a laser seeker, a 2.7 kg (six pound) warhead, and a range of five kilometers from helicopters or 11 kilometers from fixed wing aircraft. Laser designators on a helicopter, aircraft, or with troops on the ground, are pointed at the target and the laser seeker in the front of the 70mm missile homes in on the reflected laser light.

The 2.75 inch (70mm) rockets were developed during World War II, as an air-to-air weapon for use against heavy bomber formations. The Germans had developed a similar and very successful weapon (the R4M). Before long it was noted that neither the Japanese nor the Germans had any heavy bombers, so the U.S. 70mm rocket was switched to air-to-ground use. Actually, the 70mm rocket was retained for air-to-air use into the 1950s, but it was never successful in that role. The 70mm rocket became very popular in the 1960s, when it was discovered that the weapon worked very well when launched from multiple (7 or 19 tube) launchers mounted on helicopters. The 108-138m cm (42-55 inch) long rockets could be fired singly or in salvoes and gave helicopter pilots some airborne artillery for supporting troops on the ground. There are many variations in terms of warheads and rocket motors. Some versions can go over ten kilometers.

For a long time orders for 70mm guided missiles were not forthcoming because the Hellfire was doing the job and there just wasn't a big demand for a smaller missile. Several smaller missiles have been developed and some of the, like the Griffin, has been used over Pakistan and Afghanistan on American UAVs. The marines, and now the navy and air force, believe that a mini-Hellfire, in the form of their APKWS II, has a role on the battlefield and plan to keep using it in combat. The APKWS is a lot cheaper than Hellfire or Griffin and for some situations is seen as a better choice. Things like that convinced India and a growing number of other nations to go for the smaller and cheaper alternative.

 

[CougarKing]

Another Indian defense program finally comes to fruition after past delays: (anyone remember the ex-Russian carrier Admiral Gorshkov/Vikramaditya saga?)

Defense News

Indian Air Force Inducts Indigenous Tejas Aircraft
Vivek Raghuvanshi, Defense News 12:56 p.m. EDT July 1, 2016

NEW DELHI — After about 30 years of waiting, the Indian Air Force (IAF) on Friday revived its decommissioned MiG-21 Bis aircraft of the Flying Daggers squadron and inducted two homemade Tejas light combat aircraft (LCA) plus one trainer aircraft built by state-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) in Bangalore.

The Flying Daggers squadron will achieve its full strength of 20 aircraft including four trainers in the next two years, according to a senior IAF official.

Tajas aircraft will replace the MiG-21 Bis aircraft, he said.

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[MarkOttawa]

Four recent posts:

Dam Pakistan: India’s Growing Great Afghan Game
https://cgai3ds.wordpress.com/2016/06/06/mark-collins-dam-pakistan-indias-growing-great-afghan-game/

Indian PM Modi in Washington–Goes for Defence Cooperation
https://cgai3ds.wordpress.com/2016/06/09/mark-collins-indian-pm-modi-in-washington-goes-for-defence-cooperation/

“Absurd”: Continuing India/France Rafale Fighter Buy Balls-Up, Part 2 (plus Gripen)
https://cgai3ds.wordpress.com/2016/07/07/mark-collins-absurd-continuing-indiafrance-rafale-fighter-buy-balls-up-part-2-plus-gripen/

Bloody Weekend in Indian Kashmir (Canadian media ignore)
https://cgai3ds.wordpress.com/2016/07/11/mark-collins-bloody-weekend-in-indian-kashmir-canadian-media-ignore/

Mark
Ottawa

 

[Kirkhill]

UK starts post-Brexit trade talks with India
8 July 2016

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36744736

Sajid Javid visiting India in wake of the Brexit vote.

 

[CougarKing]

More on the Shtorm class CV design at the Russian Military thread (Merged)- Navy.

Defense News

Russia Offers India Nuclear Aircraft Carrier
Vivek Raghuvanshi, Defense News 8:48 a.m. EDT July 11, 2016

NEW DELHI — Russia has offered its nuclear aircraft carrier, dubbed "Storm," to India for purchase, a senior Indian Navy official said. The offer comes as India and the US discuss the transfer of technology for India's future nuclear aircraft carrier, the INS Vishal.

A diplomat with the Russian Embassy confirmed that a Russian team visiting India last week made the offer.

Krylov State Research Center (KSRC), a Russian shipbuilding research and development institute, is designing the carrier, also known as Shtorm or Project 23000E.

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[George Wallace]

Anyone get a feeling that an ecological disaster is being transferred from one location to another?

 

[CougarKing]

Lockmart sweetening the pot in a last-ditch deal to steal Dassault's customer?

Hindu Business Line

In exclusive deal, India to get ‘most advanced’ F-16 fighter jets by 2019-20
Nayanima Basu

Marillyn Hewson Chairman, President and CEO of Lockheed Martin

Lockheed Martin is currently scouting for land to set up its manufacturing unit. According to sources, it is looking to set up the plant in a State that will have a runway near a port.
New Delhi, July 11: 

US defence major Lockheed Martin has firmed up its plans to produce the latest version of its iconic F-16 fighter jets only in India under the ‘Make in India’ programme.

The multi-billion dollar deal was “finalised” during the recent visit of Lockheed Martin’s Chairman, President and CEO Marillyn Hewson here last week, a top official, involved in the talks, told BusinessLine.
‘Exclusively’ in India

Under the deal, the company will be manufacturing the latest version of the jets – F-16 Block 70/72 – that will be produced “exclusively” in India.

This will be the “most advanced” version and will not be built anywhere else in the world. Lockheed Martin also plans to export them from the India plant at a later stage, the official said. The F-16 project is a government-to-government deal that will be conducted through the Foreign Military Sales (FMS) route.

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