Hydroxycut/supplements

[paracowboy]

from personal experience, and worth exactly nothing, I found Cell-Tech to really pack on size for me. My strength jumped quite a bit, also.

I have no idea about how 'pure' the product is, nor do I recommend it. I also find that whenever I cycled creatine, I couldn't keep my urine reasonably clear without drinking a ridiculous amount of water.

I gained as much as 10 lbs in a week using it, and would lose anywhere from 3 - 5 lbs, with a slightly larger decrease in strength once I stopped.

I know some people who stopped using creatine because the extra weight would affect their running abiity, and cause more pain to their joints when running. I, myself, no longer use it as I have to keep my weight fairly low (205 - 215).

 

[Quag]

Does anyone even use Creatine anymore??? I thought NO2 is all the hype now.

Read up a little more.

They each do quite different things.  NO2 is all the hype now because of mass media marketing (Xyience, UFC).

Heck, sometimes I wondered if they made a commercial saying it is ALL THE RAGE to jump off a bridge, you'd see people jumping off bridges all the time. :

 

[Armymedic]

hype is crap.

With our North American diets, there is no supplement which can not be replaced by real food. Anyone who took creatine, pissed it out if they had a proper diet. If you need protein, eat protein rich food. If you need carbs for energy, eat breads and pasta...

Your not going to get anything out of a supplement bottle you can get from a grocery store.

 

[paracowboy]

hype is crap.

With our North American diets, there is no supplement which can not be replaced by real food. Anyone who took creatine, pissed it out if they had a proper diet. If you need protein, eat protein rich food. If you need carbs for energy, eat breads and pasta...

Your not going to get anything out of a supplement bottle you can get from a grocery store.

that's not striclty true. Numerous double-blind studies, performed by impartial universities over a decade have shown that Creatine does work. Not quite as advertised. But it does add mass and improve strength gains.

 

[FredDaHead]

hype is crap.

With our North American diets, there is no supplement which can not be replaced by real food. Anyone who took creatine, pissed it out if they had a proper diet. If you need protein, eat protein rich food. If you need carbs for energy, eat breads and pasta...

Your not going to get anything out of a supplement bottle you can get from a grocery store.

Hype IS crap, and so is your opinion.

There is no way to get the right amount of protein with just food, without eating insane amounts of calories along with it. Also, different supplements (carbs and proteins, mostly) are absorbed quicker/slower by the body, enabling people to time their food intake and control their hormones (insulin, particularly) and such. I also don't think it's quite possible to get as much creatine from meat as it is from supplements, unless you eat dozens of pounds of steak a day.

I'm not saying supplements are the only thing out there, but discarding them as "crap" and "useless" is as stupid as swearing by them. They have their use, just like everything else.

I don't need cough syrup and aspirin on a daily basis, does that mean they're useless and we should never buy them and they shouldn't even produce them?


(Ref: paracowboy's most recent post)

Same for a whole lot of supplements, as well. Guess there is some use for them.

 

[orange.paint]

Use em as a aid, not a end all be all pill to fix everything.Things don't come easy,but with the right training and diet plan the pill's apparently can help with stubborn weight loss.

Those huge guys in the gym...they didn't eat 14 chickens to get enough protein today,they used supplements.

However you can be in great shape without any supplements and just a good diet,supplements come for the people who want to push to the next extreme in my opinion.


And if your eating a regular north American diet,your far from healthy IMHO.
Does anyone actually eat following the Canada food guide?If I did with my low BMR I would be 400 lbs!My BMR sits around 1600 a day which is a little slower than the average.

Cheers for the comments troops.

 

[FredDaHead]

I don't follow anything the Government (Canadian or otherwise) supplies regarding food, health or exercise.

According to them, I'm obese (now, I have a "couple" pounds to lose, but I'm nowhere NEAR obese), I should eat some weird amounts of different "categories" of food, with no attention to timing or combining, and I should do 20 minutes, 3 times a week to stay "healthy."

I'd rather follow people who actually know what they're talking about; people who have degrees in kinesiology, nutrition, etc.

 

[Tow Tripod]

The worst decision I made was taking that shit in Afghanistan.I was either shitting my guts out or worse Iam very confident that it ended up giving me GOUT. GOUT = PAIN. The last two months I limped around with a broken hockey stick when I was trainning the Afghan National Army.The ANA said I looked like MOSES!! Iam a porker and always will be a porker I guess. I wouldn't recommended Hydroxcut to my worst enemy. OK maybe Jack Layton!!!

TOW TRIPOD

WE BREATH FIRE AND DEATH

 

[paracowboy]

okay, now we're getting into the hype part: Protein powders, and the crap the Bodybuilding magazines pump out about needing more protein IS hype. You don't need ridiculously large amounts of protein to gain muscle mass. You get more than enough from a normal, healthy diet.

The magazines say it because that's how they make money. The bodybuilders say it because the magazines pay them too. You don't see Olympic athletes hawking protein powders, or professional boxers.

I went over this previously, and in my Nutrition thread in the training forum, there's a whole whack o' people with all kinds of degrees and a vested interest in keeping you healthy who say so. Go talk to your Base Nutritionist amongst the PSP staff for a more detailed explanation, and some excellent advice on nutrition as pertaining to physical fitness.

 

[paracowboy]

I'd rather follow people who actually know what they're talking about; people who have degrees in kinesiology, nutrition, etc.

well, who the flying fuck do you think THESE people are:

the Government (Canadian or otherwise) supplies regarding food, health or exercise

'll giev you a hint: They're nutrionists, kinesiologists, sports doctors, and coaches who have been paid by the government to help keep YOU healthy so they can keep the costs of Socialized Medicine down, because this nation of fat weaklings are crippling the meidal system by not following their advice on diet and exercise. :

 

[FredDaHead]

well, who the flying frig do you think THESE people are: 'll giev you a hint: They're nutrionists, kinesiologists, sports doctors, and coaches who have been paid by the government to help keep YOU healthy so they can keep the costs of Socialized Medicine down, because this nation of fat weaklings are crippling the meidal system by not following their advice on diet and exercise. :

The "rules" put out by the government are for weak, fat, sedentary people.

I might be fat, but I'm fairly certain I train a hell of a lot more than the guy in his cubicle who takes the elevator to his second-floor workplace and drives his car to go the block to get to the store, yet I'm supposed to eat EXACTLY the same thing he does? Right. I know you know a lot about exercise and nutrition and all that, and most of the advice you give works for "regular" people. Sadly, I don't fit in the mold, and if I follow what the government tells me to do, I get fat, bloated, and weak.

Since I decided to follow what non-government experts are saying, I've been losing pounds like a stripper losing her clothes, and I'm getting fitter and stronger. So, yeah, sure, the government experts sure know what's best for me!

 

[orange.paint]

okay, now we're getting into the hype part: Protein powders, and the crap the Bodybuilding magazines pump out about needing more protein IS hype. You don't need ridiculously large amounts of protein to gain muscle mass. You get more than enough from a normal, healthy diet.

The magazines say it because that's how they make money. The bodybuilders say it because the magazines pay them too. You don't see Olympic athletes hawking protein powders, or professional boxers.

I went over this previously, and in my Nutrition thread in the training forum, there's a whole whack o' people with all kinds of degrees and a vested interest in keeping you healthy who say so. Go talk to your Base Nutritionist amongst the PSP staff for a more detailed explanation, and some excellent advice on nutrition as pertaining to physical fitness.

Agreed,but I am quite new to the buling aspect of fitness.I am looking to but on extra muscle mass but can you really get enough protein from foods without totally overdoing it caloric wise?

Base nutritionist aint a half bad idea either.

 

[FredDaHead]

Just a question for you, paracowboy.

How am I supposed to eat properly, even to government guidelines, with the food available in the mess? Half the time the only food available is greasy, even fried, and when there are veggies they're boiled carrots or beans. Not exactly good nutrition. Sure, I can eat salad, but iceberg lettuce with a radish and a few overripe tomatoes don't make a good salad, either.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I don't think there's been a single day that I've been at RMC and have been able to eat only good foods while not starving myself.

 

[paracowboy]

can you really get enough protein from foods without totally overdoing it caloric wise?

yup. I've actually reduced my protein intake (not hard to do, since I've always avoided vegetables for meat my entire life.) and have not only NOT lost strength, but have effortlessly dropped fat tissue. My weight holds at 215, my strength increases, my cardio likewise, my pants waistbands are loose, and my T-shirts are stretching again. But:

Base nutritionist aint a half bad idea either.

this id definitely your best bet. Get the advice of a pro. I'm a devoted amateur (more so than ever since the taxi incident) but I'm most certainly NOT a professional. Hey, if the Crown is going to provide the services of an expert free of charge...

How am I supposed to eat properly, even to government guidelines, with the food available in the mess? Half the time the only food available is greasy, even fried, and when there are veggies they're boiled carrots or beans. Not exactly good nutrition. Sure, I can eat salad, but iceberg lettuce with a radish and a few overripe tomatoes don't make a good salad, either.

no idea.

I managed to maintain a fairly decent fitness level while deployed in Kabul, being fed on CF food, prepared by CF cooks, to a CF standard for 6 months. In fact, the shape I was in made my wife's jaw drop when I came home for HLTA. But, I guess it can't be done in RMC. You're screwed.

 

[KevinB]

Actually we had a nutritionalist come in for our Mountain Man Team.
 
Your requirements will dictate your nutritional needs.


The only time I would recommend supplements is when you cannot get enough nutrients in their diet via normal means.

 

[Armymedic]

I managed to maintain a fairly decent fitness level while deployed in Kabul, being fed on CF food, prepared by CF cooks, to a CF standard for 6 months. In fact, the shape I was in made my wife's jaw drop when I came home for HLTA. But, I guess it can't be done in RMC. You're screwed.

Your requirements will dictate your nutritional needs.
The only time I would recommend supplements is when you cannot get enough nutrients in their diet via normal means.

Exactly my point up above...For the fit CF soldier, eating a balanced diet, exercising regularly, no supplements are required. In fact more often then not, they are more harmful then beneficial for the user. More often then not, you are just wasting your money.

If you are not fit...first, change your diet (no more chips, beer and Triple Big Macs) and your increase the intensity of your workouts...supplements alone are NOT going help.

 

[TN2IC]

Just a question for you, paracowboy.

How am I supposed to eat properly, even to government guidelines, with the food available in the mess? Half the time the only food available is greasy, even fried, and when there are veggies they're boiled carrots or beans. Not exactly good nutrition. Sure, I can eat salad, but iceberg lettuce with a radish and a few overripe tomatoes don't make a good salad, either.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I don't think there's been a single day that I've been at RMC and have been able to eat only good foods while not starving myself.

Isn't there a few salads you can choose from at the mess? Or what about a sandwich bar? Tuna can be your friend. I haven't been to RMC so I don't know. Beans for breakfast is good too.. just beans and fruit.

My Two Cents,
Cheers,
TN2IC

 

[aesop081]

Just a question for you, paracowboy.

How am I supposed to eat properly, even to government guidelines, with the food available in the mess? Half the time the only food available is greasy, even fried, and when there are veggies they're boiled carrots or beans. Not exactly good nutrition. Sure, I can eat salad, but iceberg lettuce with a radish and a few overripe tomatoes don't make a good salad, either.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I don't think there's been a single day that I've been at RMC and have been able to eat only good foods while not starving myself.

Fred, i call total BS on your part......

I've been to just about every mess hall in the CF and you can always make a healthier choice without starving.  Heck, if i can manage to eat healthy and lose excess weight living in hotels, depending totaly on restaurants while on per diem and working schedules that would make an combat arms guy's skin crawl......i am quite certain that you can manage it too.  You're just not using you head and using the mess as an excuse.

 

[paracowboy]

Exactly my point up above...For the fit CF soldier, eating a balanced diet, exercising regularly, no supplements are required. In fact more often then not, they are more harmful then beneficial for the user. More often then not, you are just wasting your money.

If you are not fit...first, change your diet (no more chips, beer and Triple Big Macs) and your increase the intensity of your workouts...supplements alone are NOT going help.

ah, now that is closer to the truth, but creatine monohydrate DOES add mass and improve strength when taken, whether you eat well or not. Naturally, eating properly and using creatine will produce far better results than eating McJunk's and swilling back beer (which is a catabolic agent, by the way, kids).

So, blanket statements condemning ALL supplements outright is unfair to the troopies, and not helpful. Educating them is.

For the Army's view on nutrition, I humbly direct the reader' attention to the thread titled Nutrition for Fitness in this forum, and would STRONGLY suggest that troops take full advantage of PSP's information on nutrition and supplementation, which includes info on creatine.

 

[Armymedic]

I still think creatine is a waste of money. There is some science to say I am wrong, but there is more to say that unless you are a high performance endurance athelete, then your body produces enough for your needs, and any additional is eliminated thru your kidneys.

Hydroxycut, its just bad for you. As are all thermogenic supplements.

But talk to PSP, they are the experts...I am just a medic...

What do I know.  :-\