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Homolka unleashed

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Caesar said:
Right or wrong, our Justice System is not intended to be accountable to victims. Offences under the Criminal Code (such as murder and rape) are offences against the Crown, not the victim, hence the 'Regina vs. Bernardo' and not 'French vs. Bernardo' or 'Homolka vs. Bernardo' or 'Mahaffey vs. Bernardo'. Under the established system, victims are merely witnesses to the crime against the Crown, no different than any other witness.

Thats a good point. Also in Canada the corrections model is rehabilatative not retributive, its is never supposed to be abut "paying a debt" it about trying to make her shun her criminal tendancies. Judges sometimes take the victims into account when handing down a sentance but generally speaking its about getting the "offender" help. Like forced legal healthcare. Like it, lump it, or disagree that the way corrections in Canada is set up.

The court said "Karla does 15 years" and she should only have to do 15years. People just as bad as her get released everyweek. Where were the extra relaese conditions on Mr.Sleigh in Edmonton? Or Rozko?
 
When I said I was "not a party to" I meant I have not read the deal as agreed to by her and her lawyers. The original deal could have included release condidtions could it not? If that is the case then there would be nothing wrong with conditions being attached to her release. In fact I would be surprised if if it was not commonplace for conditions to be attached to ciminals when their time was up. Has anyone here seen a copy of the agreement?

My point about her debt to society is exactly that. Her debt to the crown in terms of incarceration may have been paid, but her debt to society has not, if it had been society would have no problem with her being released and we wouldn't even be talking about it. The debt was artificially reduced.

Beadwindow: I don't know who those people you mentioned are but knowing some of the details of what Homolka did I would be very very surprised if "People just as bad as her get released everyweek". Homolka and Bernardo were particularly heinous individuals. It wasn't "just" rape and murder.

Incidently Homolka was never convicted of raping and murdering her sisterm, no one was.  


Edited to add: Not that it matters but I won't be adding to my posts on this thread, I would really prefer not to discuss the matter any more. The entire episode of Homolka's release dredges up a lot of really unpleasantness that I would prefer not to think about. As much as it pains me to say so I think if the details, all of the details, including parts of the tapes, had been released Homolka not one person on here would be opposed to the "restrictions".
 
The bottom line is she did the crime and then did the time. Don't blame her for the excellent deal she got. That was a major political blunder. To change the deal now only increases the chances that the next Bernardo may walk because who will believe any plea bargain in the future. This case was not referred to as a "deal with the devil" without cause but a deal should be a deal.
Lets only hope that our politicians get together to prevent this in the future.
 
Am I the only one that feels this judge made a MONSTROUS error?  She can now, effectively, move among us and our children, unfettered.  She has already gone to ground.  Anyone who feels this psycho has been rehabilitated, is, to be blunt, a raving loon.  Just needed to get this off my chest....
 
i totally agree I'm friends with Kristen French's brother he's a good guy. I hate to see Homolka out!
 
Here is the story as it appears on yahoo.com  http://news.yahoo.com/s/cpress/20051130/ca_pr_on_na/crime_homolka_appeal



"NELSON WYATT 51 minutes ago

MONTREAL (CP) - The mother of one of Karla Homolka's teenage victims said she felt "kicked in the stomach" on Wednesday after a judge ruled the schoolgirl killer can come and go with no restrictions.
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The families of slain teenagers Kristen French and Leslie Mahaffy reacted with horror to news that Homolka no longer has to report to the police and can even contact them and her ex-husband Paul Bernardo.

"The shock and disbelief and anguish that they expressed to me on the phone this morning was very painful to hear," Tim Danson, the families' lawyer, said in Toronto.

Danson said Debbie Mahaffy, Leslie's mother, told him 'I feel that I have been kicked in the stomach.' "

Justice James Brunton of Quebec Superior Court acknowledged in his ruling the possibility that Homolka, who now goes under the name Karla Leanne Teale, could reoffend one day.

"However, her development over the last 12 years demonstrates, on a balance of probabilities, that this is unlikely to occur. She does not represent a real and imminent danger to commit a personal injury offence. . The appeal should be granted."

Homolka left prison in July after completing a 12-year sentence for manslaughter in the sordid sex slayings of French and Mahaffy in the 1990s.

The restrictions under Criminal Code provisions were handed down in June after another judge ruled Homolka still posed a risk to the community.

The restrictions included having to report her whereabouts and travel plans to police on a regular basis. She was also to provide a DNA sample when she left prison but it was not clear if that was done.

Lawyers for Homolka were not immediately available for comment.

Niagara Region police Insp. Brian Eckhardt, who worked to help impose the restrictions, said he feels powerless to protect the community of St. Catharines, Ont., where the killings took place.

"We have no idea now whether or not she is coming to this area," Eckhardt told Global TV. "So our ability to protect the citizens of this area are diminished and certainly our ability to protect her has been eliminated."

Danson described Brunton's decision as "very serious and thoughtful" but said the judge made legal errors.

Danson said the families believe the application for the restrictions was bungled and they should have been allowed to intervene.

He also suggested the current federal election campaign is a good time to start a public debate about Sec. 810 of the Criminal Code, which grants the restrictions.

Joanne Marceau, a spokeswoman for the Quebec Justice Department, said several options are being considered, including an appeal and an attempt to seek another set of conditions.

"We will take a decision very, very promptly," she said, although she did not rule out letting Brunton's decision stand.

"We have to consider that this woman is free since more than six months," Marceau said.

"The information we have since she was released (is) that she has always respected the conditions that were imposed on her. She seems to have been a good citizen for now."

Ontario Attorney General Michael Bryant said he hopes the decision will be appealed.

"Believe me, this is not over," he said. "It's not over in Quebec, it certainly is not over in the province of Ontario," said Bryant, adding he would contact the Quebec attorney general.

Bryant said the Ontario government had been confident the restrictions would be upheld.

"To say that I'm disappointed would be an understatement," Bryant said. "I am urging an appeal of this decision.

"And furthermore, we will continue to do everything we can to protect the public under these circumstances."

Under Brunton's ruling, Homolka can go where she pleases and see anyone she wants.

The ruling also means Homolka can contact Bernardo, who is serving a life sentence for the schoolgirl killings.

Brunton suggested the lower court decision granting the restrictions lacked balance in that there was not much favourable to Homolka presented at the hearing.

"This was a complex case which called for the analysis of the development, or lack thereof, of Ms. Teale over a period of 12 years. The proof presented was not exclusively negative from Ms. Teale's point of view."

Homolka and Bernardo took the surname Teale from a movie in the 1990s. The character with the name Teale was a serial killer.

Several media initially reported eight of the 14 conditions were struck down but Brunton confirmed he had voided them all.

Ontario Conservative justice critic Bob Runciman said he believes the conditions on Homolka were valid.

"From our perspective and the perspective of most Ontarians, we felt the conditions, the restrictions placed on her were reasonable and were justified," he said in Toronto. "I think it's going to be of great concern to victims' families for sure."

Runciman criticized the Ontario government for not paying to allow the families of Homolka's victims to attend the appeal hearing.

"If the families were there I think it would've elevated the issue with respect to the decision being taken by the judge."

Homolka is believed to be living in the Montreal area."


Personally I think this was a bad idea on the judges part. I think that society has to stop putting criminals rights in front of everyone elses. Yes innocent until proven guilty but once proven guilty (for things like murder/rape/child molestation etc) you should have your rights severly restriced if not taken away altogether.  To think that she can now contact the families of those she helped kill is giving my gut an unpleasent fealing. Violent criminals should be monitored for the rest of thier lives once released from jail.
 
What the hell is wrong with our judicial system?  I hadn't heard about this until now, but I JUST finished reading an article about a man in toronto who's been aquited of sexual assault on the grounds that he's a "sexsomniac".  That's right, he "fell asleep and didn't realize he had raped anyone untill he woke up and realized he still had a condom on".

We need a better way to select judges.
 
More to this is whats going on in that province ! that wouldn't happen in Ont. thats for sure! So when she does this again that judge should be her next cell mate!
 
A little wake up call to those with kids.....there are lots of others out there just as bad as her who you don't have pictures and descriptions of............Just think what the Govt. does to those the press doesn't follow, out in 2 maybe, 4 max.
 
Fax me a picture  ;)  - We just found the drivers for the crash cars of paracowboys operational offensive driving course.
 
So Kat, what are your credentials in the field of Criminal Psychiatry? Have you reviewed all the evidence, given by certified medical professionals and first hand witnesses under oath, and done a detailed study of Holmolka's case? 

I just had my car broken into a few weeks ago. I think all car thieves convicted should have a mandatory sentence of 2 x broken kneecaps and 20 lashes with a rattan cane. But the stupid liberal justice system never listens to me.......
 
Britney Spears said:
So Kat, what are your credentials in the field of Criminal Psychiatry? Have you reviewed all the evidence, given by certified medical professionals and first hand witnesses under oath, and done a detailed study of Holmolka's case? 

I just had my car broken into a few weeks ago. I think all car thieves convicted should have a mandatory sentence of 2 x broken kneecaps and 20 lashes with a rattan cane. But the stupid liberal justice system never listens to me.......

You just love playing devils advocate don't you? :)

For the record, every document I've ever seen shows no indication that Homolka has ever accepted responsibility for her crimes, nor shown any genuine remorse.  In fact, if I remember correctly (and I'll look for a link to back this up) she once implied that the one victim who survived should also have been killed.  To me, that's more than a good enough reason to keep her locked away forever.
 
Britney, lets clear one thing up right now, and I know of what I speak, who pays for all of the above people that you listed and what is $ the $ overriding $ factor $ that $ thier $ employer $ wishes to see happen?
 
Britney Spears said:
So Kat, what are your credentials in the field of Criminal Psychiatry? Have you reviewed all the evidence, given by certified medical professionals and first hand witnesses under oath, and done a detailed study of Holmolka's case? 

I just had my car broken into a few weeks ago. I think all car thieves convicted should have a mandatory sentence of 2 x broken kneecaps and 20 lashes with a rattan cane. But the stupid liberal justice system never listens to me.......

Absolutely none, just an uneducated Western redneck talking out my sphincter bushing again.  Sorry I brought it up...carry on


edited in the interest of not starting yet another poo fight
 
The mistake was made years ago when she and the crown plea-bargained a twelve year sentence.  She has served her time, and while I don't like it any more than anyone else, she has received the punishment that our society assigned her for her crime.  Yes it was a woefully inadequate sentence, and no I don't want her ilk in my backyard, but hey, the problem isn't that she can now do what she wants, the problem is that she should have been given a sentence that fit her crimes in the first instance.

The prosection then screwed this up, not the judge now.
 
Bruce $ what $ are $ you $ trying $ to $ say?  I $ don't $ think $ I $ get $ the $ gist $ of $ your $ statement.  ;D
 
who pays for all of the above people that you listed

The same people who pay me to stand around all day in a relish suit I imagine.

what is $ the $ overriding $ factor $ that $ thier $ employer $ wishes to see happen?

So that's it? We are letting people out who shouldn't be let out to save money?

Would you want your kids to be playing with her, or any other child rapist/murderer?

How is that relevent to anything? Is that the litmus test for whether we lock someone up behind bars?

'Changed' or not, there are some people who should NEVER be allowed back into society.

And you are of course more qualified to judge that than, um, the JUDGE. All that time spent watching Court TV is really paying off for you huh?

 
According to the article I posted she changed her last name to Teale which is a reference from a movie in the 1990s where the character with the name Teale was a serial killer.  Now I dont have any fancy degrees to back up my opinion but I would have to say that since she has not changed her name to something more appropriate she hasnt yet changed the way she looks at life.

BTW didnt the prosecution have to make that deal with her because at the time one of the lawyers involved had been withholding evidence that would have put both of them away which he/she presented after the deal had been made?
 
Quote from BS,
So that's it? We are letting people out who shouldn't be let out to save money?

When the rhetoric is cut, this is job 1............and just to put it so I'm not just tilting to the "lock em up" forever side all the way, it is DAMN EXPENSIVE....it can range anywhere from 85 to 700 dollars per day per inmate depending on the needs......do some multipling and it comes to some scary numbers.
 
Bruce Monkhouse said:
When the rhetoric is cut, this is job 1............and just to put it so I'm not just tilting to the "lock em up" forever side all the way, it is DAMN EXPENSIVE....it can range anywhere from 85 to 700 dollars per day per inmate depending on the needs......do some multipling and it comes to some scary numbers.

Incarceration is indeed expensive. However, over the long run, it is the cheapest of options.

As a former police officer, I can categorically state that the great majority of serious, and even minor offenders I dealt with in eight years on the job had extensive criminal convictions. Of course, I mentioned convictions. In our system, it is fully possible to have committed ten separate crimes, admit to them, and, in a plea bargain, be convicted of only one. It was not uncommon to run a CPIC (criminal record) check on a recent arrest and have the list of convictions exceed three feet double spaced.

It is my theory that, unlike the United States, Canadians are overwhelmingly law abiding. I believe that perhaps one or two percent of the population is responsible for the majority of crime in this country. Although portrayed as Draconian, the three strike law in some U.S. states would be very effective in Canada. We do not have an endless supply of citizens willing to break the law on a regular basis. Once that small percentage was permanently off the street, I think we could even reduce the numbers of police officers relative to the population.

Although it costs the salary of a police officer to keep someone locked up on a full time basis, one bad guy can keep a dozen police officers permanently employed, not to mention court cost and legal aid.

A final thought on Holmoka. Based on the pathetic sentences handed out for serious offenses against persons, I continue to be amazed that vigilante justice is not more prevalent in our society. As I have frequently stated, if someone ever harmed one of my children, it is not the police nor the legal system they would have to be worried about.
 
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