Freeman on the Land?

[Dissident]

Where are you getting that the FOTL are inspiring more militarization of the police? I don't see that happening. This is just routine sharing of officer safety/criminal intelligence information.

I know a number of other officers who have had dealings with these individuals. Police/FOTL encounters are something that does happen with fair regularity. I'm unsure why it's seen as an 'overreaction' to disseminate a basic primer on FOTL to officers who may not have been aware of them. I'd not call an estimated 30,000 FOTL to be 'miniscule'. Not huge, certainly, but noteworthy.

Pretty much.

The briefing I attended which included references/info on FOTL/SC movement also covered radical Islamic groups and the Squamish 5/eco terrorists.

Bro's in blue do report the occasional FOTL interactions during traffic stops. While I can't quantify these encounter, they are regular enough.

 

[The Bread Guy]

The number of "Freeloaders on the land" is very miniscule, and their ideology isn't very appealing to most people ....

And sometimes, even small numbers of folks can cause significant problems.

 

[Journeyman]

......and the Squamish 5/eco terrorists.

Good Int -- the Squamish 5 were arrested over 30 years ago; I think you can take that 'Wanted' poster down now.


....but if you need a hot tip for your ongoing investigation, my girlfriend usually spends 3-5 days a week with Ann Hansen -- here in Ontario 

 

[Dissident]

Good Int -- the Squamish 5 were arrested over 30 years ago; I think you can take that 'Wanted' poster down now.


....but if you need a hot tip for your ongoing investigation, my girlfriend usually spends 3-5 days a week with Ann Hansen -- here in Ontario 

:

 

[GDawg]

Yes minuscule, but in Land Of The Hippies (Greater Vancouver), they are abundant and are still a threat even in small numbers. Just because they're "miniscule" does not eliminate threat to police or public safety. Let's look at the Grand Prairie incident. Unknown number of Freeloaders captured Trappers cabins with unknown weapons.

Remember Mayerthorpe?

The Grande Prairie cabin idiocy has finally been sorted out:

http://www.dailyheraldtribune.com/2013/10/30/duo-charged-in-cabin-takeover-given-time-to-find-a-lawyer

 

[JesseWZ]

We have had numerous dealings with them here on the left coast as well.

 

[OldSolduer]

We have had numerous dealings with them here on the left coast as well.

We have not had a problem with them......yet.

Mind you the winters here may keep them away for a bit.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

We have had numerous dealings with them here on the left coast as well.

Considering the early governments encouraged fringe groups to settle in BC, it's not surprising that we continue to have a fair number of people with unique belief systems. 

 

[CougarKing]

Talk about a whole new level of self-denial of one's responsibility...  :

Yahoo News/Daily Brew

Freemen-on-the-Land follower walks out of his own trial, claims it isn’t him being accused
By Matthew Coutts | Daily Brew – 11 hours ago

The bizarre anti-government Freemen-on-the-Land movement establishing itself in Canada reached a new low this week when a Prince Edward Island man stood up and walked out of court while facing charges of endangering the public.

John James MacLean, 55, claimed Canadian law did not apply to him when he caused a highway vehicle collision, fled the scene and led police on a high-speed chase that eventually resulted in his arrest.

According to the Guardian, MacLean refused to identify himself with the name on the charge sheet, claiming it was just a title issued to him on government documents. He eventually left the court, stating his business was done there, and was later found guilty of dangerous driving, failing to stop at the scene of an accident and evading police.

(...EDITED)

 

[Rocky Mountains]

Thomas (no last name)

"Section 15 of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms states that all men are equal under the law there, no one man has authority over another man unless authority has knowingly, willingly and intentionally been granted," the letter said. "I did not grant or consent to anyone having authority over me and did not contact with the court, giving them permission to continue."

Thomas said he considers the Government of Canada to be "de facto," which includes the courts.

"Section 15 of the Criminal Code of Canada states that no one is obligated to obey any law of any de facto government, therefor I, as a natural person, am not obligated to obey and or appear (in court) on August 4, 2011."

Doesn't quite read the same as the real Section 15;

15. (1) Every individual is equal before and under the law and has the right to the equal protection and equal benefit of the law without discrimination and, in particular, without discrimination based on race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, sex, age or mental or physical disability.

(2) Subsection (1) does not preclude any law, program or activity that has as its object the amelioration of conditions of disadvantaged individuals or groups including those that are disadvantaged because of race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, sex, age or mental or physical disability.

 

[dapaterson]

CCC S15:

Obedience to de facto law
15. No person shall be convicted of an offence in respect of an act or omission in obedience to the laws for the time being made and enforced by persons in de facto possession of the sovereign power in and over the place where the act or omission occurs.

R.S., c. C-34, s. 15.

Clearly several scoops short of a sundae.  But the nuts and bananas are there...

 

[PMedMoe]

One of the comments on Yahoo (clearly of the tinfoil hat brigade) stated something along the lines of:  "When you are born, the government creates a corporation in your name, so when you see your name in all capital letters (hmmm, such as on a court document?) it's referring to the corporation, not the person."


Ummm, yeah....okaaaayyy....    :Tin-Foil-Hat:

(My comment in yellow)

 

[cupper]

BUt remember, at least in the US, corporations are people too, my friend! ;D

 

[Colin Parkinson]

I think the problem is that the "Freeman are all about their rights and don't want the responsibility that would go with being without a state. Being truly free means being truly responsible for any harm you cause. It means requesting permission to enter a store or business as you are possibly infringing upon them. It means the ultimate respect for private property again due to infringement.

Nomadic people are likely the closet to a freeman, but even they are bound by cultural imperatives. The current crop of "Freeman" are just people that failed at being hippies as it requires to much commitment.   

 

[Rocky Mountains]

I think law enforcement can get distracted by segmenting the usual suspects and giving them too much credit for evil doings.  I remember when CSIS was in its birthing pains and took on white supremacists as a major project, going so far as to help set up the Heritage Front, all the while ignoring intelligence on the upcoming Air India bombing.  Funny thing, while I know lots of criminals I don't know of any racist conspiracies with criminal intent and am not sure any really exist.  I even casually know a few of Alberta's White Boys Posse drug gang and while some of them like swastikas, they are not even all white.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I think law enforcement can get distracted by segmenting the usual suspects and giving them too much credit for evil doings.  I remember when CSIS was in its birthing pains and took on white supremacists as a major project, going so far as to help set up the Heritage Front, all the while ignoring intelligence on the upcoming Air India bombing.  Funny thing, while I know lots of criminals I don't know of any racist conspiracies with criminal intent and am not sure any really exist.  I even casually know a few of Alberta's White Boys Posse drug gang and while some of them like swastikas, they are not even all white.

I don't think anyone, HERE, is impressed with your list of acquaintances. Some things should just be left unstated.

Whatever credibility you have (had) here, I dare say, just took a major hit.

However, that's just my  :2c:

 

[Rocky Mountains]

I don't think anyone, HERE, is impressed with your list of acquaintances. Some things should just be left unstated.

I seriously don't drink, smoke, or do drugs but when someone comes into a business where I work with an inch thick wad of Twenties, a really stupid thing is to ask him to leave.  No. 1 - you're out a couple grand.  No. 2 - you might have to start preparing for a fire sale.  Every little town in Alberta and B.C. has a bike gang.  You don't have to look for them.  If you don't know any bikers or supporters, you must be a hermit.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I don't think anyone, HERE, is impressed with your list of acquaintances. Some things should just be left unstated.

Whatever credibility you have (had) here, I dare say, just took a major hit.

Thank you for being much more mellow than I................holy cow, you are becoming the 'Care Bear Mod". :-*

 

[ModlrMike]

I seriously don't drink, smoke, or do drugs but when someone comes into a business where I work with an inch thick wad of Twenties, a really stupid thing is to ask him to leave.  No. 1 - you're out a couple grand.  No. 2 - you might have to start preparing for a fire sale.  Every little town in Alberta and B.C. has a bike gang.  You don't have to look for them.  If you don't know any bikers or supporters, you must be a hermit.

Being a biker does not automatically make you a criminal or gang member.

 

[Rocky Mountains]

Being a biker does not automatically make you a criminal or gang member.

In case anyone is confused, I am not talking about grey haired grannies who ride bikes. 

My point was that having the justice system spend a minute worrying about Freemen on the Land until they actually do something or profess violence could easily be a waste of resources as per my example.