Engineering Officer

[aesop081]

The guy at the recruitment center just said it was possible but did not have very much information.

He did not have very much information because "its possible" is all he can realistically tell you. Anything else would be pure guesswork.

Are you actually just learning french all day, every day for seven months?

Pretty much.

 

[Wookilar]

1. Would it be at all possible for me to get enrolled for the BMOQ course for the summer of 2012 or at least fall of 2012. I guess I am curious about other people's experiences with their application processes. The guy at the recruitment center just said it was possible but did not have very much information.
- Like has been already said, it's possible. Courses just do not get filled this far out.

2. I was told that the contract for DEO engineering officers is 9 years. From what I have gathered, there is about 2 years of training for an engineering officer. Is this normally done consecutively or spaced out over something like 4 years with waiting in between? I am hoping someone can share their experience on how their training went.
- If you are lucky, your courses should fall all in a row. BMOQ-L Summer/Fall '12; OJT (or PAT at CFSME) for a few months; Eng Phase III May-Aug '13; Eng Phase IV Sep-Nov '13. BMOQ-L runs pretty much all year, while Ph 3 and 4 only run in the time frames given.

3. I am also curious about people's experience with the second language training (ie. learning french). Are you actually just learning french all day, every day for seven months?
- If you get Second Lang Training (SLT), yes, that is exactly what you will be doing. There is no gaurentee that you will doing SLT any time soon.

 

[reboog]

I'm currently in week 12 of BMOQ as a DEO Eng officer, and I thought I'd share with you what I've picked up so far:

1. Would it be at all possible for me to get enrolled for the BMOQ course for the summer of 2012 or at least fall of 2012. I guess I am curious about other people's experiences with their application processes. The guy at the recruitment center just said it was possible but did not have very much information.

While many peoples' applications can take quite a long time to process, it can also be impressive how quickly they can get done. I know of many guys in my platoon who applied in August 2011 and still managed to make it on our course (start date Sept 26). For myself, I applied February 2011 and completed the application process by the end of May. So yes, if you apply now, or at least early next year, you have a pretty good chance of making a 2012 BMOQ.

2. I was told that the contract for DEO engineering officers is 9 years. From what I have gathered, there is about 2 years of training for an engineering officer. Is this normally done consecutively or spaced out over something like 4 years with waiting in between? I am hoping someone can share their experience on how their training went.

You are correct about the 9 year contract. That's what I signed for during my enrollment. With regards to the training schedule, from what I hear, they try to space the courses out so that they flow nicely into each other. I was told that there will be a CAP course waiting for us once we finish our BMOQ on Feb 3. Of course, if you get injured, recoursed, or put on PAT for any reason, it'll take longer. Also, it seems that officer courses don't happen nearly as often as recruit courses, so if you do miss a course, you may be stuck on PAT for a while.

3. I am also curious about people's experience with the second language training (ie. learning french). Are you actually just learning french all day, every day for seven months?

I've been told not to expect SLT any time soon. It's not a priority for most combat arms trades, and only becomes important for the jump from captain to major. That being said, you can do it on your own time. My current platoon commander is taking French classes on the side, so that's clearly an option.

 

[reboog]

Just wanted to update this thread:

I just finished week 11 of BMOQ (did the 13km ruck march, casualty drag, trench dig yesterday) and I'm looking to start CAP in February. So no, it clearly not holding an engineering degree didn't handicap my application.

 

[cupper]

Just wanted to update this thread:

I just finished week 11 of BMOQ (did the 13km ruck march, casualty drag, trench dig yesterday) and I'm looking to start CAP in February. So no, it clearly not holding an engineering degree didn't handicap my application.

In your own specific case.

As noted by a previous post, there still could be a possibility for someone else in the same circumstances.

Info on the Engr Officer trade can be found here.

http://www.forces.ca/en/job/engineeringofficer-21#info-1

Let's put it this way.  If there are 2 positions open, and 3 candidates putting in an application. 2 of the candidates have the preferred university degree while the third does not.  This will hurt the person without the preferred degree. Is it impossible to get into the Engr Officer trade without an engineering degree? No. Is it more difficult? According to the requirements, yes.

 

[LeaferMadness]

Hey I'm going to BMOQ in a little over a week. I was accepted as an Engineer Officer.  I've gone to school and worked for construction companies but this job just sounds more exciting and suitable for my personality. I want to be successful and effective as an officer and member of the Forces. I would greatly appreciate any advice from current forces members on what makes a good officer and combat engineer.

Thank you.

 

[bgc_fan]

Just a couple of things I wanted to mention.

The Phase 3 and 4 Engr Officer courses are only offered once a year (phase 3 leading straight into phase 4). Phase 3 is offered only in summer, so unless you are on CAP in the winter session, you should expect some time on PAT platoon, or OJE somewhere in the units, until Phase 3 starts.

Another change is that Army Engineers and Construction Engineers now have a common phase 3, with phase 4 being the difference. However, the field ex for phase 4 is combined between the two.

While just about everyone wants to stay in the Regiments and expects to be there for their careers, it is unlikely to happen these days. Partially because we are swinging back to the Infrastructure side of the house, and the fact that we should be hitting our PML (Preferred Manning Level). Because of this, it means shorter stays at the Regiment to ensure that everyone has that check in the box, so expect some time at a Base Construction Unit, or Staff Officer position. Another side effect is that the number of Major promotions is being reduced, so the days of 3-4 yr Captains being promoted to Majors is starting to fall by the wayside.

At as a word of advice, if the career manager wants you to go somewhere (particularly a position for future advancement), take it, unless you want your career to stagnate. As an object lesson, I know someone who was supposed to be posted the regiment, but asked for a compassionate posting so he would not be posted there. Someone else was picked to full in his position. Right now, the former is still a Captain, while the latter is now a Major.

 

[EPF]

As for chosing your career path (regiment vs construction vs geo vs EOD), I'm going to throw a bit of pessimism into mix. People will repeatedly say that you are your best career manager, but to a certain extent, it's not true. Even before arriving to the regiment, the brass will already determine what position you will occupy (EOD vs field vs construction) and will slot you into those courses before you even step into the regiment.

True, but you will get to meet with your future CO in an interview before the end of Phase 4, and will have a say in what you want to do. You might not get it, as it's pretty competitive for new lieutenants to get courses like Combat Diver or EOD, but if you're convincing enough, you might get what you want.

 

[SIROEW]

This question might be a bit off the original topic, but this seems like the best place to ask it.

I understand that the four potential initial deployments for an Engineer Officer are:
1CER - CFB Edmonton
2CER - CFB Petawawa
5CER - CFB Valcartier
4ESR - CFB Gagetown

MY question is what is the likelyhood of being posted to 4ESR for your initial deployment. In other words, do you have the same chance (25%) of being posted there in regards to one of the three Combat Engineer Regiments, or does the CF send less junior officers to the Support Regiment.

Thanks in advance!


Simon

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Roll of the dice, they will send you where you are most needed.......

 

[SIROEW]

Thanks, but that doesn't really answer my question. I realize that I have minimal say in where I get posted, but the question I asked is whether or not there is a lesser chance of being posted to 4ESR compared to the CERs.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Don't think so

 

[SIROEW]

Thanks for the help.

 

[EPF]

Everyone but two guys in my class did get what we asked for. It was a pretty even distribution between the CERs and 4 ESR, plus a handful going as base CE (Construction Engineers) all over Canada, a couple posted to MCE (Mapping and Charting Establishment) and a couple posted to 1 ESU.

 

[bgc_fan]

True, but you will get to meet with your future CO in an interview before the end of Phase 4, and will have a say in what you want to do. You might not get it, as it's pretty competitive for new lieutenants to get courses like Combat Diver or EOD, but if you're convincing enough, you might get what you want.

Sorry for the late followup.

It may depend on the regiment and CO, but in my experience, at EX UBIQUE, the DCO at the time did not want to discuss possible positions (though the other regimental COs did). As well, before we arrived to the unit, they already decided who was going on which courses.

But with the new emphasis on CE postings things are different.

 

[Markus13]

Hello all,
I am a construction engineer and I just finished my phase 2- CAP. I will be starting my phase 3 which is the same for engineering officers. Is this phase comparable to CAP? What is the course content like and how often are you in the field?
What happens If you fail? Do you have to wait 1 full year for it to be offered again?

Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[George Wallace]

Hello all,
I am a construction engineer and I just finished my phase 2- CAP. I will be starting my phase 3 which is the same for engineering officers. Is this phase comparable to CAP? What is the course content like and how often are you in the field?
What happens If you fail? Do you have to wait 1 full year for it to be offered again?

Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Not an Engineer, but most Phase III and IV are where you actually will be getting into your job/Trade education and development.

What happens if you fail?  If you are a DEO, that may mean RELEASE.  If you are ROTP, you will likely be shuffled off to another Trade ( The Government has invested money in your education and would like to have some return on that investment.).


(As a DEO, the Government has not invested anything in your education, so you can land up being "cannon fodder" in their eyes as it was you who paid all your expenses to get where you are.  A little harsh, but basically the way that it is.)

 

[Canadian.Trucker]

Hello all,
I am a construction engineer and I just finished my phase 2- CAP. I will be starting my phase 3 which is the same for engineering officers. Is this phase comparable to CAP? What is the course content like and how often are you in the field?
What happens If you fail? Do you have to wait 1 full year for it to be offered again?

Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Also not an Engineer, but with most courses the way in which you fail will be taken into account.  If it's for medical reasons a recourse is usually in the cards, unless your medical employment limitations (MEL) mean that you can no longer be employed within your trade.  I know of guys that have failed their phase III or IV infantry and were put on the next available course to give it another shot.  Much of this will depend on the outcome and recommendations of the progress review board (PRB).

 

[Shamrock]

Not an Engineer, but most Phase III and IV are where you actually will be getting into your job/Trade education and development.

What happens if you fail?  If you are a DEO, that may mean RELEASE.  If you are ROTP, you will likely be shuffled off to another Trade ( The Government has invested money in your education and would like to have some return on that investment.).


(As a DEO, the Government has not invested anything in your education, so you can land up being "cannon fodder" in their eyes as it was you who paid all your expenses to get where you are.  A little harsh, but basically the way that it is.)

Actually, a 5D release for ROTP candidates negates their educational expenses, too.

 

[McG]

Enrollment plan has no impact on what happens in the event of a failure.  Aptitude (or lack thereof) and conduct will drive decisions to recourse, occupationally reassign, or release.

The BEOC and CEOC courses run once a year.  If you fail-out somewhere in the 9 month stream and remain in the occupation, then you have fallen behind by at least a year.