Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)

[KevinB]

Some companies also have mobile testing teams - that show up lock, stock and barrel and conduct testing on site.

I still think they shoudl test 10% of the CF radomly on a weekly basis.  Slack off a little in a few years when usage decreases.

 

[geo]

There may not be a need to send all urine samples to a lab for testing and wait two weeks in the process.

If to surf the net, there are plenty of companies that sell "THC Marijuana Cannabis Dip Strip Drug Urine Test Kits". ($4.00-$20.00US)

From the details of the various kits available it only takes two to ten minutes for a result.

If these kits are available and are considered reliable, why have they not been used.

If there results are not acceptable in a court of law then they can be used to determind what samples to send to the lab.

sending the tests out ensures that there is no apparent bias.

 

[GUNS]

"Bias" would be a moot point if the test strips were controlled in the same manner as TF-107.

The test strips would lessen the number of samples going to the lab, which would allow planning to continue, as to waiting for results.

Another point is, this is a mechanism that enables the CF to carry out random testing, anywhere, at anytime.

Imagine the effect these Test Strips would have on the CF as a whole.

Think of this as " Preventive Medicine"

 

[orange.paint]

Here's a thought.I'm sitting here drinking dayquil loaded down with ephedrine.Now it was not prescribed my military doctors(as I refuse to go to them for anything) so If I pee'd in a cup would I fail for using a stimulant?As the army has no record of me being prescribed a substance for flu like symptoms?


Just a thought.

I remember someone telling me about getting tested in the early 90's and they had a portable truck which rolled around base to base.Who owned this truck?And why could the military not acquire the equipment necessary to complete all testing internally?Would it maybe be cheaper?

 

[KevinB]

EXRCAC -- unless your freebasing the Dayquill -- the amount of ephi in it wont be enough to fail -- you will have trace amounts.

 

[TCBF]

An interesting letter in the Ed J a few days back: A fellow (perhaps a Soldier?) wrote that since he had to PASS a urine test to keep his job to pay his taxes, could he not insist that his tax dollars be spent only on others who ALSO have to pass urine tests?

Makes ya think.

 

[Sassy]

An interesting letter in the Ed J a few days back: A fellow (perhaps a Soldier?) wrote that since he had to PASS a urine test to keep his job to pay his taxes, could he not insist that his tax dollars be spent only on others who ALSO have to pass urine tests?

Makes ya think.

He makes a valid point, we could start with Politicians and work our way down the Federal Civil Service chain.  It would clarify why some civil servants seem void of intellect. Opps did I say that out loud.

 

[FrenchAffair]

Personally I feel that the policy towards “soft” drugs is illogical. Now obviously nothing is going to change in the military as long as marijuana is still “de-criminalized” but illegal non the less by the Canadian government. How ever current trends and logic would indicate that soon marijuana will be legal for personal use in Canada. I hope that the military follows suit, it seems illogical that drugs such as Alcohol and Tobacco are tolerated by the military, these two substances combined cause more deaths than cancer and aids combined in Canada. Yet marijuana, who has never killed anyone (it is physically impossible) remains illegal. Obviously being “high” well on duty should be treated no different than being drunk, as it stands it (to me) does not make sense that personal and private use of marijuana be held on the same level as use of cocaine, heroin or other hard and addictive drugs. Considering the fact that marijuana has no addictive qualities, no lasting effects upon people and really no “negative” effects. Really Marijuana is far more healthy than alcohol and especially tobacco.

I think as it stands today the military should treat those caught with marijuana in their system much less severely than those with hard drugs (unless they are caught “high” on duty), and I think the military should be fully prepared to follow suit of the Canadian Government when they remove marijuana from the list of “illicit drugs”.

 

[geo]

Frenchtoast....
you get marijuana & hash cleared as a legal drug in Canada - then come and talk to us.
At present they and other drugs are illegal and the CF will continue to do what it has been doing up till now.

A guy who is drunk is falling down drunk or a loud drunk - we know who he is and we know we can't count on him. A guy who is on grass or hash (or others) may appear to be normal - but he isn't.... and I want to trust the people in whose hands I put the lives of my section (myself included).

BTW - KAF is dry - so no booze while in theatre.

 

[FrenchAffair]

Frenchtoast....
you get marijuana & hash cleared as a legal drug in Canada - then come and talk to us.
At present they and other drugs are illegal and the CF will continue to do what it has been doing up till now.

I believe that it should and will happen in Canada with in the next few years. Our nation has been heading in that direction for the last 20 years. Like I said, obviously there will be no changes in the military law in till civil law makes the first move.

I, like the growing majority of Canadians believe that it should be legal for private use and given this is a democratic society it seems only a matter of time in till our government recognizes that change in social attitude. 

A guy who is drunk is falling down drunk or a loud drunk - we know who he is and we know we can't count on him. A guy who is on grass or hash (or others) may appear to be normal - but he isn't.... and I want to trust the people in whose hands I put the lives of my section (myself included).

BTW - KAF is dry - so no booze while in theatre.

You are making the assumption that everyone who is intoxicated behaves in the same “stereotypical” drunk behavior.

Not all people react, or even act the same when they are drunk. There are a large amount of people who can be drunk, but in most aspects appear normal (Functional alcoholics….). Saying that every person who is drunk will be falling down or loud is completely false.   

But that being said, if “appearing normal” is you’re only rational as to why marijuana should remain illegal I have to say that is about as illogical as it being illegal in the first place. Obviously being under the influence of any inhibiting substance should be illegal and treated the same in the military. But private use on their own time has absolutely no effect on their ability to do their job. It only stands to deprive us of our freedoms and rights, to maintain that personal use be punished.

 

[geo]

Until you can flesh out your profile a little bit, I have no idea about who you are and who I am talking to..............please do so before we go any further...

Thank you

 

[FrenchAffair]

Who I am really shouldn’t be at issue here. The issues we are speaking about are not subjective. But I’m a under 25 university student from eastern Ontario if demographics is something you wish to be informed about.

I truly suggest that you invest some time in reading, even briefly, some of the countless accredited medical and social studies done on the issue. You might be surprised to learn that most, if not all the common “accusations” pointed towards marijuana use are myths.

How ever, I feel this is not the place for such a debate, though I am always more willing to discuss this issue in a more appropriate time.

For the time being, for right or wrong, marijuana is illegal in both our civilian and military society, so really we will have to wait for that to change before the issues extending from it’s use are really practical to discuss in terms of this situation.

 

[Pte_Martin]

I believe that it should and will happen in Canada with in the next few years. Our nation has been heading in that direction for the last 20 years. Like I said, obviously there will be no changes in the military law in till civil law makes the first move.

I, like the growing majority of Canadians believe that it should be legal for private use and given this is a democratic society it seems only a matter of time in till our government recognizes that change in social attitude. 



You are making the assumption that everyone who is intoxicated behaves in the same “stereotypical” drunk behavior.

Not all people react, or even act the same when they are drunk. There are a large amount of people who can be drunk, but in most aspects appear normal (Functional alcoholics….). Saying that every person who is drunk will be falling down or loud is completely false.     

But that being said, if “appearing normal” is you’re only rational as to why marijuana should remain illegal I have to say that is about as illogical as it being illegal in the first place. Obviously being under the influence of any inhibiting substance should be illegal and treated the same in the military. But private use on their own time has absolutely no effect on their ability to do their job. It only stands to deprive us of our freedoms and rights, to maintain that personal use be punished.

Until they get addicted to theses drugs and go overseas IE) A-Stan were there are easy acessable drugs and start doing them there. For me i want the guy fighting beside me clean and drug free even if it's legal or not 

 

[FrenchAffair]

Until they get addicted to theses drugs and go overseas IE) A-Stan were there are easy acessable drugs and start doing them there. For me i want the guy fighting beside me clean and drug free even if it's legal or not 

I agree completely, how ever there are no addictive qualities in marijuana.

 

[TCBF]

I agree completely, how ever there are no addictive qualities in marijuana.

- You must have missed Margaret Trudeau blaming marijuana for her mental illness.  Only reason it didn't get much press is that most of our editors are still tokeheads.

 

[FrenchAffair]

- You must have missed Margaret Trudeau blaming marijuana for her mental illness.  Only reason it didn't get much press is that most of our editors are still tokeheads.

She never blamed it for her mental illness. She suffers from bipolar disorder, she has stated that heavy use of it made her sink deeper into depression. It is common for suffers of bipolar disorder to self medicate with alcohol and drugs and it is no secret that the use of these on people suffering from this pre-dating condition is not a good combination.

But what does this statement by Margaret Trudeau have to do with the fact that marijuana is not addictive.

 

[orange.paint]

Ok I'm proably going to pee in a bottle for saying this.However I can guarentee you I'll get 100% on that test.

In my OPINION marajuana isnt a harmful substance no more that beer/rum etc.However it is illegal.You are buying it from mafias,cartels,etc and funding illegal activity.

It is not addictive.But it's illegal.Everyone makes their own choices on weither they use or not.They weigh the risks to themselves and their families.Personally I will not do it because this job is too important to keeping my wife and kids under a roof and fed.I couldnt deal with the shame of going home to Newfoundland and facing everyone who will know I was kicked out of the army for drug use.Thats why I wouldnt use.Not the fact that I "may" get caught,but the fact of what It would do to myself and my family.Also losing the trust of my peers is not worth it.

It's your choice to use or not.Its the armys policy to punish those who are caught.YOU choose YOUR path.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I agree completely, how ever there are no addictive qualities in marijuana.

...yea, and tobacco wasn't addicting 35 years ago, remember it used to be GOOD for you.  You mean as far as we know, its not physically addicting, 10 years from now, who knows?


Of course as others have pointed out we have a bottom line and furthur discussion on the merits of 'is it or isn't it' is best left to websites who really care about that.

 

[GUNS]

Until the law is changed, cannabis is not accepted in the Canadian Military, period.

Putting the legal issue aside, one has to look at the harmful affects of alcohol,tobacco and drugs.

A study by leading British scientists have ranked herion,cocaine,barbiturates and street methadone as the most harmful drugs, closely followed by alcohol in fifth place.

Tobacco was assessed to be in ninth place. Cannabis was said to be the 11Th most harmful.

The classifications were based on individual drugs' so-call "harm score", the physical damage to the user; how likely the drug was to induce dependency; and the effect of its use on families,communities and society.

I agree with FrenchAffair when he stated that " falling down drunk" is not a suitable means to determind if one is under the influence.

I served with a  soldier that drank a flask of rum before morning roll-call and no one was the wiser. I am sure that there is not a soldier here that has not noticed character changes in their fellow soldiers after a "night" on the town.

I have no argument with the CF's Drug Policy. One minor flaw of the policy is that it is not "front and center".

You are told of the policy upon joining, given literature and that's it.

One way to keep the CF Drug Policy " front and center" is to open every training course with a lecture on drug useage.

 

[geo]

Guns....
If you reread my post, I did forget a comma
"A guy who is drunk, is falling down drunk or a loud drunk"
I intended to describe the simple drunk, the loud drunk and the beligerent drunk.......the guys in the section and the platoon know exactly who they are.

WRT your "mate" with his tipple for breakfast.....
You were the wiser & you could tell by simply looking at him & listening to him .... a drunk is drunk - and you can't hide it... 

We don't need people with poor jugement to be in control of the C6, the 50 or something that can kill.... you!