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Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dire
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48Highlander said:
Sure it would.   For one thing, 1 acre of hemp field can be used to make as much paper as 4 acres of forest.   The environmental impact alone would be worth it.

Hemp is NOT marajuana - it has no THC - although still controlled.

Don't try to obsfucate the issue, one has ZERO to do with the other.  I'm mean really what does legalizing marajuana have to do with Hemp fields being used for pulp???

BTW My significant other works for Alberta Reseach Council, doing GMO research on HEMP and productivity (she only plays a medic on the weekends...)  I have a pretty good grounding (and can alway call in backup) on the Hemp issues.
 
You know what I like about weed? The fact that when I punch the shit out of some stoned up hippie Red, he can't remember who to blame for making him that one fraction uglier.
 
Hmmm... 48th Highlander, I suppose you oppose GMOs, right ?? The THC content of marijuana has been multiplied by ten in the last decades, pot being one of the most genetically-modified plants on the planet... try boosting alcohol content in wine by ten...  ::)
Now most research about the effects of pot on the brain are inaccurate. There have been no studies on long-term use of it, like there was for alcohol, because of the illegal nature of the drug. One thing that did come out: THC has the capacity to lodge in fat cells of the body, and be released during a traumatic experience. Now that is something I don't want in people around me when bullets start flying...
As Paracowby said: remember why they call it DOPE !!!
 
Britney Spears said:
Alcohol provides NO benefit to society?!

You argument will go really far with that kind of assumption.   :)

Ok, you got me there. I hear it kills brain cells. But like the lions of the Savannah, it only kills the weakest and oldest brain cells, thereby making the brain much stronger overall. Beer makes you smart.

KevinB said:
Hemp is NOT marajuana - it has no THC - although still controlled.

Don't try to obsfucate the issue, one has ZERO to do with the other.   I'm mean really what does legalizing marajuana have to do with Hemp fields being used for pulp???

You beat me to it Kevin. I get a kick out of people who try and justify legalization of marijuana with the hemp issue. The plain, cold, hard fact is that people who agree with the legalization of marijuana for the most part fall into 2 categories:

1-They like to get stoned
2-They believe the rhetoric being slung about by those who like to get stoned.

This really has nothing to do with pain relief, easing of crime, paper, rights, prohibition, or anything else. It about addicts wanting to get stoned without being prosecuted. Period.

Re:Amsterdam. You can't really compare Amsterdam and Canada. There are too many differences between the Dutch and Canadaians to make a fair comparison.
 
I perused the thread and thought I would drop my two cents. 

I don't really feel strongly about it one way or the other but it seems to me that if it was legalized and taxed at a level that would keep the involvement of organized crime to a minimum the negative impacts of the stuff on society would be lessened.

Then again, it would probably lead to greater consumption ..and a greater strain on the health care system.  But it certainly isn't addictive and the 'gateway drug' theory doesn't hold water either.  (Sure ..maybe 100% of heroin users smoked pot first ..but that doesn't tell us how many pot users go on to try heroin.)

Anyway, I think it would be worth it just to keep all that money out of the black market (Lord knows where it ends up) and put it into the hands of farmer's and the tax man. 

I don't usually make arguments for the tax man, but I can dream up all kinds of ways to use that dough.  ..Health care ..defence budget.  Hey - here's a novel idea - how about lowering income taxes, or the GST!  Or even (Heavens!  Can we dream it?) a nice low flat tax.  :o

EDIT: Just so my own position visa vis pot is clear ..there are all kinds of good reasons not to smoke it.  But we can say the same thing about smoking, drinking and gambling.  In my mind, whether or not these things should be legal is another question.
 
Another thought:

I quickly googled this http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/marijuana/statistics.html

3 million - The number of Canadians who used marijuana in 2002.
10 million - The number of Canadians who reported having used marijuana at least once in their lives.

Is a law that would (if thoroughly enforced) subject so many Canadians to legal sanctions a just law? 

Maybe it is ..if 10 million Canadians murdered people, does that mean we should stop prohibiting murder?  Certainly not.  But what if the prohibition on the activity is hurting more people than the activity itself would, by creating a market for organized crime?

We have a law
  • against an activity that (if done in a controlled, regulated way ..like drinking is.) harms - by and large - only the people who engage in it.
  • A law that creates a black market
  • and which - if it were applied thoroughly - would result in legal sanctions against 10 million Canadians.  (..I believe the death penalty has even been suggested in this thread...?)
   

Is this smart?

OK.  I admit I'm just tossing gas on the fire now.  ;D  ...try and think of it, not as gas,  as food for thought.

*ducking and covering*  ;)

[Edited for clarity of thought]
 
Joe Blow said:
But it certainly isn't addictive

Isn't addictive? I'm sorry but bs, one of my good friends is seriously addicted to it. He smokes it every day and can't get by without smoking it. Another one of my friends has a cousin, his mother died and to cope with it all he does all day is sit in his house and smoke pot that his girlfriend buys him (and its been about a year now), can't hold a job for more than a few days without it getting in his way and because of this he still grieves for his loss. Whenever he feels sad he just lights up and doesn't have to think about it for a little while, and therefore never gets over it. If its not addictive why can't people I've had to work with in the past not be able to go a few hours without smoking it, or even sleep without smoking it?
 
Another one of my friends has a cousin, his mother died and to cope with it all he does all day is sit in his house and smoke pot that his girlfriend buys him (and its been about a year now), can't hold a job for more than a few days without it getting in his way and because of this he still grieves for his loss. Whenever he feels sad he just lights up and doesn't have to think about it for a little while, and therefore never gets over it.

I don't want to presume to understand the place that your friend is in, but I think it's possible that he might have more general problems that (perhaps caused by his grieving) that have lead to - or reinforced - some other difficulties, including his pot use.  [EDIT - Which is to say that perhaps the problem is escapism.]

I can relate anecdotes wherein people have just gone cold turkey after many years of heavy use without any difficulty what-so-ever.  I know a fellow who simply ran out of money one day (after rent was paid and all that) and by the time he had enough for a bag again had started jogging and really didn't care buy any.  Heavy (as in daily ..like stressed if he didn't have it) user through university.

Anecdotes are anecdotes.  I would be interested to know what the science says about pot's chemical addictive properties.  Maybe I'll look it up one day ..meh ..probably not.
 
KevinB said:
Hemp is NOT marajuana - it has no THC - although still controlled.

Don't try to obsfucate the issue, one has ZERO to do with the other.   I'm mean really what does legalizing marajuana have to do with Hemp fields being used for pulp???

As far as I'm aware, hemp is the "male" marijuana plant.  Kinda hard to make male plants without female plants, no?

Now I know there are other forms of hemp, such as Ontario Hemp, which have very little thc in both the male and female variety.  Wether there's any control over these or not I don't know.  Certainly it'd be rather annopying to have the RCMP raiding your hemp field every couple days because they think they saw a weed plant.  I will however admit that I don't know enough about that side of the issue to make any sort of argument about it, so I'll take your S/O's word on it.  My other points still stand though.

Jungle said:
Hmmm... 48th Highlander, I suppose you oppose GMOs, right ??

wow, you don't stereotype at all!   yeah that's right man, I'm a typical pot-smoking free-love anti-genetic-engineering anti-war tree-hugging hippie.   and you're a dick.

Jungle said:
The THC content of marijuana has been multiplied by ten in the last decades, pot being one of the most genetically-modified plants on the planet... try boosting alcohol content in wine by ten...  ::)

It's called moonshine.   Rakia, which you'd be quite familiar with from your overseas experience, is basicaly re-distilled wine.

Jungle said:
There have been no studies on long-term use of it, like there was for alcohol, because of the illegal nature of the drug. One thing that did come out: THC has the capacity to lodge in fat cells of the body, and be released during a traumatic experience. Now that is something I don't want in people around me when bullets start flying...

Rumour.   Trace ammounts lodge in fat cells, but it's never been proven that they get released, or affect the body in any way.

Considering the fact that at least half of the CF smokes the shit anyway, maybe you should quit?
 
Wesley H. Allen said:
In most asian countries, it can be a DEATH penalty for even to be inpossession of grass alone. Look at Indonesia, and Singapore for example. Its not just in our culture that drugs are considered bad, and to top it all off look at those Mounties who were killed, all because of grass.
Wes

Thats not exactly true, yes there was grass growing there, However the RCMP went there to look for stolen vehicles. You also have to take into account, the retard's pathological hatred for authority and the RCMP in particular. To bad he just did not commit ''suicide by cop ', and that he had let the 4 live.

On the subject of this thread, I would sooner have a "pothead" at work than a "drunk" any day, hands down.
 
Larry Strong said:
On the subject of this thread, I would sooner have a "pothead" at work than a "drunk" any day, hands down.

How about neither!  Both cause problems at work.
And by "pothead and Drunk" I'm refering to the extreme.
 
Dire said:
This isn't a flame issue, if you are an anti marijuana you have no right to flame unless you can dig up positive facts that Marijuana is truly bad for you. (and when I say bad, i mean is it worse then drinking alcohol?)

Simple: When I drank, my tolerance level would go down and I would end up smacking so people around.
           The times I tried pot, I would beat the living crap out of people until I would "come down".

Don't even try to argue that pot is good and I probably got some bad stuff.   Sorry but pot makes me more violent than I already am.
Yes there is something in my metabolism that reacts poorly with weed.
You want it decriminalized?   Just accept the fact; you blow it in my direction, I might rip one of your arms off and beat you with the wet end.

When you see peoples lives deteriorate because it all started with a little weed.   You might have a different outlook.

Now I'll read through the rest of this 19 page thread to see what others have to say.
 
Let's not let this get nasty.

Way I see it, we may as well legalize it.   Enough people like to partake in it that keeping it illegal just makes a farce out of the justice system.   I don't think marijuana can be shown to be a direct cause in being a social reject - I know of writers (Pierre Burton - admitted "pothead"), CEOs, and <gasp> a President of the United States (who happened to be a Rhodes Scholar) who all smoked it.  Don't see a direct link between pot and loser there (although I still feel Clinton was a putz).

Of course, you also have the losers who smoke pot, steal, get into heavier drugs and are generally a burden to society - but is this necessarily because they smoke pot?   Perhaps they're losers because, like drunks, they don't really do anything productive with their time (preferring to feed their dependencies instead).   Legal or not, it probably doesn't make a difference to these folks.

Screw it, if a guy wants to sit in his basement a smoke a joint to enjoy his evening, that's his prerogative not mine.   Like our approach to alcohol, he shouldn't be able to do it in public (except in a specific location catering to it), he shouldn't be able to operate a MV or use a firearm etc etc, and it should be regulated in a manner which tries to cut organized crime out of it as much as possible (you don't see rumrunners and bootleggers hogging the Organized Crime headlines anymore, do you?).   If the guy is an all-around douche-bag, then it probably isn't the joint he's carrying that we are going to be concerned about.

As well, this has nothing to do with the CF Zero Tolerance Policy, so don't throw it in as a red herring in an attempt to undermine credibility.   As far as I see it, the argument concerns decrim/legalization within a broader social context.   If you want to discuss the CF Policy (which, to me, seems straightforward), start a new thread.
 
Infanteer said:
Let's not let this get nasty.

Sorry, just answered his question with fact.

And from reading the last 19 pages; POT----BAD, CF---GOOD

Especially since the majority of pot supporters......disappeared somewhere?
 
Old Ranger said:
Sorry, just answered his question with fact.

Not directed at you, just a general reminder that people are allowed to share opinions here without being shredded to pieces.  Sure, they can be shred to pieces if the opinion proves to be a retarded one, but judging from the see-saw nature of this topic, you ain't going to find a "knock-out punch" for the debate.

Cheers,
Infanteer
 
True;

Just a touchy subject for me.   (I'll work on phrasing my points better to a debate)

That's part of the reason I only drink in non extradition Country's. ;D
 
Michael O'Leary said:
Supporting evidence??

Personal experience.   Most of them certainly aren't stupid enough to volunteer for a survey, however, I DID smoke it occasionaly up untill about 4 years ago, and I know of MANY members who still do.   If I ever caught one of them doing it on duty there'd be hell to pay, but they're all intelligent enough to confine it to their off time.

Anyway, as I obviously cannot offer stats, I'll subtract the statement if you wish.   The percentage within the CF isn't important to me, the point is that there obviously are going to be individuals who do it - that there's a damn good chance that at least one or two individuals within your section do it on a regular basis - and that if you feel "unsafe" around users once the bullets start flying then you may as well get the hell out because you're always going to be around them.


And just to clarify for those who seem to think of me as some pot-smoking long-hair, I did it occasionaly when I was younger, stopped for about 2 years once I joined the CF, started again on-and off for a little while, and haven't touched it now in about 4 years.   I'd be happy to do a drug test if anyone doubts me and is qualified to administer one :)  For me there's no draw to legalizing it since I really don't enjoy it - I prefer alcohol dammit.  I just think it's absolutely hypocritical to make marijuana illegal while selling cigarettes and booze, AND I truly beleive (and have tried to offer evidence to prove it) that keeping it illegal is more damaging to our society than legalizing and regulating it.
 
Every section? Maybe in the Toronto units they do. I lived in Toronto for several years and I did notice that it is more widely accepted down there.   Up here in the town of meaford, I have noticed a disproportionate number of youth   using it.

They have have bloody dog searches up here at LFCATC M-ford and a few troops have been given the black cadillac in the glutes for it. No every section does not have people using it in the CF.
 
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