Debating: Tone and Content on Army.ca

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I have not been involved in, nor am I current on, any of todays shenanigans but, "holybat man #&%# ".....everyone in it is looking pretty silly chasing each others tails.

Its locked for now.


EDIT:
Sorry EX, same time I guess.

 

[muskrat89]

One point, while trying to remain neutral (sort of)... here's what riles the Mods..  Every time a thread like this gets started, or responded to, it seems like people climb out of the woodwork to say "yeah, the DS are mean" or something to that effect.

In the old days, once in awhile - I thought the BSM was being mean to someone. I never would have piped up, in front of the Battery, and said "Hey BSM - the rules don't apply to you??"  The proper way to approach this is to talk to another Snr NCO, or begin with your immediate CofC. Can you imagine someone "calling out" the CSM, OC, or even the Sect Comd - in front of everyone else?? C'mon.

The Moderators are human. I will say it one last time - let them do their jobs. If you don't like how the site is moderated, if you feel you have been treated unfairly, if you have witnessed someone else being treated unfairly, if you have seen any possible violation of  the guidelines..... PM a Moderator, use the "Report" button, or PM Mike Bobbitt. It is that easy, and that is the appropriate way to handle your angst with "the man".. or the "woman" (Vern) 

Eventually, I got to stand in the BSM's shoes. Things look different from there. Was he ever wrong? Probably. Wrong as much as I thought (which wasn't that often)? Not even close. All that being said, anyone that chose to tangle with him "in front of everyone" got what they got.

By bickering with Mods or other posters, you are NOT helping the problem.

 

[muskrat89]

ooops.. sorry Ex and Bruce  :-[

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Ok reopening this thread...now you kids play nice or it will be locked again.

Army.Ca Staff

 

[peaches]

And you want to know why? It is because it has been asked before, that is why. The Mod's on here are great, they point you in the right direction to what you are asking. They don't want 10-15 posts on one subject. They keep the site the way it is suppose to be, the best of it's type. If you don't like it, just don't come here, that is how easy it is...


Rant off......

This is the exact type of posting I am talking about.  When someonwe new on here asks a question, or makes a post about something that has already been discussed, they should be gracefully pointed in the right direction.  Instead they are sometimes barraged with nasty comments, there's no need for it.

We are in the military, we are supposed to be on the same team.....

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Unfortunately peaches not everyone responds to direction well at all. Can you imagine how much more smoothly this site would run if new and old users used Search more often or actually read the Guidelines? I guarantee there would be less people on Warnings, less people Banned.

 

[armyvern]

This is the exact type of posting I am talking about.  When someone new on here asks a question, or makes a post about something that has already been discussed, they should be gracefully pointed in the right direction.  Instead they are sometimes barraged with nasty comments, there's no need for it.

We are in the military, we are supposed to be on the same team.....

And as a volunteer mod, it does get a bit tiresome to have to "point people in the right direction" constantly, vice actually participating in discussions, because those new users fail to use the "search" function that they are informed about upon joining.

Besides being a volunteer mod, I am also a paying subscriber. So, being a mod, I PAY to have the privilege of redirecting new users who choose to ignore their membership notifications, and fail to search etc.

Am I the only one who sees the irony in that?

 

[Yrys]

Depends.

If you're masochist, there nothing ironic in that, you're just paying for your vice ...

(but I doubt that you are, except for your spouse that forgot your anniversary )

 

[Franko]

Yrys......Here are some stats for you to look at, perhaps it may open a few eyes here.

General Statistics

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Top 10 Boards

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Monthly Summary New Topics New Posts  New Members Most Online  Page views
July 2007                                   354                       4884                       184                       1573                   1165993
June 2007                                   760                   11268                     399                     1911                 2232871
May 2007                                   725                   10775                     385                     1729                 1741315
April 2007                                   762                       11154                     466                     1248                 1756954
March 2007                                 1159                   16347                   579                             1627               2332078
February 2007                               1008                   14256                 596                             698               1824568
January 2007                                 1172            15815                   591                             547                 1924429
December 2006                             1018                 15665                         527                           469                       1883156
November 2006                               977                   16315                 729                           436                         2037126
October 2006                                 1112                 18793                           822                             391                   2096648
September 2006                               1128                 17549                         624                           385                           1889859
August 2006                                   1005                   15846                   619                               401                     1820636

All the DS are volenteers. We do our job because we enjoy the site and want to help out members and guests here.

There is alot of work behind the scenes here, as I just put up here.

Now you know why not only members but the DS at times get a bit pissed when the same bloody question has been asked literally over 100 times and the member didn't take 10 minutes out of their life to find their answer through the search function.

Regards

 

[punisher_6d]

Most other forums I frequent the mods don't comment at all.  Here, they are usually part of most threads.  My 2 cents.

 

[navymich]

Most other forums I frequent the mods don't comment at all.  Here, they are usually part of most threads.  My 2 cents.

You will find here though, that if a mod is being a commenter and taking part in the thread, he/she typically takes off their mod hat.  If something happens in the thread requiring a mod, another one will step in.  Takes out some of the conflict of interest.

 

[Yrys]

What fun whould it be for them, if they couln'd interect ? It's like catholic priests that can't get married,
but have to offer counsel to married people. Interactions is better for everyone. Mods have more feeling
for the mood af the site , then, it's seem to me!

And Armyvern has something around 20% of her online time in warning board... Don't you think that show
enough dedication that she can move around and put grins in a lots of face by her interactions ?

Cheez, do you want to be a mod, THE only mod left ? I'm sure some mods would quit rather then not be able to be
a active part of Army.ca.

/shaking my head at your comment, Punisher_6D !

 

[armyvern]

Most other forums I frequent the mods don't comment at all.  Here, they are usually part of most threads.  My 2 cents.

Well, seeing as how I am a paid subscriber to this site, and a VOLUNTEER mod, you're quite right I'm going to particpate in threads. That only seems fair now doesn't it??

But, as was already pointed out ... if I happen to be engaged as a member in a thread ... I'll not be the one who's also moderating that thread. That's fair isn't it?

In short, yes the mods participate in threads here, but they don't moderate in those threads they post in. Their mod hats are off.

 

[punisher_6d]

I'm not quite sure why you are shaking your head?  My point is that most web boards do not allow their mods to interact and state opinion in any conversations.  This can create serious bias in threads and confusion for regular members.  If you can't read between the lines, I'm truly sorry and I will leave it at that despite your cynicism.  

 

[Yrys]

If you don't like the rules,  either talk to Mike Bobbit or go to "most web boards".

 

[navymich]

My point is that most web boards do not allow their mods to interact and state opinion in any conversations. 

The mods on this board have so much experience, military and/or life, that it would be a shame not to be able to share it with the members of the boards.

 

[Roy Harding]

Most other forums I frequent the mods don't comment at all.  Here, they are usually part of most threads.  My 2 cents.

I am an online participant in two military forums (Army.ca and SOCNET) - both are very well run (the professionalism shown on SOCNET is on a par with army.ca, the mods are, perhaps more impatient and severe with "newbies" there than here).  On both of these, the mods participate in the discussions.

I am also a participant on three woodworking forums (Sawmill Creek, Woodnet, and Fine Woodworking).  The first two are volunteer type boards, much like army.ca, and the level of discourse is professional, polite, and intelligent, if at times heated - the mods there ALSO participate.  Fine Woodworking is a COMMERCIAL site, designed to push people to Taunton Press publications, it is a fine forum, but it doesn't hide its' commercial nature - the mods there do NOT participate (I assume they are employed as moderators/website managers by the website owner).

I have only briefly perused other forums (including Globe and Mail "comments" sections) - I find them cluttered by ignorant, disrespectful, obnoxious, and generally ill-informed idiots. 

My experience (as limited as it may be) indicates that most non-commercial boards worth participating in include the mods in the discussions.  This is, in my opinion, a worthwhile endeavour as usually those who are interested enough to volunteer to moderate, are also knowledgeable enough to offer insightful and valid discussion (whether that discussion is woodworking or military in nature).

I'd be interested to know which non-commercial forums you participate in that show such a level of professional conduct as those five I've mentioned above, and DO NOT allow their moderators to participate.

 

[SupersonicMax]

If you don't like the rules,  either talk to Mike Bobbit or go to "most web boards".

Yrys, answers like that won't make anything go forward.  People bring up points and immediately get hammered because they try to bring up issues on the forum (which are, in my opinion, often tabou here). 

Max

 

[Yrys]

I'm sorry for the abruptness of my answer. But if a debate was to be open about changing rules here,
EVEN if everyody including mods agree about something, nothing would change if Mike B. didn't agree to it.

So why not cut the process short and talk to the supreme rule maker here?

 

[MattyH]

The answer isn't to have the mods stop posting. If they are here, they should be participants. I moderate a forum on Facebook about politics and that argument was made against me as well but the reality is that the moderator is able to facilitate discussions and move things along IF they are coming in with the mindset that they are there to facilitate and help the forum along. The moderator can encourage a positive environment or a negative environment and this thread is a good example of how negative and nasty a discussion can get on the internet. Does anyone think that any good can come from this thread now? If so, I'd like to see people bring that forwad.

ArmyVern, I understand that it is frustrating to have to rehash stuff but the way I handle it on my forum is that I just let it go. If someone wants to talk about why Bob Rae shouldn't be allowed in Politics... and the discussion was already brought up... I don't let it bother me. It doesn't change my day at all. At the end of the day... it's just the internet. One suggestion I have... and I found this worked well... to keep the forums fresh, I delete those that are 3 months old. It allows new people to ask their questions and state their opinions, and keeps discussion fresh and keeps the trolling down. In other words, people don't go back in time to crack on people because they said XYZ six months ago and have learned new information that changes their original point of view. If someone isn't allowed to grow, learn and change... then there is no sense having Army.ca where people are, I think, looking to learn.

It happens on every online forum that people take things too far. Most people will interact with a different attitude when they are looking in the eyes of another human being. If I remember correctly... only 15% of communication is words. The rest is body language and the tone of voice. That needs to be taken into consideration too. You won't REALLY know the people you interact with online in the same way as you know someone you meet in real life. That's just the way it is. If you want to be online and discuss, be aware that your understanding of other people is extremely limited by a variety of factors.

Example: On one thread here I got crapped on for asking what housing for officers was like and was crapped on for an elitist attitude. Did those people realize that when I was a kid, Officers and NCMs were given separate housing arrangements on base? They might not have or they might not have cared. The point is... my question had nothing to do with bashing someone else but took on a life of its own when someone got their back up over a misunderstanding. Rule of thumb... and keep in mind I'm not perfect for this... if someone says something that you find completely stupid, ask a clarifying question or two. You will either find that (a) they are completely stupid or (b) you are having a misunderstanding. In that case, it was a misunderstanding. I imagine that if people would calm down, there would be a lot less of them.