Class Action Suit against NVC & "Govt has no obligation to soldiers"

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I deal with both Manulife and VAC. There is an astronomical difference in how each works and how they treat their clients. Manulife is straight forward, no bullshit, file your paperwork, get paid.

Nothing about VAC even remotely resembles it.

Your last name must go to a different case worker then mine.............just got my money from summer 2013's claim in January 2015 after they kept sending it back time after time for "new" info. [even though they've paid before and there will never be 'new' info]
No media required here.......

 

[kratz]

I've been to SCAN seminars in Borden and Halifax. I made solid notes each time.

So far, I have only experienced one major issue that is woefully under served through these seminars.

In my experience so far, the system works for those who ask questions, read, research and follow policy.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Thank you, but I'm not a Case Manager defending my job, I was an Administration CR4.  If you read my comments, I was quite open to the fact that VAC certainly has it faults.  If people get defensive that someone is stepping up to say "Hey, maybe this point of view should be dissected a little to try and get the full story" rather than just being content to keep a blindfold on and open wide to accept whatever shyte on a spoon gets shovelled into our mouths, well, so be it - your prerogative.

You must have misunderstood when I said "Just an observation."

I did not delve into your current prose on VAC, nor did I take any stand either way.

I simply said you sound like my Case Worker.

Don't get so defensive.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Your last name must go to a different case worker then mine.............just got my money from summer 2013's claim in January 2015 after they kept sending it back time after time for "new" info. [even though they've paid before and there will never be 'new' info]
No media required here.......

Maybe you should change your name to Woodhouse and try for the same one.

It's either that, or my charming personality is at fault.

 

[TCM621]

Every year I need to prove via a Doctors note to Manulife that somehow my gait has had a miracle and improved so that I no longer need the orthotics I've been wearing for over 20 years.

Sorry, but in my opinion this is just more of the kind of the " we are superior to normal Canadians" that has pretty much stopped me from reading/watching these rants.

Being a Veteran DOES NOT mean you are more, or less, then any other medically-conditioned Canadian...............get over it!!

Bruce, that is just not correct. Name one other occupation in which the employee can be ordered in to harms way? Fire fighters and police are close but if they think it isn't safe, they don't have to go. If we need to locate the enemy, while Charlie team is taking a bound and hopefully they won't get shot.

The other difference is that not only can we essentially be ordered to subject our body to injury or death, we have no seat at the table when it comes to deciding our benefits. Police and fire have unions. Other occupations have unions or can just turn around and quit if they don't want to risk their body.

We need to know that the government will have our backs. If we don't, then we can't be effective. It isn't about how manulife works or if VAC  is full of heartless Bastards. It is about can we trust the government to do right by us if something terrible happens?

There isn't that feeling right now. I am willing to bet Stephen Harper, the person, cares as much about wounded vets as he says he does. But somewhere between that personal feeling and government lawyers attempting to claim that they are not held to the promises made in the crowns name in the past (incidental this is a central point to native treaties being honoured) there is a problem. There are probably many problems. And they all need to be aired as publicly as possible until a solution is found.

 

[PuckChaser]

I think what everyone here is missing is that Mr. Monkhouse has made it abundantly clear in the past that he believes no veteran should get anything special for service-connected injuries. He feels we get the same right of refusal for unsafe work, proper safety equipment, and do not do anything remotely physically or mentally dangerous that should warrant special treatment because we're a volunteer Forces. I absolutely believe that'd he'd be singing a different tune if he had sustained a serious injury during his service.

Unfortunately, the ignore feature doesn't work for quotes, so I still get to see his absolutely insane assertion that a CAF member losing his legs to an IED strike is somehow even remotely related to his own personal struggles with requiring orthotics for an improper gait. That, in itself, should show the board exactly who you're trying to argue with. If it doesn't; read some posting history on his consistent attacks on anything VAC/benefits related for CAF members.

I don't think I've ever seen anyone post on these boards asking that VAC give us gold-plated pensions and luxury cars for our service to our country. We're not Michael Blais. People here are simply looking for a fair and equitable shake akin to Worker's Compensation awards for injuries that we sustain in situations where we can't say "No, this isn't safe", and timely actioning of claims. I'm quite positive that Mr. Franklin would hand back all the money he fought from VAC to get, if he could turn back time and have his legs back.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

...and that's where you are so wrong.  I absolutely think Vets should get a much better shake then they're getting.

My assertion is simply this, if an old soldier like myself can get tired of hearing the 'noise', then just imagine what someone who isn't that much of a supporter feels.  Funny, lots of folks agree with me privately, but don't jump in here because they don't want to be tarred like myself.  Fair enough...

Does anyone remember OCAP?  Yup, media darlings for a few years here in Ontario until folks got sensitized to their outrage........then the media stopped calling because there was no outrage to sell papers, and now they're just a ghost.
I'm afraid when average Canadians look deep into things like Mr. Mercer's rant, and see it is actually all about filling in a form once a year, they will lose the outrage at the treatment some Vets are getting.
And if we lose the media then watch how low it sinks................

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I don't think I've ever seen anyone post on these boards asking that VAC give us gold-plated pensions and luxury cars for our service to our country. We're not Michael Blais. .

PuckChaser?  How many times have you been quoted and photographed by the media?  Well that guy who wants all that gets it all the time......
So who, and what, does Joe Public think while skimming the headlines for about seven seconds each morning?

 

[Teager]

I would like to thank Paul Franklin for his blog post and sharing his personal story with Canadians, including frustrations related to access to service and benefits from Veterans Affairs Canada (VAC).

Paul is an outstanding Canadian and an inspirational veteran. His participation in the Soldier ON Relay that culminated on Parliament Hill on the National Day of Honour last year was a testament to his continued passion and drive as a proud Canadian, but more importantly, his accomplishments in the face of adversity serve as an example to other veterans and Canadians as they struggle with their own physical or mental injuries.

I would also like to thank Rick Mercer for using his platform as a celebrity to highlight issues that need to be looked at when it comes to the care of our veterans. I know he does this out of genuine compassion. Rick served as the Honourary Colonel of my old Squadron (423 Squadron in Nova Scotia), so I know of his personal commitment to military families and veterans.

Shortly after my appointment as Minister of Veterans Affairs, I instructed my Department to reduce the complications related to applying for benefits or updating their file in relation to ongoing services or benefits from VAC. This is a critical part of the new vision we are imparting into the department as part of the Veteran-centric approach to service. Any administrative process that serves to delay or complicate support need to be fixed or eliminated. Even more importantly, if an administrative hurdle or form actually goes so far as to impact the overall wellness of the veteran, there is something seriously wrong because everything VAC is structured to do is to help ease the burden of transition for a veteran after their service injury.

Several weeks ago, when I learned about the potential requirement for a veteran who has lost a limb to have to continually verify their injury I asked for this to be examined to ensure such a procedure never takes place. I also reached out to Paul to try and learn more about the specifics of his situation. To date, my department is ensuring that this is not a requirement from a VAC administration requirement and we are determined to work with third party insurance providers to ensure that such requirements are not part of the process facing the veteran either.

I am committed to ensuring that we work diligently to reduce the administrative burden placed in front of veterans by my department and to ensure we get processing times reduced to alleviate some of the stress upon the veteran that is inherent from the process of waiting. VAC will strive for service excellence with the viewpoint of the veteran and their family at the heart of our moves to cut red tape and complexity in dealing with our department. Striving means that we will never be satisfied and should always be looking to do better. By sharing his frustration in his blog, Paul is helping all veterans by making us do better.

Per Ardua ad Astra,
Erin O'Toole, P.C., C.D., M.P.
Minister of Veterans Affairs

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/erin-otoole/veterans-lost-limbs_b_6633620.html

Seems to me that even the VAC Minister agrees with bringing issues out into the open and into the public.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Is this the sort of thing he should be learning from a blog?

 

[PuckChaser]

Is this the sort of thing he should be learning from a blog?

I don't think it matters how he finds out about issues, only that they are fixed once he's aware of them. He's already far better than Fantino, and his social networks use is a great way to get in touch with modern veterans. I don't think we should hammer him for any sort of communication, because that's what what was sorely lacking from previous MVACs.

 

[FSTO]

Is this the sort of thing he should be learning from a blog?

I would hope the minister would send a letter to him first.

 

[Strike]

It came out on FB after somebody posted on the Minister's FB page about the issue and he then contact Paul through FB asking if he could PM him his number.  This happened in the past week.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

I don't think it matters how he finds out about issues, only that they are fixed once he's aware of them. He's already far better than Fantino, and his social networks use is a great way to get in touch with modern veterans. I don't think we should hammer him for any sort of communication, because that's what what was sorely lacking from previous MVACs.

I agree and disagree. I think he should be throughly in the loop but agree that the issues are being handled quickly.

 

[Teager]

I agree and disagree. I think he should be throughly in the loop but agree that the issues are being handled quickly.

He should be in the loop but for whatever reason there is a disconnect. I've seen this before but on the DND side of the house. Myself and other wounded soldiers were asked to explain our issues to a room full of Generals and other higher ups. From there they were able to give direction and make things happen and happen quickly to solve those issues. Minister O'Toole is listening to veterans to understand there view and how the system affects them and try to make change from there even if it's from social media.

I know I read somewhere that Mike Blais even said that the VAC Minister needs to connect more through social media as more modern vets are active there then in the legion. So maybe he's trying that out as a means of connecting with modern veterans.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

So far we've heard, again, nothing but talk and promises. The proof is in the pudding. Let's see substantial action.

However for his first hundred days, given the openness, identifying issues by actually consulting with Veterans and promising to fix them, he's light years ahead of that neanderthal Mr. Fantino.

 

[Teager]

So far we've heard, again, nothing but talk and promises. The proof is in the pudding. Let's see substantial action.

However for his first hundred days, given the openness, identifying issues by actually consulting with Veterans and promising to fix them, he's light years ahead of that neanderthal Mr. Fantino.

I don't have full confidence in him yet until results are shown. Part of me feels that he is sincere and wants to help since he served himself. I can't see him throwing vets under the bus but I will wait and see what happens before I'm done forming my opinion of him.

 

[MJP]

My assertion is simply this, if an old soldier like myself can get tired of hearing the 'noise', then just imagine what someone who isn't that much of a supporter feels.  Funny, lots of folks agree with me privately, but don't jump in here because they don't want to be tarred like myself.  Fair enough...

Bruce I fully agree with you.  I think everyone is in violent agreement that the situation needs the change but the folks we have fronting us in the media are a bunch of all or nothing blowhards.  There are many that advocate a measured approach but like all things moderate they don't go spouting off to the media every time things go pear shaped.  I have said it before but most so called veterans advocates certainly don't speak for me, I am rather embarrassed by the bleating I hear daily.  I know I am not the only one that feels this way. 

 

[ModlrMike]

Two observations; both probably unpopular...

1. Just because we don't see changes doesn't mean they're not being worked on. Compensation and benefits are extremely complex and are made more so when you involve Treasury Board. The challenges associated with fixing the NVC will not change overnight, neither can they be solved by a stroke of the Minister's pen, no matter how much we want them to be.

2. While it's easy to rail at the Minister for the failings of his department, the truth is that nothing happens in government unless the bureaucrats want it to. The unwritten first rule of leadership is that you can't make someone do something, they have to want to for whatever reason (loyalty, honour, fear etc). Ministers come and go, the bureaucracy remains. If they don't want to play ball with the current office holder, all they have to do is wait until the next guy comes along. That being said, Mr Frankin et al should not have to file the same paperwork for missing limbs year after year, and there's no excuse for asking them to.

3. We, collectively, have to get our crap together. A thousand voices claiming to represent the masses only serves to drown out those who truly do. When our self appointed advocates can barely string ten words together in a coherent manner then we're not well served.

Ok... that was three, but I had to get the last one off my chest.

 

[The Bread Guy]

2. While it's easy to rail at the Minister for the failings of his department, the truth is that nothing happens in government unless the bureaucrats want it to. The unwritten first rule of leadership is that you can't make someone do something, they have to want to for whatever reason (loyalty, honour, fear etc). Ministers come and go, the bureaucracy remains. If they don't want to play ball with the current office holder, all they have to do is wait until the next guy comes along. That being said, Mr Frankin et al should not have to file the same paperwork for missing limbs year after year, and there's no excuse for asking them to.

I'm going to counter-balance this with 2a) Bureaucrats are there to tell the Ministers why something can't be done, or whether something lines up with all the other rules that have to be followed.  There are also times, though, when the Minister will do whatever the #$%^& s/he wants, and the bureaucracy has to get 'er done, with their names on the paperwork once the Minister's gone - check here, here and here.

We'll see ....