Challenger/"VIP" Jet/CF Chopper Use (CDS, others) [merged]

[Edward Campbell]

Not good PR in this report, reproduced under the Fair Dealing provisions (§29) of the Copyright Act from the Globe and Mail:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/military-chief-used-vip-jets-for-flights-to-caribbean-nhl-cfl-games-ctv/article2168330/

Military chief used VIP jets for flights to Caribbean, NHL, CFL games: CTV

STAFF
Globe and Mail Update

Published Thursday, Sep. 15, 2011

Since 2008, Canada's top military commander has used government VIP aircraft to fly to sporting events, galas and a Caribbean holiday, racking up a bill of more than $1-million, CTV News is reporting.

Passenger logs requested by the broadcaster through the Access to Information Act provide details of several flights taken by General Walter Natynczyk, the Chief of the Defence Staff.

In January of 2010, for instance, a repatriation ceremony at CFB Trenton caused him to miss a flight to Saint Maarten Island, in the Antilles, for a cruise with his family. So, he took a government Challenger jet to the island, CTV reported, at a cost of $92,956.80.

Six months later, he used the plane to attend the Calgary Stampede with his wife. CTV cited records showing that the jet dropped them in Calgary, flew back to Ottawa empty, then returned to Alberta three days later to pick them up. The total cost was $200,000.

That fall, Gen. Natynczyk spent $121,550.70 to fly to the Grey Cup in Edmonton; on another occasion, in January of 2009, he and his family flew from Ottawa to Toronto to drop the puck at a Maple Leafs hockey game during the Canadian Forces Appreciation Night for $23,231.30.

In total, $732,366.50 went towards flights to attend hockey and football games in various cities across the country.

There were other bills for appearances at various events and fundraisers, including a Support Our Troops Gala in Edmonton in September of 2009 and True Patriot Love Foundation dinners in Toronto and Vancouver.

Gen. Natynczyk's office told the broadcaster that he tries to use commercial flights “whenever available and where his official travel schedule permits,” but that regular airline service “often doesn't provide the flexibility needed.” The flights, it noted, often take him to events where he is representing the Canadian Forces.

As for the excursion to the Caribbean, his office said it was “not deemed to be a personal trip” since his holiday has been delayed by work.

Anybody want to bet that this leads on several 'news' programmes -  not just on CBC?

- mod edit to add choppers to thread title -

 

[Monsoon]

Not good PR in this report, reproduced under the Fair Dealing provisions (§29) of the Copyright Act from the Globe and Mail:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/military-chief-used-vip-jets-for-flights-to-caribbean-nhl-cfl-games-ctv/article2168330/

Anybody want to bet that this leads on several 'news' programmes -  not just on CBC?

I like how it's attributed to "Staff"; basically, no journalist with a recognizable name wanted to be associated with this POS story. The G&M has already bumped it down from top of the national section to a less prominent spot, and I don't believe it ran in the print edition.

An unappreciated part of how the media works is just how much leeway overnight "editors" (i.e. web page maintainers) have, and just how much their work gets scrutinized and revised once the grownups show up in the morning. I think we can look forward to this one disappearing quite quickly, to be honest.

 

[Kalatzi]

I like how it's attributed to "Staff"; basically, no journalist with a recognizable name wanted to be associated with this POS story. The G&M has already bumped it down from top of the national section to a less prominent spot, and I don't believe it ran in the print edition.

An unappreciated part of how the media works is just how much leeway overnight "editors" (i.e. web page maintainers) have, and just how much their work gets scrutinized and revised once the grownups show up in the morning. I think we can look forward to this one disappearing quite quickly, to be honest.

Quiick, Quick, Shoot the Messenger!!!!! Shoot Them!!!!

 

[dapaterson]

It would be interesting to see what the operating costs were, vs the total costs.  Since the per hour cost DND reports frequently includes depreciation, plus crew time.

 

[AERO2012]

Access to Information Act : 1
Entitlement                      : 0

 

[Monsoon]

Access to Information Act : 1
Entitlement                      : 0

Context                            : -1

 

[The Bread Guy]

Quiick, Quick, Shoot the Messenger!!!!! Shoot Them!!!!

When the messenger says they have a responsibility to be fair, balanced while maintaining context, it's only fair they get kicked when appropriate.

Also, has anyone seen a link where the obtained logs are shown, so we can get more context?

It would be interesting to see what the operating costs were, vs the total costs.  Since the per hour cost DND reports frequently includes depreciation, plus crew time.

Good point.

 

[Dissident]

Someone else said it before: They should make available the documents released they get from these access to information act so we can draw our own conclusion.

 

[OldSolduer]

Someone else said it before: They should make available the documents released they get from these access to information act so we can draw our own conclusion.

I agree, and while I'm at it, my small pea brain is telling me that someone who was left unsupervised for a few hours that felt the CF should be taken down a notch allowed this "article" to be published.  What better way than accusing the boss of something like this?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Ho hum. The Mop & Pail back to their old, tired crappola :boring:

 

[dapaterson]

The docs are available - but by request nly.  This serves everyone's interests:

The media, since few will ask for them, so they maintain their exclusive; and

The federal governemnt, since few will request them, meaning they don;t get a solid dose fo sunlight.  Note that I'm suggesting this as a general rule, not as a "in this case there's a smoking gun" assertion.

 

[OldSolduer]

IMO - Some people in the media like to create controversy where there is none.

As an example, when Adrienne Clarkson was the GG, she was hammered in the media for the spending, travel etc. Never mind that the office of the GG is the Queen's Rep in Canada and the one that gets to speak with all those foreign dignitaries and conducts award ceremonies in Rideau Hall. That doesn't seem to be important - just hammer them on their budget.

 

[The Bread Guy]

The media, since few will ask for them, so they maintain their exclusive

And in the case of the media, when I ask about the idea, I get a "gee, that sounds like a neat idea".  In very few cases, they share, but in the overwhelming majority of cases, they don't.

.... when Adrienne Clarkson was the GG, she was hammered in the media for the spending, travel etc. Never mind that the office of the GG is the Queen's Rep in Canada and the one that gets to speak with all those foreign dignitaries and conducts award ceremonies in Rideau Hall ....

Not to mention generally goes where/when asked by the PM (not just Adrienne)....

 

[Michael OLeary]

The flights, it noted, often take him to events where he is representing the Canadian Forces.

Oh, so they were official appearances?

But let's ignore that little item, when we can imply he was doing it all on a whim.    :

 

[dapaterson]

Oh, so they were official appearances?

But let's ignore that little item, when we can imply he was doing it all on a whim.    :

However, if there are more economical means available that meet scheduling requirements, they should be considered as well.


All of this also ignores that pilots have to fly to maintain proficiency; how many flights would have happened anyways with no pax just to keep pilots current?

 

[Rifleman62]

I guess the honeymoon is over.

CTV's Robert Fife is reporting this with his usual aplomb. Sound bite: flight to catch vacation cruise.

In three plus years, how many flights did he take?

 

[dapaterson]

In many ways, this is the best way for the story to come out.  Parliament isn't sitting, and it's Friday, so the story will likely have no legs and disappear by next week.

 

[OldSolduer]

I guess the honeymoon is over.

CTV's Robert Fife is reporting this with his usual aplomb. Sound bite: flight to catch vacation cruise.

In three plus years, how many flights did he take?

How many days is he in Ottawa per year? Not many I'd wager.

 

[john10]

I don't think I've ever seen a group of whinier people than Canadian soldiers, when it comes to the media.

 

[Container]

cops whine too.

The issue is a lack of accountability on the media's side. They dont do retractions on the internet or even the most basic of fact checking. When you are swaying public opinion you should be more responsible.