CFB Borden gets first female commander

[MikeL]

Racism!!?? Where the heck is that?? Link please - that's a pretty serious statement to be making about someone.

I would assume Jacky Tar is referring to

Only tan people get to do that. 

Instead of taking "tan people" to mean CANSOF,  I think Jacky Tar took that to mean a ethnic/racial group

 

[dapaterson]

I think someone doesn't understand that CANSOFCOM wear Tan berets - hence Vern's use of the phrase "Tan people".

Much like SAR techs are orange, MPs are red, Crewmen and sailors are black...

 

[armyvern]

I would assume Jacky Tar is referring to

Instead of taking "tan people" to mean CANSOF,  I think Jacky Tar took that to me a ethnic/racial group

Ahhhh, seen. 

 

[bridges]

For my part, I think this kind of thing is still noteworthy, at least of a passing mention if not national headlines.  No harm in reflecting on the changes taking place in our organization.

A couple of smaller points that struck me from the article:
-Col Harris mentioned that she'd never experienced any barriers (whether regulatory or social, it's unclear) in the CF due to her gender.  While I'm glad to hear that, it shouldn't necessarily be taken as reflecting everyone's experience - at least from a certain era.  I got "no females on parade" & a few other restrictions & harrassment (some of it good-natured & returned in kind).  This was around the same time Col Harris joined;  I don't know what things are like now.

-The article mentions that Col Harris is a step-mother to three daughters.  While I know nothing about her family situation and am not in any way attempting to comment on her or anyone else's circumstances or the reasons behind same, it did cross my mind that I don't know of any female General or Flag officers who've physically had children while in the CF and subsequently risen to that rank level(?).  Certainly not as many as fathers.  This brought to mind Anne-Marie Slaughter's recent article in The Atlantic, "Why Women Still Can’t Have It All".  She was the first female director of policy planning in the U.S. State dept., but resigned as she found the demands incompatible with having children. 

No doubt this has already been hashed and rehashed elsewhere on Army.ca, but I'm wondering if, even in this era of unparalleled MATA benefits etc., whether having children has a practical impact - regardless of what the regs say - on a woman's ability to get to the highest ranks.  Not that that's necessarily significant in & of itself, unless it's actually keeping some good candidates from tossing their names in the hat.

Anyway, that's what struck me from this particular article.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Racism!!?? Where the heck is that?? Link please - that's a pretty serious statement to be making about someone.

Damn!........that's the funniest thing I've read all day.  Jacky Tar, even a dirty civi like myself knew what she meant .................OK, Monkhouse, stop laughing.....everyone is loking...

 

[Jarnhamar]

I've found the mess is pretty much the best place for racism. And drinking games.

 

[Kat Stevens]

And racist drinking games.

 

[Jarnhamar]

And racist drinking games.

Ah yes, how could I forget the green people.

 

[Loachman]

1. AS INDICATED IN REF A, THE RCAF NAME WOULD BE REINTRODUCED IN A
PHASED APPROACH. PART OF THAT PROCESS INCLUDES THE SAFEGUARD OF THE
TRADITIONAL IMAGE OF THE RCAF. THIS IMAGE INCLUDES THE WEARING OF
THE WEDGE CAP AS THE OFFICIAL RCAF HEADDRESS. AS SUCH THE WEARING OF
THE RCAF BLUE WEDGE CAP WITH NO COLOURED INSERT WILL BE MANDATORY
FOR ALL MEMBERS WEARING THE RCAF ORDER OF DRESS 1 AND 1A.  THE WEAR
OF OTHER HEADDRESS WITH OPERATIONAL AND SERVICE DRESS WILL BE IN
ACCORDANCE WITH REF B

As CF pers in light blue uniforms are posted to all environmental and operational commands besides the Organization Formerly Known as Air Command, ie RCN (ex-Maritime Command), CA (ex-Land Force Command), Canada Command, CANSOFCOM etcetera, what, then, is "RCAF ORDER OF DRESS 1 AND 1A", and to whom does this apply? Does the comd of one environmental command get to tell commanders of other commands how their people should dress?

Until there are three different services again, there are no "RCN", "CA", or "RCAF" uniforms.

 

[PuckChaser]

As CF pers in light blue uniforms are posted to all environmental and operational commands besides the Organization Formerly Known as Air Command, ie RCN (ex-Maritime Command), CA (ex-Land Force Command), Canada Command, CANSOFCOM etcetera, what, then, is "RCAF ORDER OF DRESS 1 AND 1A", and to whom does this apply? Does the comd of one environmental command get to tell commanders of other commands how their people should dress?

Same issue came up with the RCN trying to impose NCDs on sailors outside RCN units to make the navy "more visible".

 

[JorgSlice]

As CF pers in light blue uniforms are posted to all environmental and operational commands besides the Organization Formerly Known as Air Command, ie RCN (ex-Maritime Command), CA (ex-Land Force Command), Canada Command, CANSOFCOM etcetera, what, then, is "RCAF ORDER OF DRESS 1 AND 1A", and to whom does this apply? Does the comd of one environmental command get to tell commanders of other commands how their people should dress?

Until there are three different services again, there are no "RCN", "CA", or "RCAF" uniforms.

You mean, "three different services" how? Because despite different patterns of uniforms, the layout is generally the same? I just got confused and curious at this point.

 

[Canadian.Trucker]

SS order All was great till the rain came. Air force blue is transparent when wet as one poor Female MCpl discovered. Next day Base RO's posted dress reg's stating that a bra will be worn under SS order.

I was about to make a joke about you saying SS order, like we were back in Germany during WWII or something.  I then however read the remainder of your post and my incredibly professional and politically correct imagination took over.  Can't get that image out of my head now.  I'm a horrible person.

 

[Loachman]

You mean, "three different services" how? Because despite different patterns of uniforms, the layout is generally the same? I just got confused and curious at this point.

There used to be three separate services: RCN, CA, and RCAF. Since Unification, there has been only one, the Canadian Armed Forces.

Some people think that we have gone back to three services again, just because their names have been resurrected. We have not.

Regardless of dress uniform colour, anybody can be "RCN", "CA", or "RCAF", or none of those, and/or flip back and forth from one to the other.

 

[JorgSlice]

So in order to join the RCN, you had to apply to the RCN. If you wanted to join the RCAF, you had to apply to the RCAF - it was not central?

Too young to really know the pre-unification and post-unification PROs and CONs in detail, but it's interesting. Even my Dad was in after unification and can't speak for it.

Interesting, thanks Loachman.

 

[aesop081]

So in order to join the RCN, you had to apply to the RCN. If you wanted to join the RCAF, you had to apply to the RCAF - it was not central?

Correct.

Now it is different.

For example, i wear the "air" DEU but for 11 months i was a member of ADM(IM), not the RCAF so my blue uniform could not be said to be an "RCAF" uniform as i was not a member of the RCAF.

 

[JorgSlice]

Sounds pretty silly if you ask me.

Thanks CA, The More You Know!

 

[Loachman]

Yes. Silly.

The CF has a renowned history of silly dress policies.

This is what happens when one government smunches the three former Services into one, all wearing a common (green) dress uniform, another government decides to go back to three different dress uniforms a couple of decades later while leaving the single-service structure alone, and a third government decides to apply the names of the original three services to three environmental commands within the same single service. Maritime Command, Land Force Command, and Air Command were renamed. That left other commands, such as Canada Command, Canadian Expeditionary Forces Command, Canadian Operational Support Command (now all merged), Canadian Special Operations Forces Command, NDHQ itself, the Medical and Training organizations, and probably a bunch of others, who wear the three different colours of uniforms yet are not RCN, CA, or RCAF by today's definition of those titles.

This is why it is almost impossible to find a unit wherein every member wears the same dress uniform, so parades resemble three-ring circuses.

 

[JorgSlice]

Wow, I've got much to learn still...

 

[Ostrozac]

The dress pam officially calls the light blue uniforms "air force distinctive environmental uniforms" -- and that was the case even when we didn't actually have anything designated as an air force. Now that we do, maybe Royal Canadian Air Force distinctive environmental uniform is actually the proper name of the garments.

 

[Loachman]

Wow, I've got much to learn still...

Then there was Base Dress for those with light and dark blue dress uniforms, and Garrison Dress for those with green ones. That meant that, for several years, the Army guys wore plain olive green combat clothing in the field, and a cheap polyester camouflage jacket on base, with the old dark green work dress trousers. The camouflage colours were selected to blend/co-ordinate with the trousers rather than any particular environment.

The trial version appeared in Germany during my time there. My first encounter occurred at the Mess at Happy Hour one Friday night, when a bunch of Vandoo Officers strutted in. That jacket had a different camouflage pattern (lighter and more natural colours than the final version) and olive green trousers (not adopted due to cost; there were tons of work dress trousers in the supply system). One of the teachers that we were plying with cheap booze asked who they were. "Canadians. Vandoos", said I. "Those are the new Garrison Dress uniforms". I only new that because I'd heard about them, and recognized the Vandoo flashes on their shoulders. "Oh", said one of the teachers. "That looks like something that Colonel Qadaffy would wear".

Another memorable uniform occasion: I was attached to the SSF (now 2 CMBG) staff in the early nineties, shortly after the new uniforms had been inflicted upon us. While strolling in to work one morning, I noticed that the two female Corporal pass-checkers at the entrance to the HQ building were dressed almost, but not quite, identically. Both were wearing dark green trousers, dark green "combat" sweaters, and dress green shirts, but with different rank insignia. One had the metal pin-on type on her shirt collar with plain green (no rank insignia) dress-type slip-ons on her sweater, and the other one had the dark-gold work dress rank slip-ons but no shirt collar insignia. Not knowing which one was wrong, I tracked down the Force Sergeant-Major and enquired about it. He said that it depended upon what trousers each was wearing. Rank insignia was determined strictly by the lower half of the uniform, which was the same colour in both cases but a different fabric and slightly different style, and completely independent of the upper half, which consisted of exactly the same shirts and sweaters. I expressed the illogic of this, and he just smiled and shook his head, and then told me about the previous week's Commander's O Group. He had paraded seventy-five soldiers through that, all in different orders of dress, to make that same point. He said that he could have shown almost twice as many variations, but ran out of available soldiers before he ran out of uniform variations.