Canadian held for deserting U.S. Marines in 1968

[geo]

Well at the time, no it would be wrong to desert however it's been 40 years and making an example out of him would be a miscarriage of justice. 

Also what comes into play is the 1977 Presidential Pardon signed by Jimmy Carter that gave amnesty to all draft dodgers, of course in this case I suspect it would be argued that since he left after being sworn in he's not eligible for that
pardon.

Allright; I'll bite - what misscarriage of justice. He was a marine who went over the fence, dashed across our border and "hid" in Canada for all these years - I don't see misscarriage of justice - xcept, possibly, why it took the US authorities so long to get their hands on him - his wife says he's been over to the US many, many times.

presidential pardon was for Draft dodgers - conscientious objectors who, upon receiving their notice to report in, made a choice and skipped. This fella was inducted in, took basic training and, for whatever reason, shirked his responsibilities... pardon don't cover his a$$

 

[George Wallace]

Gentlemen,
Reference:
http://www.cnw.ca/en/releases/archive/March2006/11/c1286.html
Press release by the War Resisters Support Campaign  

Leftist site.  I am sure they all feel hard done by.  They don't feel any remorse for having committed a crime, and think that they should be let off scott-free, just because 40 or 50 years have passed.  If we are going to hunt down criminals and make them pay for their crimes, it shouldn't matter if it is the War Criminal or the Deserter, they should be dealt with equally under the Law.  Of course the Courts will treat them to different measures of punishment, but that is for the Courts to decide, not us.  To say anything different lessens the value we have placed on our Legal and Court Systems.  We do not live in a society ruled by Anarchists.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Mountains out of mole hills. This type of case isn't that uncommon over there. They'll hold him till they've done their homework and make the case. Providing all he did was go over the wall, they'll try him and let him go with time served, busted to base Private rank and release with a dishonourable discharge. They've got no interest in sending these guys to Leavenworth.

 

[Gunner]

I agree recceguy, justice will be served.

 

[armchair]

I might be wrong but didn't  President Carter give the draft dodges and deserter some sort of amnesty in 1977.

 

[beach_bum]

Yes, but you had to file the papers...and this guy (something I'm certain he is regretting) didn't bother.

 

[Gunner]

I believe it was only for draft dodgers, not deserters.  Big difference between some who doesn't show up and swear an oath (draft dodger) and someone who puts the nations uniform on, swears an oath, and then decides he doesn't want to go to Vietnam (deserter).

 

[Kat Stevens]

A draft dodger who heads for the hills before reporting is one thing.  A man who enlisted, took the oath, and took the Kings Shilling, as it were, is another thing entirely, I believe.

 

[CBH99]

I think this is a miscarriage of justice, completely.

I believe its wrong to desert, and I don't think he should hide behind his Canadian citizenship to avoid taking responsibility for his crime.  Yet at the same time, it was 40yrs ago - and he has visited the US dozens of times.

From the various articles, he has family in the US and has been visiting them at elast once a year for several years now.  If the US truly is concerned about his situation, why not pick him up one of the other dozens of times he went across the border?  It wouldn't be a miscarriage of justice if he had been picked up before....but picked up now, after 40yrs, and crossing the border dozens of times?  Thats a major lack of consistency on behalf of the US.

I speak from experience when I say I can understand their frustration.  Our family owns a home in Florida, that we visit once or twice a year.  I've been going down there with my mom ever since I can remember, for 22yrs or so.  Then, LAST YEAR...they arrested her and kept her in detention because of some sort of legal matter that wasn't taken care of from when she got in a car accident at the age of 17yrs old.  I understand they have a job to do, but doing it consistently would probably make matters a bit less emotional.

 

[geo]

Ahhh... the wonder of national computer systems.
Punch in a name and..... VOILA!.... here's your dirty laundry

Have a friend who got arrested some 30 yrs ago for a drunk & dissorderly in the US
then last year, he was planning to get married down there, all went well until the day before the wedding - he got stopped at the border, balked at the particular question asked by the Immigration fella.... and Bob's your uncle - something that he did a long time ago came to bite him on the ass.

Beware what you do as a youth.... and if you do do it.... look into getting the matter cleaned up... it never goes away.

 

[George Wallace]

We can look forward to more instances of this happening with the new Border crossing regulations that are coming into effect.  Gone are the days of a few quick questions and you are on your way.  You will have to have ID and it will be checked on the National database.  Any past transgressions will pop up.

 

[GAP]

As an Ex Marine who was serving in FMF Pac when this guy deserted...I have no sympathy for him. He had other options, one of which was to register as a Conscietious Objector. He still would have had to go over, but would have been sidelined back on some base...we didn't want them in the field, and wouldn't have them. Accidents happen
A comittment, is a committment, is a committment...if this is an example of what makes a good Canadian...I don't want him in my country.

 

[MikeL]

He deserted, so he is still a member of the USMC, etc. Anyways, realistically whats gonna happen? Held in jail for a few days untill he his dishonorably discharged an he gets sent back home.

Sucks for him, but too bad. Who cares if it he took off 40 years ago, or 4 days ago, the crime doesn't change.

 

[Gunner]

I find it interesting that some CDNs are supporting this guy.

I find it interesting that some AMERICANs are supporting this guy.  Save the mock indignation against Canadians....  :

 

[Michael Dorosh]

What type of man deserts their national military in a time of war?

A principled one, if he disagrees with the reasons for the war and can point out valid illegalities.  Some Americans thought that My Lai and similar tales was a valid enough comparison to the einsatzgruppen to disqualify themselves for service in Vietnam.  I respect those that went to Vietnam as I personally think it was an important war to participate in, and respect even more that went despite any misgivings they had about the mission there or the accomplishment of the aim, but have a hard time branding those who legitimately objected to policy or even criminal actions as "cowards".  And even if they were cowards, as no doubt some of them were, well, what good is a coward in a war zone to begin with?

 

[chrisf]

Well I guess there is, for the ones that build memorials in BC for war "resistors." 

There's two very important letters in that scentence

 

[SeaKingTacco]

A principled one, if he disagrees with the reasons for the war and can point out valid illegalities.

No.  A principled person, if he/she disagrees with the war, informs the chain of command of their refusal to serve, pleads guilty at the trial and accepts the punishment on the spot without complaint.  Those people I can respect, even if I don't necessarily agree with them.

Deserting your unit and your buddies days before deploying to war and running to Canada to live a life of comfort is principled, how exactly?

 

[Michael Dorosh]

No.  A principled person, if he/she disagrees with the war, informs the chain of command of their refusal to serve, pleads guilty at the trial and accepts the punishment on the spot without complaint.  Those people I can respect, even if I don't necessarily agree with them.

Deserting your unit and your buddies days before deploying to war and running to Canada to live a life of comfort is principled, how exactly?

Quite right; I wasn't referring to the specific case of buddy reaping the benefits of pay and privileges during basic and advanced training (and the promise of college money and the GI Bill) and then skipping out at the last minute. Although, if he had enlisted, accepted the benefits, etc. in time of peace and then his nation became "suddenly" embroiled in a dubious course of military action - well, he would obviously need to take the route you prescribed, at least as far as making his objections known up front.

 

[MikeL]

However, most CDNs don't see a problem with what he did.  So there you have it.....

How do you know what most Canadians think of this?

Also, I'm sure theres Americans who are against what is happening too this person aswell.


Also, AFAIK there are no memorials in BC for draft dodgers, etc. One group wanted too build one(forget where) but nothing came of it.

Anyways, one group of anti-war protesters, etc does not represent an entire Province or Country.

 

[Gunner]

  There is no mocking indignation against CDNs.  Well I guess there is, for the ones that build memorials in BC for war "resistors."  Say, maybe they can build one for WWII Zombies to be "fair?"
Don't get me wrong "G" I know that most serving military personnel think this guy is a zero.  However, most CDNs don't see a problem with what he did.  So there you have it.....

I think you will find the majority of Canadians do not support deserters.  Draft dodgers are an entirely different category and Canada was profoundly affected by the thousands of americans, educated in liberal thought, crossing our borders in the 60s and 70s.  

As far as the memorial goes, there is one sculpter who wants to build a statue in a small BC community.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11355863/

Once you can restrain the intellectual mumblings of Warren Beatty, et al, come talk to me ....  ;D.