Canada's New Defence Minister

[Eye In The Sky]

The small portion of our Armed Forces represents me as a Canadian.

Okay.  I'll buy that.

Therefore, I am at war with ISIS. They were sent there under the orders of the government that I caused to be elected and serve me by being there.

Sorry, but unless you have to wash Iraqi sand out of your kit or have hours logged over the Badlands, you'll have to be happy with being represented by that small portion of the CAF representing you.  You are no more 'at war' with ISIS personally than the guy who manages the Sobeys is.  IMO.

In fact, I suspect that many of them would much rather be back at their home bases.

I'm sure firefighters would rather be home with their families rather than running into burning building and rescuing daring kitties from tall trees.  Doesn't mean they don't understand why some people have to be firefighters and run into burning building and rescue kitties who climb.  I would always rather be home than away;  that makes me human, with a nice home and a wife I love - nothing else. 

My experience is the folks who 'would rather be back home' in the context I think you meant it in are the ones who never 'go outside the wire';  they aren't a part of the ops side and aren't in on whats going on in the theatre and may not see 'the point' of being there because they only know things from the news, RUMINT and WAGs around the patio.  They get into the Groundhog Day thing on the camp and it can be a very small bubble of existence.

Those people fall under the SC side, not so much the XXX-Det side.

 

[Kirkhill]

How's this for a start?Tweak for inflation, and you have the first point on the graph ....

Two more points and you could extrapolate a line - if the relationship were linear.  But the real "curve" is likely to be some weird exponential because the "units" on the X axis are of differing sizes.

I think somebody would actually have to do the leg work - and then have some one decide whether a million individual training days is more valuable that one brigade training week (for example).

 

[daftandbarmy]

^^^^  Maybe this should be a stand-alone thread title.

I'd offer up:

....get out of the badge-changing and HQ renaming/expanding business.   

I hope that one of the good things about having a new government is that weirdness will end:

“Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason.”

― Mark Twain

 

[YZT580]

Okay.  I'll buy that.

  You are no more 'at war' with ISIS personally than the guy who manages the Sobeys is.  IMO.

Tell that to the folks in Paris my friend.  A number of you have been moaning for years about the Canadian folks not supporting the military.  Your statements indicate why.  You want to be isolated and misunderstood.  Throughout WW2 Korea and Cyprus and  the cold war postings in Germany there were numerous Canadians watched while husbands, brothers etc marched off to war.  They spent their evenings around the radio and grabbed the newspapers to follow the obit. column for each regiment.  So don't you dare tell me that those who sit at home are not every bit as involved as those who are out in the desert.  That is pure arrogance of the worst kind. 

 

[brihard]

Tell that to the folks in Paris my friend.  A number of you have been moaning for years about the Canadian folks not supporting the military.  Your statements indicate why.  You want to be isolated and misunderstood.  Throughout WW2 Korea and Cyprus and  the cold war postings in Germany there were numerous Canadians watched while husbands, brothers etc marched off to war.  They spent their evenings around the radio and grabbed the newspapers to follow the obit. column for each regiment.  So don't you dare tell me that those who sit at home are not every bit as involved as those who are out in the desert.  That is pure arrogance of the worst kind.

Having been out in a different desert, I'll very comfortably tell you that those sitting at home are NOT 'every bit as involved' as those deployed, and you're bloody deluded if you think otherwise. It's not arrogance to state that; you are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own set of facts.

You want to be/feel involved? Deploy or provide direct support to a deployment. Otherwise pipe down, because you're way out of your lane. Listening to a radio or reading a newspaper- or, these days, watching TV and browsing facebook, doesn't 'involve' you in the fight no matter how much you might want to pretend it does.

Might I ask you to offer some basic gist of your military service? Your profile is pretty thin, and you're startling in the claim you're trying to make.

 

[Edward Campbell]

Having been out in a different desert, I'll very comfortably tell you that those sitting at home are NOT 'every bit as involved' as those deployed, and you're bloody deluded if you think otherwise. It's not arrogance to state that; you are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own set of facts.

You want to be/feel involved? Deploy or provide direct support to a deployment. Otherwise pipe down, because you're way out of your lane. Listening to a radio or reading a newspaper- or, these days, watching TV and browsing facebook, doesn't 'involve' you in the fight no matter how much you might want to pretend it does.

Might I ask you to offer some basic gist of your military service? Your profile is pretty thin, and you're startling in the claim you're trying to make.

Sorry, Brihard, but you two are talking past each other.

Are you going to suggest that Hamish Seggie and his wife weren't (and still aren't) just as involved in the camaiagn in Afghanistan as you? Every sailor, soldier and RCAF member deployed creates involvement for others, at home. Every casualty increases and decreases public support for any mission. The casualty lists, to which YZT580 alludes, were front page news in the early 1940s: far, far more important than even the exploits of Maurice Richard, Ted Kennedy and Betty Grable. People can be involved even if at a great distance, even if they don't have any 'skin' (in the form of a son or daughter, a husband or wife, a friend or partner) in the 'game.'

 

[Kirkhill]

And, if I may add ERC, the public gets involved when they feel like targets.  And New York, London and Paris (and Ottawa) (and Madrid) (and Bombay) make civilians feel like targets.

 

[Loachman]

Sorry, Brihard, but you two are talking past each other.

Are you going to suggest that Hamish Seggie and his wife weren't (and still aren't) just as involved in the camaiagn in Afghanistan as you? Every sailor, soldier and RCAF member deployed creates involvement for others, at home.

The order given was "So don't you dare tell me that those who sit at home are not every bit as involved as those who are out in the desert."

Others, not deployed, may be involved in some capacity, to varying degrees, but they are not, in any way "every bit as involved" as the guy/girl in location, living with whatever deprivations his or her situation requires, including the likelihood of being shot or blown up.

There is no comparison.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Tell that to the folks in Paris my friend.  A number of you have been moaning for years about the Canadian folks not supporting the military.  Your statements indicate why.  You want to be isolated and misunderstood.  Throughout WW2 Korea and Cyprus and  the cold war postings in Germany there were numerous Canadians watched while husbands, brothers etc marched off to war.  They spent their evenings around the radio and grabbed the newspapers to follow the obit. column for each regiment.  So don't you dare tell me that those who sit at home are not every bit as involved as those who are out in the desert.  That is pure arrogance of the worst kind.

Maybe you can tell the family of the man pictured below exactly how you are "putting it on the line", just like he did.

Were you there for either of the ramp ceremonies in theatre?  At home here in Canada?  PLEASE explain to me why YOU think YOU are 'every bit as involved as those who are out in the desert'.

I cannot express how angry it makes me that you think you deserve to ride along on the honour Canadians like Sgt Doiron earn thru their service and sacrifice.

 

[daftandbarmy]

So, tell me again, how is this all about the title of this thread: Canada's New Defence Minister?  ???

 

[Remius]

So, tell me again, how is this all about the title of this thread: Canada's New Defence Minister?  ???

:dunno:

Maybe because the new MND has actually been every bit involved as those in the desert?  (Which is kind of cool) Or maybe this just derailed into some sort of measuring contest.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

:dunno:

Maybe because the new MND has actually been every bit involved as those in the desert?  (Which is kind of cool) Or maybe this just derailed into some sort of measuring contest.

Or derailed for a reality check after Reply #249...http://army.ca/forums/threads/121038/post-1401021.html#msg1401021

 

[Kirkhill]

The order given was "So don't you dare tell me that those who sit at home are not every bit as involved as those who are out in the desert."

Others, not deployed, may be involved in some capacity, to varying degrees, but they are not, in any way "every bit as involved" as the guy/girl in location, living with whatever deprivations his or her situation requires, including the likelihood of being shot or blown up.

There is no comparison.

Accepted - wrt the "every bit" bit.

 

[2RCR_SIG_fox]

He seems to understand the situation in the Mideast and all the players and factions.

 

[Journeyman]

He seems to understand the situation in the Mideast and all the players and factions.

OK, that's a nice enough opinion.....as opinions go, I guess.  But it begs the question, based on what?

I personally don't believe that anyone understands the situation in the Mideast and all the players and factions. Why do you think differently?

I mean, sure, he seems like a cool dude. But his deployments have been to Bosnia and Afghanistan; those places are not the Middle East. His civie background is policing in Vancouver, working gangs. If you follow the news, those gangs tend  to be more Asian than Arab; how would that give him any special insights into Middle Eastern culture, politics, players?


Welcome to the site. Try to avoid throwing out one-liners without any justification, sources, points of discussion, etc.  Some  people here get flinchy. 

 

[YZT580]

I hereby withdraw the phrase "every bit". 

 

[Kirkhill]

I hereby withdraw the phrase "every bit".

Phew! Thank God for that.  [

 

[Edward Campbell]

The Minister of National Defence addresses both the ISIS mission and refugees and Canadians' reactions to them both in this video.

 

[jollyjacktar]

I see he's still getting used to speaking to the press.  While he asked for it by virtue of running for office, I don't envy his time now in the spotlight.  Hopefully he'll smooth out more down the road.

 

[Old Sweat]

Maybe when asked a hard question, he should just take a selfie. It works for his boss.