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C3 Howitzer Replacement

Archer comes in at around 35 to 38 tonnes. A Leo 2 at around 65. While a second fleet, lighter, fleet of trailers could do, I tend to favour the concept of one fleet type.

Essentially flatbeds are items not in constant use. To have two fleets on standby much of the time is a wasted resource. It's mostly an issue of determining the maximum fleet needed at any given time to move the combined force that needs to be moved. i.e. do the guns and IFVs and tanks need to be moved concurrently or can they be moved in discrete packages or mixed packages. Essentially, and IMHO, the best thing is to have all flatbeds of the same high-end capacity so that at the tactical level there is the greatest amount of flexibility available in how to handle a strategic level displacement.

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Thanks FJAG,

Not at all up to speed on heavy armour or artillery. I've seen a few units on Avalanche duty in BC but mostly it's the old forts like the Halifax citadel where I see the guns. And black powder sure isn't what we dealing with in this discussion here. For reference the Archer is coming in at around the same weight as a D8 bulldozer (roadbuilding/moving serious rock) and the Leo 2 is around the D10 range (heavy mining operations). Mostly what I deal with though are D6 units which are more like 25 tonnes in weight so it's a different lowboy used again....we're also using smaller units since they don't sink as much in the swamps :).

But I view artillery like air support....expensive to have in holding patterns but god do you love it when you're on the ground and it's covering your butt.

Thanks for the insight,
foresterab
 
The industrial vehicles that they are based on, also get low bedded to worksites, so it makes sense, they are optimized for offroad use, you can drive them on the highway, but they are not optimized for that and just increases maintenance.
 

View attachment 90366

Unimog 2450L

12 tonnes. 100 km/h on road. Airportable in a CC-130
18 rounds on board. 6 Rounds per minute.

5 Crew - Exposed while firing. Limited ammunition capacity.
You've already identified the key issues about this gun as to why I'm not too fond of it, just for the fun of it let's talk about what I like.

It has a 155/L52 barrel and could be relatively easily adapted to an automated fire control system we already use.

It has a relatively decent automated assisted ammo handling system at the breach,

It's relatively inexpensive compared to some other offerings in this class.

It has a a good history of sales and deliveries (albeit there is a large backlog to work through)

They have a good track record of mounting the system on a variety of vehicles - which makes me think that we could develop a good SEV versions of the ACSV as both a gun carrier and as an ammo limber vehicle.

I still want to see a gun where the crew operates under armour rather than in the open and supported by a good limber vehicle.

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You've already identified the key issues about this gun as to why I'm not too fond of it, just for the fun of it let's talk about what I like.

It has a 155/L52 barrel and could be relatively easily adapted to an automated fire control system we already use.

It has a relatively decent automated assisted ammo handling system at the breach,

It's relatively inexpensive compared to some other offerings in this class.

It has a a good history of sales and deliveries (albeit there is a large backlog to work through)

They have a good track record of mounting the system on a variety of vehicles - which makes me think that we could develop a good SEV versions of the ACSV as both a gun carrier and as an ammo limber vehicle.

I still want to see a gun where the crew operates under armour rather than in the open and supported by a good limber vehicle.

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I wonder how it would fare as a Reserve force staple with a good supply of those HVP AD rounds?
 
I wonder how it would fare as a Reserve force staple with a good supply of those HVP AD rounds?
I don't have any info on any reserve units anywhere using Caesar but quite frankly if the US ARNG can handle M109A7s then I really don't see an issue so long as the appropriate arrangements are made for their maintenance and access for training (The old argument that our armouries are well made for marching infantry out the front door but little else. I paraded at Moss Park which was brand spanking new in 1966 and you could barely drive a deuce through the back door unless the tarp was in the low position.)

Ammo isn't a reserve issue. It's an army capability issue. What we stock, and how much of it, is very important but only interacts with reservists on the training side if there are specific special handling issues associated with it.

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I don't have any info on any reserve units anywhere using Caesar but quite frankly if the US ARNG can handle M109A7s then I really don't see an issue so long as the appropriate arrangements are made for their maintenance and access for training (The old argument that our armouries are well made for marching infantry out the front door but little else. I paraded at Moss Park which was brand spanking new in 1966 and you could barely drive a deuce through the back door unless the tarp was in the low position.)

Ammo isn't a reserve issue. It's an army capability issue. What we stock, and how much of it, is very important but only interacts with reservists on the training side if there are specific special handling issues associated with it.

🍻
I think our obsession with trying to match a country with a 10x larger population and far greater population density than ours is not a path to success...

Systems like the M109A7 require large training areas to use them/store them, and lots of specialized techs to keep them running. If we wanted a couple of ResF batteries in Brandon/Winnipeg, Ottawa/Pembroke, and Quebec/Valcartier, they make a fair bit of sense, but if we want ResF batteries in places like Victoria, Nanaimo, Vancouver, Halifax, St John, etc... We need systems that are useful, and require less continuous maintenance and specialized technicians. Alternatively, we need systems that are able to move themselves to the training areas in a reasonable time frame, and that can be maintained alongside the other trucks a units needs to function.

Looking at this through the lens of someone who helps manage a small specialized occupation spread out across the country in small dets, it is a massive personnel drain to try to maintain those small dets. Not just in money for postings, but also for retention and morale. People either hate where they are and want out, or love where they are and never want to leave. That works when you have a lot of room for a member to move and get promoted locally, but when you have 1 x MS 1x PO 2 per location, it inevitably leads to people getting angry/frustrated and leaving, or becoming a poison in the section.

The less complex the system, while also keeping it effective, the more likely we are to have enough functional systems(and the pers to use and fix them) when needed.
 
Often wondered what you could do with the 175mm M107 with modernized shells, guidance systems, propellent and FCS

 
I think our obsession with trying to match a country with a 10x larger population and far greater population density than ours is not a path to success...

Systems like the M109A7 require large training areas to use them/store them, and lots of specialized techs to keep them running. If we wanted a couple of ResF batteries in Brandon/Winnipeg, Ottawa/Pembroke, and Quebec/Valcartier, they make a fair bit of sense, but if we want ResF batteries in places like Victoria, Nanaimo, Vancouver, Halifax, St John, etc... We need systems that are useful, and require less continuous maintenance and specialized technicians. Alternatively, we need systems that are able to move themselves to the training areas in a reasonable time frame, and that can be maintained alongside the other trucks a units needs to function.

Looking at this through the lens of someone who helps manage a small specialized occupation spread out across the country in small dets, it is a massive personnel drain to try to maintain those small dets. Not just in money for postings, but also for retention and morale. People either hate where they are and want out, or love where they are and never want to leave. That works when you have a lot of room for a member to move and get promoted locally, but when you have 1 x MS 1x PO 2 per location, it inevitably leads to people getting angry/frustrated and leaving, or becoming a poison in the section.

The less complex the system, while also keeping it effective, the more likely we are to have enough functional systems(and the pers to use and fix them) when needed.
Canada had M109’s. The newer longer barrels and round have longer ranges, but the M109A2 or the eventual A8 doesn’t require much more than a 105mm C3 or M777 to fire.

Frankly the days of storing guns and trucks at local armories are long over - the avg militia armory doesn’t have the capacity or the resources to store the fire control or other electronic equipment that requires secure storage.

One needs to look to training centers to store equipment and conduct live fire training. Most of the drills can be done locally on simulators (which also have security requirements).
 
Canada had M109’s. The newer longer barrels and round have longer ranges, but the M109A2 or the eventual A8 doesn’t require much more than a 105mm C3 or M777 to fire.

Frankly the days of storing guns and trucks at local armories are long over - the avg militia armory doesn’t have the capacity or the resources to store the fire control or other electronic equipment that requires secure storage.

One needs to look to training centers to store equipment and conduct live fire training. Most of the drills can be done locally on simulators (which also have security requirements).
I agree that the RegF and ResF near big bases could easily have M109s. I'm not sure the M109 is better than the K9, but I'm also not enough of an expert to have a strong opinion one way or another...

How many actual training events do you intend to have for your ResF? If a simulator and a locks/alarms are tall that's needed for maintaining skillz, maybe you can have a widely dispersed occupation with a few training centres. If you need a fair bit of hands-on with the kit, you need to be close enough to it to make it feasible in a single weekend. Flying from Thunder Bay to Petawawa to spend a few hours on the guns, before turning around and flying back to Thunder Bay again makes no sense... Too much cost, and too many travel variables.

We have a fixed number of training areas, and zero political will to change it. We need systems that can be stored, and used locally for all the places not a convenient buss ride from a major CA base.

Maybe the far flung RCA batteries (troops) become AD or other GS functions, and the ones close to training areas stay tube artillery? I'm not sure that actually gives us the numbers we want, but it might be the most viable solution.
 
And here I was about to get set to watch Colbert when I get given the bait to tuck in again.
I think our obsession with trying to match a country with a 10x larger population and far greater population density than ours is not a path to success...
There is absolutely no "obsession with trying to match a country with a 10x larger population" - density or otherwise. The overarching issues are two-fold: 1) getting the right gun(s) for the army for our current mission - Latvia and Russia deterrence; and 2) taking a branch which has a low peace-time deployment requirement and restructuring it properly in an affordable RegF/ResF mix.
Systems like the M109A7 require large training areas to use them/store them, and lots of specialized techs to keep them running.
Every modern gun capable of actually being used in combat, and not merely as a training aide, needs specialized techs to keep it serviceable. It also needs a guaranteed parts supply which means we shouldn't buy something that comes in small lots from some overseas supplier. We should have learned from the L5, the LG1 and the C3 conversion by how well that went with guns were/are very uncomplicated. I'm not saying our "war gun" needs to be an M109A7, but from a serviceability, reliability and maintainability assurance, it rates very high compared to several other comparable contenders.

These guns do not need large training areas. That's the nice thing about a variable propellant charge system. You can fire at close targets at charge 1; you do not need the full 35-60km range to train a gun crew. Simulators for the M109s exist and can be mounted on armouries' floors. Don't impose limitations on systems based on 50 year old concepts - organize how we keep and maintain the systems and how we train on them to meet modern concepts. Gunners do not need to put their hands on the full gun every weekend but can maximize their use during the summers at regional training centres.
If we wanted a couple of ResF batteries in Brandon/Winnipeg, Ottawa/Pembroke, and Quebec/Valcartier, they make a fair bit of sense, but if we want ResF batteries in places like Victoria, Nanaimo, Vancouver, Halifax, St John, etc...
The first bunch makes sense of course and Montreal is not too far away from Valcartier. The Maritime units have ready access to Gagetown. Victoria/Vancouver have always been a problem and because of this shoot in Yakima. Guess what - they can use US guns already there or become loitering munitions batteries. Guns aren't the only tool in the artilleries inventory - there are UAVs, radars, forward observers etc etc.

We used to train with tanks at Meaford; we can store and train on M109s there if we put our minds to it.

Again, one needs to get their head out of the idea that the gun has to be at the armoury every day of the week.

We need systems that are useful, and require less continuous maintenance and specialized technicians.

Hundred percent agree with useful. That's why I'm dead set against "training aide guns." I think every nickel needs to go into weapons the reserves will go to war with. Disagree completely on the "continuous maintenance and specialized technicians" issue. There are no modern guns that do not require "continuous maintenance and specialized technicians." What you need are the specialized technicians and the maintenance system that keeps this gear humming. That's critical. The army has to stop underestimating the need for such folks. It's absolutely ridiculous to keep insisting the reserves can't do it so lets get them something that's "good enough for training."

Realistically the Canadian army, RegF and ResF, have the numbers (and the army probably has the need) to form and equip approximately seven artillery regiments that are war capable. (Anything more would require Stage 4 mobilization). That can easily be achieved by forming and maintaining one unit in the Maritimes (Gagetown), two in Quebec (both with equipment in Valcartier), two in Ontario (Petawawa, Meaford), two in the west (Shilo, Edmonton/Wainwright) Concentrate the equipment and maintainers in those six centres.
Alternatively, we need systems that are able to move themselves to the training areas in a reasonable time frame, and that can be maintained alongside the other trucks a units needs to function.
Why move the guns to the training area. Leave the guns at the training/maintenance centres and move the troops to them - by bus by service flight - whatever. We used to do this in 2 RCHA for all Ontario units for years. Our guns and equipment, their troops by bus for weekend exercises and summer concentrations. We flew batteries from Toronto to Shilo for the annual RCAA competitions.
Looking at this through the lens of someone who helps manage a small specialized occupation spread out across the country in small dets, it is a massive personnel drain to try to maintain those small dets. Not just in money for postings, but also for retention and morale. People either hate where they are and want out, or love where they are and never want to leave. That works when you have a lot of room for a member to move and get promoted locally, but when you have 1 x MS 1x PO 2 per location, it inevitably leads to people getting angry/frustrated and leaving, or becoming a poison in the section.
I agree to an extent. I don't want to get back to the reason why I think that the US BSB/FSC system is superior for a tech net system. (I got beat up enough on that one) But that's why I firmly believe the armoury-based field gun system is out of date. We need to adjust to one that works much better - simulations and training centres.

We have to stop trying to make an archaic system work. It won't. It needs to be reformed in many ways so that it functions. We no longer have 303s or 18pdrs. We need to equip as a modern army and adjust to the equipment.
The less complex the system, while also keeping it effective, the more likely we are to have enough functional systems(and the pers to use and fix them) when needed.
Therein lies the rub. You can't have "less complex" and "effective." Let me simply say that our M777s are at the low end of effective artillery systems and that, IMHO, the proper place for them, in any event, is with the high readiness, light air transportable forces. We can properly equip one light brigade with an 18 gun M777 regiment and that's it.

I'll add in a low-end system that is also simple and that's loitering munitions. We don't have these but, again, IMHO, there should be a battery of these in every close support regiment we filed. I'll add a third low-end system: HIMARS. Dead simple to maintain and operate. Heck, even MLRS is simple to operate - a bit harder to maintain - and both systems are operated by many countries' reserve forces. I won't even get into air defence systems operated by reservists.

The problem - and, one more time, IMHO - the idiotic problem, is that Canada is contemplating 120mm mortars for the reserve artillery because they are so simple to maintain. I have no idea as to whether we'll contemplate mounting them in ACSVs or some attachment to the ISVs but we're not adding artillery - we're using gunners to provide infantry battalions with organic mortar support rather than a system of artillery. The infantry should definitely have 120mm mortars - but manned by infantrymen.

I've argued the gunner as a mortarman issue many times before and I'll spare everyone a repeat the arguments here - I'll just bottom line it as tremendously short sighted.

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There is absolutely no "obsession with trying to match a country with a 10x larger population" - density or otherwise. The overarching issues are two-fold: 1) getting the right gun(s) for the army for our current mission - Latvia and Russia deterrence; and 2) taking a branch which has a low peace-time deployment requirement and restructuring it properly in an affordable RegF/ResF mix.
The problem is, we are obsessed with what America does, and we don't often enough stop to ask whether or not it makes sense for us. Look in most threads on here, and you will find someone saying "America does/has ____, why don't we? Often with little consideration as to the other factors that lead to America choosing to have that particular kit or capability.

In this case, population and population density matter, and I'll touch on that later.

As to your point about finding the right Reg/Res mix, I agree 100%. We need to find the right balance, and the combat elements of the CA are likely the right place to start looking for savings eventually. I say eventually, because we are already stretching our current numbers too thin, so cutting now will just break things.
Every modern gun capable of actually being used in combat, and not merely as a training aide, needs specialized techs to keep it serviceable. It also needs a guaranteed parts supply which means we shouldn't buy something that comes in small lots from some overseas supplier. We should have learned from the L5, the LG1 and the C3 conversion by how well that went with guns were/are very uncomplicated. I'm not saying our "war gun" needs to be an M109A7, but from a serviceability, reliability and maintainability assurance, it rates very high compared to several other comparable contenders.
Modern 105mm guns are being used in modern combat... I'm not suggesting we need to buy a "training gun", I'm suggesting that we don't necessarily need the entire RCA to be using fully armoured SP guns. We likely are kind of talking past each other on this a bit, as I'm not suggesting we buy a "training gun" at all. My point was more that perhaps a mixed fleet of Caesars(or similar), M109s and M777s makes sense for Canada. Caesars are a lot easier to get over the Malahat or Confederation Bridge to do a shoot at a training area than M109s.

Realistically the Canadian army, RegF and ResF, have the numbers (and the army probably has the need) to form and equip approximately seven artillery regiments that are war capable. (Anything more would require Stage 4 mobilization). That can easily be achieved by forming and maintaining one unit in the Maritimes (Gagetown), two in Quebec (both with equipment in Valcartier), two in Ontario (Petawawa, Meaford), two in the west (Shilo, Edmonton/Wainwright) Concentrate the equipment and maintainers in those six centres.
Makes too much sense, the 1153rd Independent Field Troop in Flin Flon can't be disbanded/repurposed...

I agree to an extent. I don't want to get back to the reason why I think that the US BSB/FSC system is superior for a tech net system. (I got beat up enough on that one) But that's why I firmly believe the armoury-based field gun system is out of date. We need to adjust to one that works much better - simulations and training centres.

We have to stop trying to make an archaic system work. It won't. It needs to be reformed in many ways so that it functions. We no longer have 303s or 18pdrs. We need to equip as a modern army and adjust to the equipment.
I agree and disagree. There are some things we could be doing much better with staged kit and moving people around, but there are still a lot of limitations based on geography. We need a mix of staged and on-site kit to make our ResF work across the country, unless we plant o abandon the far flung reaches of Canada. The Nav Res is standing up a unit in the Yukon, so I think that says a lot about the CAF's appetite to abandon the more remote areas.
Therein lies the rub. You can't have "less complex" and "effective." Let me simply say that our M777s are at the low end of effective artillery systems and that, IMHO, the proper place for them, in any event, is with the high readiness, light air transportable forces. We can properly equip one light brigade with an 18 gun M777 regiment and that's it.
To clarify, I wasn't referring to the combat side of things, I was referring to the actual vehicle. Track is a lot of work. Trucks are relatively simple systems compared to track, and they require less maintenance per km driven. Put a modern DGMS on a track based SPG for the ResF that are a driveable distance from useful training areas.

My idea with that was less about complexity overall, and more about maintenance hours.

I'll add in a low-end system that is also simple and that's loitering munitions. We don't have these but, again, IMHO, there should be a battery of these in every close support regiment we filed. I'll add a third low-end system: HIMARS. Dead simple to maintain and operate. Heck, even MLRS is simple to operate - a bit harder to maintain - and both systems are operated by many countries' reserve forces. I won't even get into air defence systems operated by reservists.
I 100% agree, they seem like systems that would add a lot of capability to the CAF, and have a much lower logistical footprint for training.

Why move the guns to the training area. Leave the guns at the training/maintenance centres and move the troops to them - by bus by service flight - whatever. We used to do this in 2 RCHA for all Ontario units for years. Our guns and equipment, their troops by bus for weekend exercises and summer concentrations. We flew batteries from Toronto to Shilo for the annual RCAA competitions.
Now, to the meat of our disagreement it seems.

The RCAF of today is not the RCAF of the 60s-90s. It is stretched to maintain our current operational commitments, it doesn't have the spare capacity to fly reservists across the country at the CAs whim for their training schedule. It's not impossible to fly people around, but it is expensive and time consuming... Do we expect our ResF folks to spend up to 6-12 paid hours travelling to get less than 16 hours of actual training in a weekend?
 
I agree that the RegF and ResF near big bases could easily have M109s. I'm not sure the M109 is better than the K9, but I'm also not enough of an expert to have a strong opinion one way or another...
The M109 currently lacks an M155/L52 barrel which I consider a shortcoming but one I expect to see rectified shortly and well before Canada acquires an SP.
How many actual training events do you intend to have for your ResF? If a simulator and a locks/alarms are tall that's needed for maintaining skillz, maybe you can have a widely dispersed occupation with a few training centres. If you need a fair bit of hands-on with the kit, you need to be close enough to it to make it feasible in a single weekend. Flying from Thunder Bay to Petawawa to spend a few hours on the guns, before turning around and flying back to Thunder Bay again makes no sense... Too much cost, and too many travel variables.
You can easily do three training events per year. A fall weekend exercise to shake out the people who have come back from summer training; a late spring shake-out exercise to prepare for a summer concentration; and a summer concentration. There are very good artillery and JTAC simulators already in the system although Canada would need a few more. Much of the artillery skill set is in command post exercises and reconnaissance work which can be practiced, and should be practiced, in urban areas as well.

Most regiments are within a four-hour or less bus ride. That's enough to drive out on a Friday evening, deploy at night (or first light) conduct a day and a half of live fire, conduct and afternoon of post-exercise maintenance and drive home in time to keep the pay sheet to 2,5 days training. Annual concentrations of 16.5 days should be mandatory. Yeah, you can get by with 9.5 days but I honestly think that's too little for all branches.
We have a fixed number of training areas, and zero political will to change it. We need systems that can be stored, and used locally for all the places not a convenient buss ride from a major CA base.
Most of the major ones are already a convenient bus ride away.
Maybe the far flung RCA batteries (troops) become AD or other GS functions, and the ones close to training areas stay tube artillery? I'm not sure that actually gives us the numbers we want, but it might be the most viable solution.
And now we're thinking outside the box like we should. Maybe we should even think of converting some units to better reflect the type of training that they do. Should Le Regiment de Hull become a battery for 30 Fd Regt? I'm jesting, but only a bit. For that matter should 30 Fd and 42 Fd become the third and fourth gun batteries of 2 RCHA?

IMHO the only critical issue is that we buy real weapon systems on the basis of what the army needs and not on the basis of some cheap training aide. Canada needs to build real fire support mass and structure itself accordingly.

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Modern 105mm guns are being used in modern combat... I'm not suggesting we need to buy a "training gun", I'm suggesting that we don't necessarily need the entire RCA to be using fully armoured SP guns. We likely are kind of talking past each other on this a bit, as I'm not suggesting we buy a "training gun" at all. My point was more that perhaps a mixed fleet of Caesars(or similar), M109s and M777s makes sense for Canada. Caesars are a lot easier to get over the Malahat or Confederation Bridge to do a shoot at a training area than M109s.
I see Canada being able to support one calibre - 155mm - divided between M777s and one SP type. In addition HIMARS, loitering munitions, STA and AD. That's a lot by any stretch, but all essential. I see neither a role nor need for 105mm nor for two types of SP. I'm not wed to the M109 - I'm wed to North American construction and support. I personally have no desire to drag anything over the Malahat or Confederation bridge. I really do not see a need for a gun in either place that cannot be provided by a light standing force to be flown in (in my view 2 Bde with an M777 regiment.)
I agree and disagree. There are some things we could be doing much better with staged kit and moving people around, but there are still a lot of limitations based on geography. We need a mix of staged and on-site kit to make our ResF work across the country, unless we plant o abandon the far flung reaches of Canada. The Nav Res is standing up a unit in the Yukon, so I think that says a lot about the CAF's appetite to abandon the more remote areas.
I'm a fan of small city units and subunits in that I feel that every Canadian should have an opportunity to serve. I'm well aware of the problems they create and agree totally that these must be of a size commensurate with the population centres ability to man it and its type so that it can meet its basic training needs as locally as possible.

BC has always been a problem notwithstanding their ingenuity in staying marginally viable. I doubt that they can manage, under peacetime conditions, to operate more than one full battery much less two regiments. In fact, all of Prairie and Pacific region together, an aggregate of five regiments and two independent batteries, have a hard time to field a regiment. The existing reserve system is to blame for this.

I'm in favour of keeping an artillery presence in BC but guns do not figure high in what tasks that I would give them. I would consider, loitering munitions, STA and AD but not field guns.
To clarify, I wasn't referring to the combat side of things, I was referring to the actual vehicle. Track is a lot of work. Trucks are relatively simple systems compared to track, and they require less maintenance per km driven. Put a modern DGMS on a track based SPG for the ResF that are a driveable distance from useful training areas.

My idea with that was less about complexity overall, and more about maintenance hours.
I've probably mentioned a few dozen times my tour as an M109 Bty BK so am well aware of the care and feeding of a large tracked organization. And I agree, trucks used to be simpler. Automotives however have gotten more complex and tracks actually simpler. I think there is a bit of convergence going on. One very important point. ResF vehicles see a very small fraction of the usage of RegF ones and they stand idle and available for maintenance for much of the year, IF they are provided with a proper maintenance team year round. Properly organized hybrid units can provide that.
The RCAF of today is not the RCAF of the 60s-90s. It is stretched to maintain our current operational commitments, it doesn't have the spare capacity to fly reservists across the country at the CAs whim for their training schedule. It's not impossible to fly people around, but it is expensive and time consuming... Do we expect our ResF folks to spend up to 6-12 paid hours travelling to get less than 16 hours of actual training in a weekend?

The RCAF will have 9 CC330s and I expect them to use them to fly the army (whether RegF or ResF) wherever they need to be.

I don't expect them to fly folks around every weekend for training at all.

As I pointed out the vast majority of the ResF arty units are within a four-hour bus ride to a base from where artillery can be fired.

What I do see is RegF batteries being flown to Latvia to augment the arty regiment HQ and battery there for exercises throughout the year and for ResF batteries and other hybrid Regt HQs to carry out annual summer training on prepositioned equipment there. One aircraft easily takes a battery and more while two aircraft would be more than adequate to carry a regiment. If the RCAF is hard done by one can charter a plane.

These flights would be for a three-fold reason: 1st it demonstrates deterrence to have our people exercise in their expected theatre of operations IAW that theatres SOPs, 2nd it exercises the fly-over function for both the army, air force and CJOC, 3rd it regularly exercises the bde's FSCC in planning and command and control of a full regiment; and 4th it provides an incentive for RegF and ResF recruitment.

And with that - Good night.

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I don't have any info on any reserve units anywhere using Caesar but quite frankly if the US ARNG can handle M109A7s then I really don't see an issue so long as the appropriate arrangements are made for their maintenance and access for training (The old argument that our armouries are well made for marching infantry out the front door but little else. I paraded at Moss Park which was brand spanking new in 1966 and you could barely drive a deuce through the back door unless the tarp was in the low position.)

Ammo isn't a reserve issue. It's an army capability issue. What we stock, and how much of it, is very important but only interacts with reservists on the training side if there are specific special handling issues associated with it.

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Operating the guns is easier than maintaining and supporting the guns I would reckon.

So putting a few down with the 84th in Yarmouth is a bad idea.

Centralize them at major bases; Gagetown, Val, Pet, Somewhere west... And have reserve units rotate through them while keeping the equipment next to its maint and support services.

Of course I'm playing the imaginary game again because we don't have enough OFP RCEME or Log folks.
 
Operating the guns is easier than maintaining and supporting the guns I would reckon.

So putting a few down with the 84th in Yarmouth is a bad idea.

Centralize them at major bases; Gagetown, Val, Pet, Somewhere west... And have reserve units rotate through them while keeping the equipment next to its maint and support services.

Of course I'm playing the imaginary game again because we don't have enough OFP RCEME or Log folks.
Quite honestly there should be enough war fighting kit for each unit.

IMHO the CA has it backwards in many ways, but to me the majority of the Combat units should be ARES, while the majority of support roles being Regular Force.

I am a fan of regional training centers, where ARES equipment is stored, and used (beyond individual and dismounted support weapons, comms, other individual kit, and light vehicles) .

WRT the whole Saluting gun debacle should be a non issue. Generally in Ottawa there where two regular locations for that (Parliament Hill, and the airport) plus the War Memorial for Remembrance Day) Setting up 3-4 systems that are portable should not be an issue, and they don't need to fire live ammo.
 
Of course I'm playing the imaginary game again because we don't have enough OFP RCEME or Log folks.
The concept of their central storage as well as full-time PYs for their maintainers should be part and parcel to any purchase of new guns and retention of the M777s. Like any hybrid organization there should be sufficient full-timers allocated for peace-time service and enough part-timers trained for war-time deployments.

The PY game is a tough one in the CAF but if push comes to shove sufficient peace-time maintainers need to come out of gunner PYs. (there are probably enough CWO and MWO positions doing ERE in Ottawa that could be converted to twice their number in the way of the Pte to MCpl wrench turners needed on the shop floor.

It's not just personnel though. Many of our current serviceability problems arise out of parts supplies for a variety of reasons including IP. That has to be fully corrected.

Incidentally, I see most artillery units as being 30/70 hybrid units manned by one full-time 100/0 (gun bty) and three part-time (10/90) batteries (two gun one loitering) with a mix in the HQ Bty (ie the C&C and CSS battery) There are some complexities that need to be adjusted for (FSCCs and observers currently in an OP bty and an STA bty mainly); but that too is doable.
WRT the whole Saluting gun debacle should be a non issue.
I see saluting guns as a simple solution. One can train new people to operate a C3 as a saluting gun in a day or so. Sights and recoil systems are of no consequence. As long as the tires are sound and the elevation gear and trigger lock are operating (which they all do generally) and there is a tow vehicle available, Bob's your uncle. You probably only need around 50 guns (four plus a spare in each province) the rest can be kept for parts.

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