Battle of Hoth revisionist history

[ArmyRick]

Who likes Star Wars? Specifically the Empire Strikes Back?

I want to do a little fun arm chair quarterbacking. Lets review the infamous battle of Hoth. If your unfamiliar, please Reference Star Wars Episode 5 and refresh your memory.

Now, from knowing how it turned out, how would you do things differently? Either from the perspectives of the Rebels or the Imperials.

GO!

 

[OldSolduer]

I is a Star Wars fan - its difficult to say what I would have done given they use directed energy weapons and all.

I would definitely train my stormtroopers in the Marksmanship Principles. They can't hit shit.

 

[ArmyRick]

I'll go first.

I think the imperials were wise to use AT AT to cover such wide open ground but felt they should have had more AT ST (Scout Walkers) to protect flanks. I also wonder why the Empire did not provide cover with either gun ships or TIE Fighters? That certainly seemed like it would saved a few AT ATs from being taken out.

Once the shield generator was destroyed, why didn't the Star Destroyers move in and bomb/block the rebels in?

From the Rebels perspective, maybe instead of being so dependant on a conventional defensive position which proved to be ineffectual, maybe they should have rounded up some troops on Tauntauns and move rapidly to get behind the AT ATs and attack the landing zone site?
What about deploying the X wings against the AT AT instead of surface speeders? X Wings carry way more fire power but are much less maneuverable in the atmosphere.

Also the withdrawal was called way too latye for the troops on the gound IMO

 

[ArmyRick]

I is a Star Wars fan - its difficult to say what I would have done given they use directed energy weapons and all.

I would definitely train my stormtroopers in the Marksmanship Principles. They can't hit shit.

Better trained stormtroopers cost the Empire more money, and the empire was frankly happy to use them as a cannon fodder. They were way more obsessed with bigger projects and larger gear.

 

[OldSolduer]

Better trained stormtroopers cost the Empire more money, and the empire was frankly happy to use them as a cannon fodder. They were way more obsessed with bigger projects and larger gear.

Like the Death Stars.....until they get blowed up by some renegade rebel scum....

 

[Good2Golf]

Like the Death Stars.....until they get blowed up by some renegade rebel scum....

…running around in an aluminum falcon…

 

[OldSolduer]

…running around in an aluminum falcon…

Which was a pretty tough bird considering they had to bypass the compressor to jump to hyperspace.....

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Which was a pretty tough bird considering they had to bypass the compressor to jump to hyperspace.....

That, right there, voided the warranty.

 

[OldSolduer]

That, right there, voided the warranty.

I don't think there ever was a warranty. Han won it in a card game from Lando Calrisian.

The Falcon is like that 69 Dart people would buy and then stick huge engines in.

 

[IKnowNothing]

Who likes Star Wars? Specifically the Empire Strikes Back?

I want to do a little fun arm chair quarterbacking. Lets review the infamous battle of Hoth. If your unfamiliar, please Reference Star Wars Episode 5 and refresh your memory.

Now, from knowing how it turned out, how would you do things differently? Either from the perspectives of the Rebels or the Imperials.

GO!

Party pooper from the rebel side- no tactical improvements on the ground are going to change things- any extra time bought gives the the Imperial fleet time to get their Interdictor Cruisers in place with the gravity well generators that will keep any ships from escaping- carried forward all a ground victory does is set up a perfect blockade and siege and a complete strategic loss.

On the more ruthless side- Rebel leadership knows that they're not going to have enough time for a full evacuation- there will be transports either destroyed or captured on the ground- send some of the extra ships up at the same time as the early loaded ones to use the cover of the ion cannon for kamikaze runs and knock out some Star Destroyers

 

[ArmyRick]

Party pooper from the rebel side- no tactical improvements on the ground are going to improve things- any extra time bought gives the the Imperial fleet time to get their Interdictor Cruisers in place with the gravity well generators that will keep any ships from escaping- carried forward all a ground victory does is set up a perfect blockade and siege and a complete strategic loss.

On the more ruthless side- Rebel leadership knows that they're not going to have enough time for a full evacuation- there will be transports either destroyed or captured on the ground- send some of the extra ships up at the same time as the early loaded ones to use the cover of the ion cannon for kamikaze runs and knock out some Star Destroyers

Or the high risk ships get up there and spread out forcing the imperial fleet to spread out even more?

 

[Remius]

I'll go first.

Nerd alert on my part

I think the imperials were wise to use AT AT to cover such wide open ground but felt they should have had more AT ST (Scout Walkers) to protect flanks. I also wonder why the Empire did not provide cover with either gun ships or TIE Fighters? That certainly seemed like it would saved a few AT ATs from being taken out.

Likely over confidence that AT-ATs would be more than enough. They did use AT STs though. But if you dive into some of the lore, apparently the intense cold weather and winds on Hoth made fighter support very difficult. The rebels had modified speeders for that environnement.

Once the shield generator was destroyed, why didn't the Star Destroyers move in and bomb/block the rebels in?

Possibly because ground forces were already at the base and had begun their assault by then. But also they were trying to unfuck themselves after losing the element of surprise and trying to stop the fleeing rebels.

From the Rebels perspective, maybe instead of being so dependant on a conventional defensive position which proved to be ineffectual, maybe they should have rounded up some troops on Tauntauns and move rapidly to get behind the AT ATs and attack the landing zone site?

Small tauntaun actions were actually done but remember that these were more akin to small recce units. Not anything that could really do anything in force.

What about deploying the X wings against the AT AT instead of surface speeders? X Wings carry way more fire power but are much less maneuverable in the atmosphere.

Same issues the imperials had. If they had retrofitted the wings for the elements, then they likely would have suffered trying to get away and escorting their ships out. They were most likely on standby for stellar travel and fighting and not outfitted for the elements on Hoth.

Also the withdrawal was called way too latye for the troops on the gound IMO

That force at echo station was a delaying force. They were not going to win. They just needed enough time for the main body to get away. Most knew this would be a suicide mission.

 

[KevinB]

Channeling my most ruthless side.

Suicide X-Wings that jump into hyperspace through Star Destroyers…

On the ground, TBIED’s (Tauntaun borne Improvised Explosive Device) that close with the AT-AT.

Also I’d have tried to find more of the nasty Snow Monsters that tried to eat Luke, and stunned them and then dropped them on concentrations of Storm Troopers/Snow Troopers.

 

[Remius]

Channeling my most ruthless side.

Suicide X-Wings that jump into hyperspace through Star Destroyers…

On the ground, TBIED’s (Tauntaun borne Improvised Explosive Device) that close with the AT-AT.

Also I’d have tried to find more of the nasty Snow Monsters that tried to eat Luke, and stunned them and then dropped them on concentrations of Storm Troopers/Snow Troopers.

There is actually a deleted scene with the snow monster actually doing that…

 

[IKnowNothing]

Same issues the imperials had. If they had retrofitted the wings for the elements, then they likely would have suffered trying to get away and escorting their ships out. They were most likely on standby for stellar travel and fighting and not outfitted for the elements on Hoth.

That force at echo station was a delaying force. They were not going to win. They just needed enough time for the main body to get away. Most knew this would be a suicide mission.

Don't have to retrofit them all though- just enough to give you a major advantage against an attacking force that will have zero air cover.

 

[FJAG]

Better trained stormtroopers cost the Empire more money, and the empire was frankly happy to use them as a cannon fodder. They were way more obsessed with bigger projects and larger gear.

So ... the Empire is really an analogy to Putin's Russia. Great prediction on Lucas's part.

 

[Remius]

Don't have to retrofit them all though- just enough to give you a major advantage against an attacking force that will have zero air cover.

The rebels likely thought that maybe the speeders could do.

But they weren’t looking for a pitched battle anyways, they were hiding and running at the time.

I’m pretty sure this was the first real pitched ground battle the rebels had with the Empire.

 

[Remius]

I is a Star Wars fan - its difficult to say what I would have done given they use directed energy weapons and all.

I would definitely train my stormtroopers in the Marksmanship Principles. They can't hit shit.

I think there was a story that marksmanship wasn’t the issue. There was some sabotage happening in the industries that manufactured those blasters.

 

[ArmyRick]

I think there was a story that marksmanship wasn’t the issue. There was some sabotage happening in the industries that manufactured those blasters.

Bad batch is starting to show some of the real differences between stormtroopers and clone troopers

 

[Remius]

Bad batch is starting to show some of the real differences between stormtroopers and clone troopers

Yeah and it’s pretty cool to see the transition.

There is a guy on YouTube (generation tech i think) who breaks this stuff down. He explains that the empire transitioned from clone troopers army of the republic who were designed and trained for war fighting to the imperial forces who were more akin to a heavily armed police force. The Inperial Navy being the primary focus and able to project anywhere at any time but that the ground forces were more about keeping the population in check than anything requiring massive ground battles like the clones did.