Army Cadet Dress Regs updated 46-01

[rwgill]

Thanks Vern.

I'll need to check out our supply later this afternoon, though I believe that we will just break down and buy some CFMS buckles.  They look much better, IMHO.

 

[armyvern]

Thanks Vern.

I'll need to check out our supply later this afternoon, though I believe that we will just break down and buy some CFMS buckles.  They look much better, IMHO.

I'll check Wednesday morning to see which is the current style on contract. I know there's a case of brand new ones sitting beside my whites in the MSA -- I'll just open 'er up and see what's inside; just before I march all the troops from B6 down to the Camp Argonaut parade square for Freedom of the City practice. I figure, giving them about 200 "change arms" on the march on the way down and back afterwards should suffice to irritate the hell out of them.  8) It'll be 0630hrs - I can blame it on "lack of sleep!!" 

I hear it's going to rain too ... so all of you driving by us ... be nice with those puddles - it's not like we can get any damn raingear in these parts.  >

 

[Nfld Sapper]

LOL saw the board the other day at clothing and noticed:

CADPAT Rain Gear ETA 12-18 Months
OD Green Rain Gear ETA 12 Months

 

[armyvern]

LOL saw the board the other day at clothing and noticed:

CADPAT Rain Gear ETA 12-18 Months
OD Green Rain Gear ETA 12 Months

And trust me -- they aren't lying.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - "Can you all say Command Pools"?? <--- Logistical friggin' nightmares that they are. At least the CLS has made Gagetown the number TWO priority on the list - Saint Jean is number one.

Ohhh ... and underwear just went "Ops restricted" again last week; so don't even bother trying to exchage them if you're not deploying.  :

 

[Nfld Sapper]

And not to mention all the other kit shortages like ground sheets

 

[armyvern]

And not to mention all the other kit shortages like ground sheets

92 items. 92 items of Land Operational kit that are suffering from critical national shortages.

You should see the CLS' Op Clothing Plan - it's full of requirements to set up Command Loan Pools for these items. Rain gear. Ground sheets. Gas Masks. Rucksacks. Mukluks. ... WOW.

That's the problem with introduction of new kit items into the CF ... they never seem to account for the actual bonified requirement for the "old" stuff to STILL be purchased (like raingear - that the troops desperately need around here) while we await the arrival of the "new" stuff into the system. And the troops suffer for that lack of insight. They seem to forget that some of these "new" items are taking years to enter our system in enough quantities to make it out to all the troops ... what the heck am I supposed to issue to a soldier in the meantime!!??

My knitting skills are rusty, but getting better.

 

[Jabrwock]

A blank web buckle is silly?? Why's that?? It seems to be fine for the RegF and ResF to wear a blank brass buckle on their DEU belts. Or is it all about the LCF?

Sorry, I meant "blank with the holes there because we removed the tri-force". Because it's obvious something's missing.

And yes, it's partly LCF.  ;D

 

[armyvern]

Sorry, I meant "blank with the holes there because we removed the tri-force". Because it's obvious something's missing.

And yes, it's partly LCF.  ;D

Oh sorry. My bad, but I thought you were talking about the trouser belts in your post vice the ceremonial belts. Trouser belts of course ... have no holes in the plain buckles. 

Neither have I.
Just the web-belt though, Air side can't wear tri-force trouser belts. I expect it won't actually come into force until they have a replacement. I have yet to see an Army Cadet crest trouser belt buckle or web-belt buckle. And the idea of a blank web buckle is just silly.

 

[Franko]

It may be pepper out of flyshit, but do you really want a blanket policy change to Cadet Dress Regs to result in ReGF or ResF Unit Regimental funds being required to purchase and "donate" your brass buckles to affiliated cadet corps without having a say in such matters? It is after all your Regiment's money - you might want to know and have some say.

What I was getting at was why all the fuss over the Tri Service buckle in the first place.

It's in the system and was used in the past by nearly every cadet corps when I was in....what has changed since those times?

There are still the 3 elements in the Cadets are there not? I don't think that one of them could be mistaken for an actual soldier/ sailor/ airmen on a parade.

Seems that anything even remotely linking cadets with the CF at all is being removed, slowly over time. Now belt buckles? Come on.

If kids want to join Scouts or Girl Guides they do.

Kids join Cadets for the military aspect of it so why is someone, somewhere trying their damnest to beat the military out of it?

As for giving the 2 affiliated Corps buckles, we have in the past. They even come up to Pet for our Regimental parades as well and, with enough numbers, fall in with us for a march past. So no, I don't...nor does the Regimental Association have a problem giving up a bit of money for kids to hold their head a little higher with pride.

Actually I've never heard anyone, at any rank level, complain about anything dealing with our affil corps. If anything they jump at the chance to work with them or give up some time to help them out. It's a really good relationship that's been developed over the years.

But I digress to your original question....

I don't want to see a mandated requirement for Regiments/ units to fork over association funds to cadets.

Regards

 

[armyvern]

I see and understand your post.

Times have certainly changed since the days when I was in Army Cadets. Unfortunately, it is today's society (and vote counts) which govern how rules get put into place governing cadets.

You and I wouldn't mistake them for soldiers or members of the CF, but there's a whole hell of a lot of ultra-left, and even just slightly left, folks who equate cadets with: The CF is brainwashing children and using child soldiers.

More than one thread just on this site about BS like that. Sometimes, it's not actually what is fact that rules the day, but the perception of the actuality amongst the general Canadian population.

And to get back to the Regimental affiliations - like you every Unit that I have come into contact with is more than happy to support their affiliated cadet corps, and like I said, it's more a matter of "not mandating" it rather than the "Regiment won't do it". MOST won't have issues with it at all.

 

[rwgill]

Seems that anything even remotely linking cadets with the CF at all is being removed, slowly over time. Now belt buckles? Come on.

WRT belt buckles, if anything, Cadets are going back to their roots.

Prior to unification, Army Cadets, in particular, wore one of two possible symbols:  Royal Canadian Army Cadets or Affiliated Unit.  Unification, some say, left Cadets in a very grey area (this actually did happen to the CSofC/CIL/CIC).  Perhaps today, everything is headed back to the way it was.

The rank/slip on debate only started when Army Cadets switched to the standard CF Army insignia.  Prior to the 90s, cadets wore red rank.  You could not "discuss" what was a cadet and what was not.  With the switch to gold CF rank, cadets and the leadership became confused as to what was acceptable and what was not.  The CATO, if anything, is making things much clearer.

 

[armyvern]

WRT belt buckles, if anything, Cadets are going back to their roots.

Prior to unification, Army Cadets, in particular, wore one of two possible symbols:  Royal Canadian Army Cadets or Affiliated Unit.  Unification, some say, left Cadets in a very grey area (this actually did happen to the CSofC/CIL/CIC).  Perhaps today, everything is headed back to the way it was.

The rank/slip on debate only started when Army Cadets switched to the standard CF Army insignia.  Prior to the 90s, cadets wore red rank.  You could not "discuss" what was a cadet and what was not.  With the switch to gold CF rank, cadets and the leadership became confused as to what was acceptable and what was not.  The CATO, if anything, is making things much clearer.

So true. And, now that I think back to my days in Army Cadets ... the ranks on my sleevs & eventually the bars on my shoulders - were red.

I do recall wearing ceremonial buckles that bore the Regimental insignia of The RCR (2647 RCAC was an affiliated Unit of 2nd Bn The RCR); prior to us receiving those buckles from them for our ceremonial whites, I'm pretty sure that we wore a cermonial buckle that had the RCAC crest engraved/etched into it. <--- I could be rong here, it's been a couple decades.

That was back in the day though when we actually got a couple of occasions to go into the field with them and participate in some of their exercises for a weekend or two vice the corp just heading out to Blue Mountain on the back of a deuce and a half by ourselves and left to our own devices. Way back in '85, being a chick, of course they tossed me into the QM to work while we were out there with them.

It was cool. 

 

[rwgill]

That was back in the day though when we actually got a couple of occasions to go into the field with them and participate in some of their exercises for a weekend or two vice the corp just heading out to Blue Mountain on the back of a deuce and a half by ourselves and left to our own devices. Way back in '85, being a chick, of course they tossed me into the QM to work while we were out there with them.

The training still happens today, with some rules, but cadets love that training.

QM couldn't have been that bad............since you are still doing it.

 

[armyvern]

The training still happens today, with some rules, but cadets love that training.

QM couldn't have been that bad............since you are still doing it.

My dad was a supply tech ... long before I was a cadet.

If you have any idea how well girls going through puberty get along with their mothers -- you'll understand why I was forced from the house each Tuesday and Thursday night by my mother to go work with him at the QM in the Armouries ... mother needed a break from all my bitchin'. I guess, it just grew on me.  ;D

 

[rwgill]

If you have any idea how well girls going through puberty get along with their mothers -- you'll understand why I was forced from the house each Tuesday and Thursday night by my mother to go work with him at the QM in the Armouries ... mother needed a break from all my bitchin'. I guess, it just grew on me.  ;D

I have a girl who's 4 so I guess that I'll have to wait and see. ;D  Perhaps there is still a chance that she will become Daddy's girl.

On topic though, I like many of the changes.  I especially like the fact that Cadet Jacket is specifically mentioned for highland cadets.  It was always intended/permitted to be modified into a doublet and now units are required to wear it.  For years, highland cadets have been wearing altered DEU jackets.

 

[gwp]

WRT belt buckles, if anything, Cadets are going back to their roots.

Prior to unification, Army Cadets, in particular, wore one of two possible symbols:  Royal Canadian Army Cadets or Affiliated Unit.  The rank/slip on debate only started when Army Cadets switched to the standard CF Army insignia.  Prior to the 90s, cadets wore red rank.  You could not "discuss" what was a cadet and what was not.  With the switch to gold CF rank, cadets and the leadership became confused as to what was acceptable and what was not.  The CATO, if anything, is making things much clearer.

This falls in the catagory of "everything old is new again"
Before cadets adopted the present "bush jacket" type uniform (in the 1970's) Army and Air Cadets wore a uniform that was equivalent of the Army and the Air Force "Battle Dress" (with puttees).  Except the cadet tunics were lined.  Sea Cadets wore the RCN uniform with similar ranks. 

The army cadet sleeve insignia was Affiliated Unit flash ... Army Cadet in gold underneath ... the maple leaf patch with RCAC across it.  Rank insignia were the same white/Khaki on khaki for army cadets and white/silver on blue for air.

For army cadets marksmanship, service stripes, master cadet badges were gold on khaki.  I still have mine.

In the early 1960's senior cadets were wearing TWs. with brass affiliated unit shoulder titles and collar dogs but with the army cadet flash and maple leaf below on the sleeve as described above. 

 

[rwgill]

Before cadets adopted the present "bush jacket" type uniform (in the 1970's) Army and Air Cadets wore a uniform that was equivalent of the Army and the Air Force "Battle Dress" (with puttees).  Except the cadet tunics were lined.  Sea Cadets wore the RCN uniform with similar ranks. 

Is this what you are referring to?

 

[gwp]

Is this what you are referring to?

That was about 20 years earlier.  This is the era:

 

[rwgill]

Is that you in the pic?