Am I too old, fat, or fit in? 2001 to 2016

[PMedMoe]

They seem to think that I would spend most of my time taking orders/doing things that I don't agree with.. This is something that would bother me. Is this what it's like as a LogO or Pilot?

That's pretty much what it's like for everyone in the CF.  You will have to take orders from someone higher.

 

[Ostrozac]

I'm curious about the culture at CF (particularly Pilots/Logistic officers). Whenever I mention to friends or family I'm interested in CF, they reply that I would probably dislike the culture. Obviously there is structure and a hierarchy. These are two things I have lacked exposure to in the last few years, but don't necessarily dislike. They seem to think that I would spend most of my time taking orders/doing things that I don't agree with.. This is something that would bother me. Is this what it's like as a LogO or Pilot?

Well, in the CF you do what you're told. You don't get to set your own agenda or priorities. This is common in many career paths, public sector and private sector. Bankers work for the bank. Airline pilots fly their routes. Professional hockey players get traded. That's not really a "culture" thing -- it's more a characteristic of working in a structured environment.

What is the "culture" of the Reg Force? Be prepared to get transferred every few years. Work hard and do your part. Travel, taskings, field time and sea time are all potentially part of the mix. But different units will have vastly different cultures: the culture of a tactical helicopter unit in Valcartier is different from that of the challenger jet squadron in Ottawa. Being a logistics officer in the navy will feel very different from being the quartermaster of a mechanized infantry battalion.

So it's hard to generalize.

 

[Container]

They seem to think that I would spend most of my time taking orders/doing things that I don't agree with.. This is something that would bother me. Is this what it's like as a LogO or Pilot?

How can you have an opinion on what you agree with? You have no training or experience in either job? That seems like a major hurdle.

 

[chrisf]

They seem to think that I would spend most of my time taking orders/doing things that I don't agree with..

What makes you think you wouldn't agree with the orders?

 

[tmckendry]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I spent some time looking to blogs/journals of some officers and got a better feel for what life in the CF.

What makes you think you wouldn't agree with the orders?

Two ways:

Orders will be given to complete a task in a way that I think is sub-optimal. I also figure that if I made a suggestion on what I think is more efficient that I would be ignored and/or disciplined. Is this a reasonable assumption?

Orders to complete a task that I don't believe is worth doing. Obviously this is subjective.. I'd  expect this is any structured career, and can deal with it. However, I expect more of it in the CF or public sector compared to say a small business. Thoughts? 


[/quote]

How can you have an opinion on what you agree with? You have no training or experience in either job? That seems like a major hurdle.

I don't understand this question.

If your implying that I can't know what the culture of the CF(LogO/Pilot) until I go experience it for myself... I agree.

I'm trying to get as much information as I can about issues important to me before I make any decisions.

 

[Guelph]

I went through BMQ at 44yrs old. The worst that happened to me was being called Grampa up until our first fitness test. I was also asked how I was going to handle the whole BMQ situation. My reply was: "How many 44 yr olds can leave their wife and kids to go on a guilt free 14-week adventure with a bunch of 20yr olds? . . . and get paid for it?" It was the most fun I've had in my whole young life!! BTW: I finished 3rd in a platoon that started with 64. I sincerely believe it's 90% attitude. Love this career choice!!

That just f'n SEALED it for me. THANK YOU!

 

[Loachman]

Orders will be given to complete a task in a way that I think is sub-optimal. I also figure that if I made a suggestion on what I think is more efficient that I would be ignored and/or disciplined. Is this a reasonable assumption?

Depending on your experience level, the personal characteristics of your boss, and your position, you will have a fair amount of "say".

We expect all aircrew, regardless of rank, to participate fully in missions. Suggestions, and post-mission constructive critique, are encouraged as that leads to improvements in mission accomplishment and safety for all.

I have considerable latitude in making decisions.

We are not lobotomized in the recruiting centre.

Beheading people for voicing an opinion was removed from the list of offences and punishments at least two years ago.

Orders to complete a task that I don't believe is worth doing. Obviously this is subjective.. I'd  expect this is any structured career, and can deal with it. However, I expect more of it in the CF or public sector compared to say a small business. Thoughts? 

You may or may not be privy to all of the information used in the decision-making process. Information-passage, analysis, and decision-making is far better in the CF than in most civilian organizations.

I have not always agreed with higher decisions, but I generally understand the reasons behind them and therefore accept them. I have never been the blindly-obediant sort, but have had no problem with supporting my commanding officer's/commander's direction.

We expect people to think. Automatons would not survive for long in our environment.

I have enjoyed a lot of freedom, variety, flexibility, satisfaction, and responsibility during my career. I cannot imagine finding anywhere nearly as much anywhere else.

 

[tmckendry]

Loachman, your reply was extremely well-written and informative. Thank you.

 

[Towards_the_gap]

Depending on your experience level, the personal characteristics of your boss, and your position, you will have a fair amount of "say".

We expect all aircrew, regardless of rank, to participate fully in missions. Suggestions, and post-mission constructive critique, are encouraged as that leads to improvements in mission accomplishment and safety for all.

I have considerable latitude in making decisions.

We are not lobotomized in the recruiting centre.

Beheading people for voicing an opinion was removed from the list of offences and punishments at least two years ago.

You may or may not be privy to all of the information used in the decision-making process. Information-passage, analysis, and decision-making is far better in the CF than in most civilian organizations.

I have not always agreed with higher decisions, but I generally understand the reasons behind them and therefore accept them. I have never been the blindly-obediant sort, but have had no problem with supporting my commanding officer's/commander's direction.

We expect people to think. Automatons would not survive for long in our environment.

I have enjoyed a lot of freedom, variety, flexibility, satisfaction, and responsibility during my career. I cannot imagine finding anywhere nearly as much anywhere else.

This is from a very experienced officer. And to show just how wrong your friends may have it, I wholeheartedly agree with his post, as a Sgt (well former I guess now) with only 12 years experience, I had a very wide latitude in which I could operate, so long as the 'mission' was accomplished. I was expected to think on my feet, and if something was fishy, to say so, and therefore play a big role in the critical thought process for many plans. I have seen, first hand, where orders were given that would have killed someone, and luckily the young cpl had his head screwed on right and say 'umm, NO!' and is alive to this day.

 

[bitBYbit]

Hi folks,

I need your advice. I was a Loyal Eddie back in the 90's and loved it. But I gave it up because my marriage was falling apart. Now I'm 46, my new wife digs the sh#t out of me, my career is set and I want to get back in. Here's the thing: the CF is just coming down from Afghanistan and I would hate for the guys to think that I sat it out because I was afraid. Or that I want back in because all the hard work and sacrifice is over. What do you think, honestly, of how I will be accepted?

Also, in the 90's there were very few courses available in the combat arms for reservists. Is that still true?

I appreciate any help you can give me. I'm really twisting myself up over this.

 

[AKa]

BitBYbit,

Apply now, don't wait.  Nobody will look down on you for taking a pause.  Given the demands of Reserve service, I am always humbled by the number of fine people willing to spend their free hours serving the Queen.

There's lots of hard work and sacrifice left. 

Cheers,

AK

 

[bitBYbit]

Thanks AK!

I appreciate the response. Went to the armoury last night to see what I could see. Some questions answered some not. One thing I found out is their BMQ is not a weekend course and runs this fall in Wainwright.  Could not find the recruiter anywhere. I'll be calling 310-ARMY I guess. Can't find a listed phone number for the LER.

 

[DAA]

Can't find a listed phone number for the LER.

The Loyal Edmonton Regiment (4th Battalion, Princess Patricia’s Canadian Light Infantry)
Brigadier James Curry Jefferson Bldg, Armoury Support Centre, room 103, 11630 - 109 Street NW
Edmonton, Alberta
T5G 2T8

Phone: 780-973-4011 ext 6443

 

[bitBYbit]

DAA where did you get that number? Even google and 411 were stymied. Many thanks though! I called 41 CBG today and left a message (310-ARMY). I'll call the unit tomorrow.

 

[Duckman54]

32 had BETTER not be too old!!  lol

Posts by miraclark, Guelph and others are very encouraging.

I just turned 39 in April, applying for DEO Pilot... passed all so far, passed Aircrew Selection in Trenton last month, awaiting Selection Board on June 24th and hopefully job-offer soon after. Thinking positive, and fully expecting BMOQ in Sept... (winter in Quebec! Yay!)  little nervous, but mainly PUMPED!  Thankfully have support of wife/family that knows I live to fly  (Comm/Multi-IFR already) and can't stand my current gig.  Like was said earlier, do this and get PAID??  Sign me up!

As for fitting in?    Attitude is everything. I'm fully aware I'm gonna be yelled at while at CFLRS by younger folks. Just gotta respect their experience. Just like getting 'evaluated' by younger flight instructors. Going in as open-minded as possible. Sure I've got lotsa life experience, but this will be completely foreign to anything I've done before.... just convinced myself I'm gonna learn to do stuff THEIR way...  I don't think I'll have any problem respecting some younger fella's 10-15 years experience! 

After all, when I was fresh outta University (and knew everything! lol), I expected others to respect my knowledge/training even tho I was younger...

'Greg.

 

[UnwiseCritic]

Bitbybit, I don't think anyone will think that you chose to sit out on afghanistan. If someone does think that they are probably an incompetent moron whose opinion doesn't matter. The only way people would think less of you is if you can't do your job.

As for fitting in as an old guy, they usually get respected. We had a 48 year old on my course and there was even a 55 year old on the course ahead of us. They were more fit the most of the younger people. And the nice thing about them is they were a lot calmer. It is strange to see a 25 year old scream at an older person. But from what I saw is they were usually given more space and different kinds of punishment than the younger people.

 

[bitBYbit]

Well I did go to the Armoury this past Wednesday. And I still couldn't locate the 41 CBG recruiter. So I went looking, turned left instead of right and ended up in the SALH office. Not by chance. Gave it a lot of thought in the last while. Anyway, paperwork is in and here we go!

 

[safetysOff]

Am I too old to join/do well/fit in? 

Yes, don,t bother.

 

[muskrat89]

Yes, don,t bother.

You have less than 20 posts and about half of them contain some caustic tripe. Learn to contribute in a constructive manner or you will be on your way.

Army.ca Staff

 

[srvn2sv]

bitBYbit,

Sorry I haven't read the whole thread (will later) but FYI...I'm 44.  Applied last year as a Med Tech still waiting on PLAR.  Thinking of using my 18 years of street medic skill in a new role with 2 Field Amb (at least that's where I'd like to go).  You're never too old.  And for the days that you feel too old.....I'll carry you.

I'm not worried about being yelled at by someone younger, my 33 year old wife's been doing that for years.  lol

See you out there.

srvn2sv