Allowances - Post Living Differential (PLD) [MERGED]

[SeaKingTacco]

I am not sure extra/better PLD will improve much if there is still limited to no rental or purchase housing stock in a location.

I think the better long term solution is to actually fix the abysmal Single Quarters/RHU situation at most bases.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Also on Post down here the Base Exchange has cheap fuel, and a variety of other items that are taxed significantly lower than off post.

But having seen both sides of the coin, CAF members generally have it much better financially at the NCO ranks than US Mil Pers.

That said the on post living quantity and quality is significantly better down here.

Some of the PXs I’ve been too were very impressive and more like a mid to small mall vice what our CANEX offers, not to mention Commissary.

Large ones that come to mind; Sigonella, Kadena (probably overall the most impressive; you could buy cars there IIRC) and Yokota.

https://m.facebook.com/KadenaExchange/

 

[KevinB]

Some of the PXs I’ve been too were very impressive and more like a mid to small mall vice what our CANEX, not to mention Commissary.

Large ones that come to mind; Siginella, Kadena (probably overall the most impressive; you could buy cars there IIRC) and Yokota.

https://m.facebook.com/KadenaExchange/

Bases down here are almost isolated City States for many purposes -- entirely self contained in the fact that they can exist with little exterior interaction if you live on Post.

 

[OldSolduer]

Bases down here are almost isolated City States for many purposes -- entirely self contained in the fact that they can exist with little exterior interaction if you live on Post.

Fort Ord was like that. So is Fort Irwin which has to be. Fort Carson was also impressive.

Adding: I was particularly impressed with the low prices and availability of consumer goods including beer, cigarettes etc. You know the essentials of infantry life.

 

[Ostrozac]

Went through a bit of math calculations between a CAF MCpl in Gagetown and a US Army Sgt in Fort Bragg after Federal and Provincial taxes a CAF MCpl is Sitting at about 37500 USD a year without R&Q with R&Q around 30000 USD a US Army Sgt after taxes is sitting at around 28000 but if receiving BAH it bumps him up to almost 46000 USD he's getting around 1500 a month tax free and that really makes the difference.

The big difference is that if that Sgt is ordered from Bragg to Washington DC his BAH goes from 1500 to 2400 per month. If posted to San Francisco it would be 4800 per month.

If that MCpl is posted from Gagetown (one of our most affordable large bases) to Ottawa (one of our least affordable) — he gets nothing.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

The big difference is that if that Sgt is ordered from Bragg to Washington DC his BAH goes from 1500 to 2400 per month. If posted to San Francisco it would be 4800 per month.

If that MCpl is posted from Gagetown (one of our most affordable large bases) to Ottawa (one of our least affordable) — he gets nothing.

Or conversely, he gets posted from Edmonton (in receipt of PLD, in an amount from a time when it was needed) to Kingston (where the CoL has increased 7 fold since 2009) and receives nothing.

"PLD is an Allowance and should be factored into housing costs or counted as income..." or something of the like.

 

[dimsum]

Bases down here are almost isolated City States for many purposes -- entirely self contained in the fact that they can exist with little exterior interaction if you live on Post.

Yup. NAS Sigonella was like that.

You go through the gates and you feel like you're in a base in the US. I can't remember if they took Euro or USD (probably both).

It was really weird to experience that.

 

[dimsum]

So...to loop it to the article and the obvious anger being caused (just read the Reddit threads - it's not pretty)...

What can realistically be done?

I'm not sure what priority PLD has with TB, and what they would do with it. Same with increasing pay. Same with building new housing.

Even after the article came out and MND was asked in an interview, none of the opposition parties even brought it up (or at least I missed it). You'd think that this is a complete softball for the CPC, especially during a leadership race right now.

Do we end up with a bunch of homeless military members and families? Or, more correctly, a mass exodus of CAF members?

 

[Quirky]

Do we end up with a bunch of homeless military members and families? Or, more correctly, a mass exodus of CAF members?

Likely both as each family situation is different. My guess is anyone close enough to pension will just go IR or anyone over the hump will just retire instead of being financially crippled. Dark times indeed.

 

[Weinie]

Maybe, but I have noticed a tendancy (including amongst NCO who need to be inspired by individuals by those who have commissioned and achieved success) to see that Maj or LCol with with two clasps and ask what he did to fail. Meanwhile, in response to my question as to whether the naval warfare officer badge communicates anything that cannot be inferred between an individual’s rank and the sea service badge over the opposite pocket.

I commissioned from the ranks, have two clasps, and ended up as a LCol. I don’t consider that a fail.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Yup. NAS Sigonella was like that.

You go through the gates and you feel like you're in a base in the US. I can't remember if they took Euro or USD (probably both).

It was really weird to experience that.

Yokota...the TLFs "transients living facilities" were these big apt buildings. 4 of us had a 'apt'...seperate bedrooms. full kitchen with all appliances. living room, TV....you name it. And not just 1 or 2 TLFs...lots. Never would have guessed you were on the west side of Tokyo...

 

[daftandbarmy]

Glass half full: After the recession hits, vacancies should open up:

Most Canadians concerned about recession, Yahoo/Maru poll finds​

As inflation soars and interest rates rise, Canadians are growing increasingly concerned that the economy is sinking into a recession, a new Yahoo/Maru Public Opinion poll has found.

The survey of 1,517 Canadians found that 23 per cent of respondents believe the country will experience a recession in the next three months, while a majority (55 per cent) think it is currently in the midst of one.

This comes as most Canadians reported concern about the state of the economy, with 62 per cent saying they believe it is "moving on the wrong track."

Recession concerns have been on the rise in recent weeks, as central banks around the world try to bring inflation down from some of the highest levels seen in decades via rapid interest rate hikes.

The Bank of Canada is among the central banks trying to bring skyrocketing inflation back to the target range of between one and three per cent, with its next interest rate decision on June 1. The Consumer Price Index (CPI) increased 6.8 per cent on a year-over-year basis in April, driven largely by rising food and shelter prices. With gas prices spiking again this month, economists expect inflation to continue to accelerate, with one economist predicting it could pop by more than 7 per cent.

Most Canadians concerned about recession, Yahoo/Maru poll finds

Around a quarter of Canadians believe the country will experience a recession in the next three months, while 55 per cent think it is in the midst of one.

ca.finance.yahoo.com

 

[CountDC]

"PLD is an Allowance and should NOT be factored into housing costs or counted as income..."

That is what it should read. Don't budget on PLD as it can be taken away at anytime. Makes it a bit difficult though when you say this is to help with the COL difference but don't count on it.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Watch and shoot

But hearing that changes are coming to this. Replacing with a housing assistance benefit, that will scale down in value as one rises in rank and disappearing completely at the MWO/Capt level. Not sure if different regions will get different starting values.

Don't take any of the above as gospel.

 

[Quirky]

I wonder what the differences will be.

This seems like you are punished for being a higher rank.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Financially disadvantaged maybe; I wouldn’t use “punished”.

 

[Quirky]

The pay differential in the lower ranks, especially Cpl-Mcpl isn’t that significant. Any PLD allowance that gives Cpls more money could, theoretically, make the monthly pay equal.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Financially disadvantaged maybe; I wouldn’t use “punished”.

Absolutely. I've been told this is coming before Xmas. And its already generating releases from the officer and Snr NCM world.

 

[brihard]

The pay differential in the lower ranks, especially Cpl-Mcpl isn’t that significant. Any PLD allowance that gives Cpls more money could, theoretically, make the monthly pay equal.

Depending how they structure it- MCpl isn’t even legally a rank and may see the same housing allowance as a Cpl.

Given than PLD is benchmarked off of Ottawa, and Ottawa’s housing costs have skyrocketed, honest PLD math could no longer address the issue it’s intended for. A change is needed, and an income-linked housing allowance is not a bad way to go about it. It’s not punishment for that to decrease with rank, particularly given the relatively high pay of officers.

 

[dimsum]

Absolutely. I've been told this is coming before Xmas. And its already generating releases from the officer and Snr NCM world.

Considering the amounts aren’t out yet, that seems like a bit of a flinch.