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All Things CAF and Covid/ Covid Vaccine [merged]

QV said:
I was in a similar boat at the same time including everyone I was immediately connected to, family, work colleagues, etc. For me it lasted about 3 weeks, pretty bad lung infection, no puking or stomach issues though.
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Never did puke,.....just felt so horrible I figured it was going to happen. Anyway, it could explain how, months later, I spent a 12 hour dayshift in a small control room with a guy who ended up in the hospital that night for 4 days and I didn't even test positive.
 
hattrick72 said:
Tomydoom
I'm not complaining about health measures and I have followed them. I don't have a problem with people's personal choice, I'm vaccinated. If the military mandates this vaccine, then there will be 10,000-15,000 members that have to make a tough decision and the leadership may not be happy with the numbers. (Maybe it is closer to 5,000 after seeing the empty positions posted in another thread).

Now to the point I was trying to make. We were testing asymptomatic people because apparently they can spread the virus. We were encouraging people to test without symptoms and if they came back positive they were grounded for the 14 days. The number of people that would not go and get tested without symptoms is going to be high. The main reason being they don't have sick days to cover them off if they come back positive.

We don't have a picture of confirmed spread. So by going by the number of confirmed cases is spreading misinformation. You are not doing it nefariously or to be misleading, but nonetheless it is misinformation IMHO.

Without the public health orders, the number of deaths would've been higher. I just don't think it would be much higher than double.

If we look at India they had a 1.3% death rate for confirmed cases and it is 0.03% if you look at the total population. I think the effect is fairly linear and consistent across the world population. I got this number from the Google tracker 426,000 deaths and 32,000,000 cases. I also believe they ran out of testing capability so the case count could be higher, but I haven't confirmed that memory yet.
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look at Israel the vaccinated are getting sick and dyeing, the vaccine does not work
 
Eye In The Sky said:
You're suggesting in your scenario the CDS makes this "command decision" on his/her own?

Can we talk about something more realistic, like UFOs commanded by Dragon/Unicorn hybrid warriors that use liquid bubble gum as their main offensive wpn system?
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I'm suggesting Ontario requests military assistance and the CDS complies and gives the order. I'm not suggesting the CDS wakes up one morning and decides this in their own.
 
hattrick72 said:
Ontario health determines we can't reach herd immunity unless we vaccinate the 12 and under crowd this will ensure 90% of all people are vaccinated. The emergency order that is in effect now is the same emergency order in effect for this scenario.
The CDS orders CAF personal to cordon off every city with a population higher than 100,000 people. No traffic is allowed out, unless they can prove every member in the car is vaccinated. Once the cordons are operational they announce a lockdown.
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hattrick72 said:
I'm suggesting Ontario requests military assistance and the CDS complies and gives the order. I'm not suggesting the CDS wakes up one morning and decides this in their own.
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Ok.

Are you suggesting the CDS can/does/will act unilaterally and that none of the Canadian federal government apparatus will be involved in the decision to sp/deny request from the province? Are you asking if that is the case?

This is probably a good place to start reading. QR&O: Volume I - Chapter 23 Duties In Aid Of The Civil Power - Canada.ca
 
Eye In The Sky said:
Ok.

Are you suggesting the CDS can/does/will act unilaterally and that none of the Canadian federal government apparatus will be involved in the decision to sp/deny request from the province? Are you asking if that is the case?

This is probably a good place to start reading. QR&O: Volume I - Chapter 23 Duties In Aid Of The Civil Power - Canada.ca
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My assumption would be Ontario requests aide through the MND and CDS intends to act of the request. The premise is the government is saying mass safety will trump individual rights and they have enough faith in the vaccine to encourage and allow children under 12 to be vaccinated. Much in the same way they encouraged mix and match without studies.

Ontario health comes to the conclusion that 90% or 95% of the population is required to be vaccinated for herd immunity. They know by starting a mass mandatory vaccination validation campaign will induce riots so they make their request prior to announcing anything to the public.

The idea is to keep people out of the city and prevent unvaccinated from escaping. Once Ilan is in place the announcement is made and everything gets rolling.

Would this be stopped?
 
The real question may be political; would the sitting government authorize the use of the Canadian Forces to 'control' the population?

The next question may be "realism"; does the CAF have the assets to (help) control the population?

So...instead of asking "would this be stopped", I'd ask "would this even have a chance of starting'?

My amateur opinion (uniformed/inexperienced opinion?) is "no, this would have no chance of starting".
 
Eye In The Sky said:
The real question may be political; would the sitting government authorize the use of the Canadian Forces to 'control' the population?

The next question may be "realism"; does the CAF have the assets to (help) control the population?

So...instead of asking "would this be stopped", I'd ask "would this even have a chance of starting'?

My amateur opinion (uniformed/inexperienced opinion?) is "no, this would have no chance of starting".
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Would you follow the order if it made it this far given the CDC guidance on vaccination of children.

Australia has utilised their forces to help in lockdown and have gone door to door (unarmed) to support the arrest of citizens that were not following qaurantine while sick. So I think the political will exists to make such a call if they deem it to be the safest option for society.

We have the ability to surround a few cities and institute checkpoints. We also have the ability to help vaccinate and support officers going door to door while we are unarmed.

Would our leadership stop this from starting if the governing power wouldn't reverse it's decision on the under 12 population.

I'm not a conspiracy theorist and I believe the government's are acting in the public's best interest. There are aspects of the response that I never thought would happen. Banning family from crossing a provincial border to travel 15 minutes from home to see each other. Segregating people with medical exemptions from society because those exemptions will not allow them to vaccinate.

I don't believe the above would happen for a variety of reasons, but I don't think it is that far fetched.
 
hattrick72 said:
Would you follow the order if it made it this far given the CDC guidance on vaccination of children.

Australia has utilised their forces to help in lockdown and have gone door to door (unarmed) to support the arrest of citizens that were not following qaurantine while sick. So I think the political will exists to make such a call if they deem it to be the safest option for society.

We have the ability to surround a few cities and institute checkpoints. We also have the ability to help vaccinate and support officers going door to door while we are unarmed.

Would our leadership stop this from starting if the governing power wouldn't reverse it's decision on the under 12 population.

I'm not a conspiracy theorist and I believe the government's are acting in the public's best interest. There are aspects of the response that I never thought would happen. Banning family from crossing a provincial border to travel 15 minutes from home to see each other. Segregating people with medical exemptions from society because those exemptions will not allow them to vaccinate.

I don't believe the above would happen for a variety of reasons, but I don't think it is that far fetched.
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My advice: Some may best be advised to un-crinkle the tinfoil surrounding their heads.
 
KINGLAWRENCE said:
The covid Is the chinese flu, no big deal If you are healthy.the killer Is the vaccine,anyone that gets the vax will get really sick or die within 36 months. do your own DD
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Which unit is he trying to pass himself off as a member of? It kind of looks like CSOR, but the motto is different.
 
hattrick72 said:
Would our leadership stop this from starting if the governing power wouldn't reverse it's decision on the under 12 population.
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Criminal Code

QR&O: Volume II – Chapter 103 – Service Offences - Canada.ca

Queen's Regulations and Orders - QR&O - Chapter 103 - Service Offences
www.canada.ca www.canada.ca

It is the job of the nations citizens to 'stop this from happening'; not the nations armed forces. We're a democracy and the 'voice of the people' is the instrument that should make a gov't rethink it's policies, decisions, etc.

As for me; I will follow any and all lawful commands given to me by my Chain of Command.
 
Eye In The Sky said:
The real question may be political; would the sitting government authorize the use of the Canadian Forces to 'control' the population?

The next question may be "realism"; does the CAF have the assets to (help) control the population?

So...instead of asking "would this be stopped", I'd ask "would this even have a chance of starting'?

My amateur opinion (uniformed/inexperienced opinion?) is "no, this would have no chance of starting".
Click to expand...
I feel like if there was any chance of this happening, it would have occurred in the first wave, not now.
 
Eye In The Sky said:
Criminal Code

QR&O: Volume II – Chapter 103 – Service Offences - Canada.ca

Queen's Regulations and Orders - QR&O - Chapter 103 - Service Offences
www.canada.ca www.canada.ca

It is the job of the nations citizens to 'stop this from happening'; not the nations armed forces. We're a democracy and the 'voice of the people' is the instrument that should make a gov't rethink it's policies, decisions, etc.

As for me; I will follow any and all lawful commands given to me by my Chain of Command.
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Is being ordered to vaccinate a six year old kid a lawful order, should the PM deem it necessary? Without changes to the vaccine guidelines of course.

To be clear, if I was given the order I would comply. How I felt after the operation is completed would be up in the air.
 
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