Airborne Engineers & Combat Engineer Parachutists

[SprCForr]

Thanks.

 

[McGowan]

from what i hear it takes a while for a part timer, to be able to get jump course

 

[patrick666]

Is there any special taskings for the Engineer Jumpers or is it just Sappers with basic para?

Cheers


Edit: Is there any Spr Jumpers on the forum?

 

[Spr.Earl]

Is there any special taskings for the Engineer Jumpers or is it just Sappers with basic para?

Cheers


Edit: Is there any Spr Jumpers on the forum?

At one time when each Reg. had it's light Section,Troop they trained and jumped with the Infantry at every chance they got as they would be with these Units and they would be ready to interact proficiently if the balloon went up so to speak.
Hope this helps.

We should bring back a Light Troop in each Reg.

 

[patrick666]

Light troop = Engineer jumpers?

If so, I agree. Why aren't they still around?

 

[McG]

Light troop = Engineer jumpers?

No.  jumpers are light, but being light does not make one a jumper.  You can look into the meaning of light forces here: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/27631.0.html

1 CER still has a light troop (although it has also been expected to maintain a proficiency & the equipment of a tracked troop).  You can look into Engr jump troops/sections here: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/25453.0.html

Engr transformation plans will re-establish a light troop & light sqn HQ in each regiment.  http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/22585/post-116334.html#msg116334

 

[patrick666]

Thanks, MCG. 

Cheers

 

[bilton090]

I would love to see the return of the Jump Tp ( I served from  91-93 2 tp Para , Larry Brophy was my section comd, and Pumpkin-head was the tp WO). I can't see it happening anytime soon as there aren't enough senior officers in NDHQ that would support it.  :skull: :threat: >


[/quote I left Pet in 92 was down
in Hvy. Tp, 84-86 was in 2 Tp, 86-88, Airborne Hvy. Tp.

 

[bilton090]

Did the Airborne Regt have a Pnr Pl in the Cbt Sp Cdo?  Were Pnr formally integrated into the Regt in other ways?

All 3 camdo'
s, had pnr pl's, R.C.R, P.P.C.L.I, Vando's.  After There term in the Reg. sent back to home unit's to serv in pnr. pl.

  OK, sec. + per. camdo.  1-2 & 3 comdo didn't contributed. This was in the 80's, 1983-1988 when I was with the Airborne Engineer's, 2  C.E.R ,
    Aslt Pnr's going back to their battalion could go into a Aslt Pnr Tp. None of the specialties were locked in roles, but they stayed Pnr's becouse they loved there job!!!!. AND it was a trade in it's rite going back hundreds of years.

 

[warrickdll]

All 3 camdo's, had pnr pl's, R.C.R, P.P.C.L.I, Vando's.  After There term in the Reg. sent back to home unit's to serv in pnr. pl.

Are you sure each Cdo didn't have an Aslt Pnr section (each with a platoon would make a company's worth of Aslt Pnrs), or each Cdo contributed an Aslt Pnr section to the Aslt Pnr platoon? And if so, can you remember what time frame that was in?

True, an Aslt Pnr going from CAR back to their battalion (or an Aslt Pnr transferring from one battalion to another) would have a good chance of remaining in an Aslt Pnr role, but none of the specialties were locked-in roles.

 

[bilton090]

I have also discovered that the Airborne had a full Engineer Squadron as part of its order of battle.  That was lost the same time the Artillery was removed, when the Regiment moved to Pet.

                The C.A.R moved from Ed. they had a Eng. Sqn. , After the move the Eng's re.-badged back to the Eng. cap badge. The Sqn. got bigger to over half of 2 C.E.R . When the coin was first givin out the first 100 went to the Eng's !!!  Chimo! Airborne

 

[ChristopherRobin]

Just bringing this thread up instead of starting a new one...

How rare or common is it to see a set of jump wings (red or white) on the uniform of an engineer?

 

[aesop081]

Just bringing this thread up instead of starting a new one...

How rare or common is it to see a set of jump wings (red or white) on the uniform of an engineer?

Its quite common

 

[Sapper6]

Just bringing this thread up instead of starting a new one...

How rare or common is it to see a set of jump wings (red or white) on the uniform of an engineer?

ChrisR,

I agree with cdnaviator, but the answer is relative.  In other words, we still try to maintain the "capability" of military parachuting but we no longer maintain a purely "airborne" role in the Army anymore.  For economy of effort, expertise is maintained through the designation of the three "light" companies of the 3rd BNs of each Inf Regt plus the Canadian Parachute Centre (or whatever it is called these days).

Combat Engineers get "some" of the basic parachuting positions on each serial... as do the Gunners, Armd Crewmen, Medics, Logisticians, etc.  However, the focus is on the infantry (quite rightly IMHO) with some slots for us.  That being said, it is "common" to see soldiers in the CERs/ESR sporting "red wings" eventhough there is not many of them.  As for "white wings",... those are more rare.  White wings are only found on Sappers that have served in designated "jump positions" and usually go back to the Airborne Regiment days.  Despite efforts from the senior leadership of the Engineers, there has been no joy in establishing hard, maroon beret, jump positions in the Regts.

So, what is "common" and "rare"?  Based on my experience (and this is not scientific), I would estimate that a CER would have 20-40 soldiers with red wings out of a total of 390.  Of course, this number fluctuates between Regts.  For example, 2 CER Petawawa has had a greater number of jumpers historically based on its former ties to the AB Regt.  Further, opportunities to go on jump courses fluctuates with the op tempo.

Anyway, my 2 cents.  Anyone who is currently in a Regt, please feel free to correct me if I got this wrong.

S6 out.

 

[Sapper3123]

I am a new recruit with the 31 Combat Engineer Regiment.  And I was thinking if engineers could join one of the parachute companies.... Can we?

 

[McG]

Can we?

No.  You need to be regular force and infantry.

However, you can do a parachute course. 
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/18392.0.html

 

[geo]

3123
Para companies are, at present, exclusively infantry BUT
you have units like the CSOR who are a mix of many trades, Engineer and Infantry included.  They will ride helicopters and parachutes into their area of operation...

Engineer squadrons are deploying with the battle groups in theatre.  Sappers are attached to the PRTs and the Rifle platoons who are closing with and dealing with the ennemy.

 

[McG]

A modern Airborne Engineer operation:

On 28 and 29 Jan 2013, the 17ème régiment de génie parachutiste (Airborne Engineer Regiment) was committed at Tombouctou airport to recover the practicability of the transportation head, after being damaged by the terrorists. After reconnaissance and a planning process, one dump, one bulldozer and one backhoe loader coming from Abidjan were dropped by 4 transport aircraft. Within this main airborne operation and due to the effectiveness of the Para sappers, 2000 m of runway could be repaired in 24H, an important operational but also economical issue for the town.

This example brings out a critical element of Airborne Engineering that has been lacking from our jump sections and parachute troops of the last near two decades - the ability to do heavy engineering work (like reclaim a runway for follow-on forces).  If we ever become serious about Airborne Engineers, the French air-droppable hy eqpt are the type of asset that we will need to consider.

More here: http://www.networkvisio.com/n31-france/article-les-sapeurs-parachutistes-du-17e-rgp-prennent-part-%C3%A0.html?id=3379 (en français)

 

[Jungle]

Before 1992, we had an Airborne Battle Group, with a Cbt Eng Sqn. Between 1992 and 1995, the CAR had an integral Cbt Eng platoon, with heavy eqpt, and would have been able to carry out the kind of mission depicted above.

Now... we can't do it. Try moving a grader or a bulldozer 200km by helicopter... or inserting a Coy group rapidly 1000 km away.

 

[cupper]

I suppose the term is relative to the tasking at hand, but the equipment in the photo doesn't look all that heavy.

I assume that the concept is to have equipment light enough to be air dropped, but capable of performing the necessary temporary repairs to allow larger equipment to be flown in and do larger longer term repairs.