Afghan Medals Process (merged)

[Teddy Ruxpin]

From DHH (DIN link:  http://hr.ottawa-hull.mil.ca/dhh/honours_awards/engraph/honour_awards_e.asp?cat=3&Q_ID=36 ):

ELIGIBILITY & CRITERIA
Awarded for a minimum of 30 days cumulative service in a UN or international peacekeeping mission.

STANAVFORLANT & STANAVFORMED wouldn't be "peacekeeping" missions per se, but rather are NATO tasks.  It looks like your UN time just missed qualification.  There's a list of eligible and non-eligible missions on the DHH site (look for the link).

Cheers,

TR

 

[Good2Golf]

Is it because NATO took over ISAF that the GCS (and concurrent NA5) were awarded, as opposed to the SWASM when Devil39 and co. were in theatre?   I would assume that folks on ARCHER will also be back to the SWASM, wouldn't they...given CoC relationships?  

Personally, I think I'd rather have a GCS and Bar than an NA5 medal anyway...that is if I really cared about having anything at all.  Rather have a bunch of good stories shared with the guys and a knowing, "yup, yup....uhn hunh...oh yeah...*nudge*" than a "wow, that's a neat one, mister, what'd you get that for?"....

Cheers,
Duey  

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

Well, I'll give this a shot:

SWASM was created specifically for combat operations against "terrorism" - for which OP APOLLO and OP ARCHER qualify, as does service training the Afghan Army.  Combat is defined as actively seeking and destroying the enemy. It is thus a "war" medal.

GCS is awarded for operations (not peacekeeping, but peace enforcement, stablization, etc.) in the presence of an armed enemy, for which OP ATHENA and OP ALLIED FORCE qualify.  There could easily be future bars to the GCS should we get involved in similar missions in other places.  There is a fine line between the GCS and "war" medals, but it is there...

Non-Article 5 is the NATO generic medal for non-article five operations (gee...).  NATO awards it for Bosnia, Kosovo and Afghanistan.  It was widely felt by ATHENA Roto 0 that such a non-descript generic gong didn't do ATHENA (and perhaps future missions) justice, given the nature of the operation (non peacekeeping).  The UK felt the same way.

CPSM is awarded for 30 days on a traditional peacekeeping mission (UN, NATO, etc.).  This is a mission in which two (or more) warring parties agree on a truce (or something similar) and agree that a Canadian or multinational presence is required to implement the agreement.  Thus Bosnia and the horde of UN missions qualify.  CPSM is a Canadian service medal - as was pointed out previously - and is awarded alongside the international peacekeeping gongs.

DHH has put out a snazzy booklet (that can be downloaded from their website) setting all this out.

Cheers,

TR

 

[Franko]

Goodday all.  I am seeking some sort of explanation as to why I cannot mount my Non-Article 5 NATO medal.

Well well...good to see the "B" team made it home safe and sound. 

As for your medal and not being allowed to wear it...blame it on the gov't. They don't want to recognise it, it wasn't issued by them, so be it. One mission...one medal period.

As for not getting a CPSM...guess what? Not a peacekeeping mission.

You got one medal for one mission....live with it. All the writing to all the MPs will not change a thing.

At least you didn't have to wait over 2 years to get it....like the troops from Roto 0.

As for the troops over here right now we've been informed that we will be recieving the GCS and the SWASM for two seperate missions.

Luck of the draw I guess.

Wear your medal with pride...you've earned  it.

Regards

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

I might be wrong, but I see the GCS as a "war medal", since you have an armed enemy.  I would certainly consider the pilots dropping bombs in 1999 as "at war", and they (finally) have the GCS.  Some may snicker, but I consider ISAF part of the war on terror. 

Regardless, welcome back reccecrewman! 

Franko, best of luck!

2B

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

As I said, it's a fine (and blurry) line...  DHH appears to agree with you (and me, for that matter).  The GCS and CSM come before the CPSM in the order of precedence - as "war" medals.

 

[Acorn]

As for the troops over here right now we've been informed that we will be recieving the GCS and the SWASM for two seperate missions.

Actually, I was wondering about that: the troops in TF Kabul are moving from ISAF to OEF, and the troops of TF 1-06 will be going over as OEF, and then transitioning to ISAF (I think). Has there been anything official on the gongs to be awarded (SWASM and/or GCS)? (Official being "in writing")

Acorn

 

[PhilB]

Heres another question, the troops part of TF 1-06 deploying to Camp Mirage will be entitled to the GSM. If they spend 30days or more in Afghanistan in Khandahar they would be eligibale for the SWASM or the GCS?? I know that in the past people only received either the GSM or the GCS depending, however with if a SWASM was awarded would the troop get to wear both? Thanks

 

[George Wallace]

If you move around within the same OP, say OP Athena, then no.   You would get the appropriate medal (Probably the highest).

If you move around between two different OPs then you would probably get both if one OP was SWASM and the other GCS.   Or perhaps you would get different bars for the ribbon if the two OPs were both the same, SWASM or GCS.

Trying to collect medals are we?   ;D

 

[Acorn]

Trying to collect medals are we?   ;D

It's all about the gongs George. All about the gongs.  ;D

 

[Michael OLeary]

If you move around within the same OP, say OP Athena, then no.  You would get the appropriate medal (Probably the highest).

If you move around between two different OPs then you would probably get both if one OP was SWASM and the other GCS.  Or perhaps you would get different bars for the ribbon if the two OPs were both the same, SWASM or GCS.

Or nothing at all, if you don't spend long enough in theatre under any one particular mandate to qualify.

I knew one Transport Offcier who worked with movement sections, he'd deploy on a mission at the outset, spend 2-3 weeks setting up the movement section, and then return to Canada. He was all over the world, and accumulated no specific tour medals.

 

[Franko]

Actually, I was wondering about that: the troops in TF Kabul are moving from ISAF to OEF, and the troops of TF 1-06 will be going over as OEF, and then transitioning to ISAF (I think). Has there been anything official on the gongs to be awarded (SWASM and/or GCS)? (Official being "in writing")

Acorn

For that Roto....IIRC Op Archer will already be transformed to ISAF from OEF by the time you hit the ground. Therefore you'll recieve the GCS and not the SWASM.

The SWASM is for Op Enduring Freedom or any other non ISAF Mission. The troops in Qtown will get both as well, again 2 different Ops...2 different medals.

For the troops in CM they'll recieve the GSM and not the GCS or SWASM.

Ohhh my head hurts......    ;D

Regards

 

[Fdtrucker]

Member of 1 Svc Bn that  close out Unprofor in 95/95 worked at getting our vehs and equipment into Bosnia for Roto 0 IFOR did rx'ed both their UN and Nato medals because of of the change over from UN to Nato. Mbrs of Ett Roto 2 and those working for CFC-A received their SWASM while the rest of us on Roto 2 rx'ed the GCS due to their different Missions. The CO of Roto 2 TSE was awarded the GCS vice the GCM because he spent 30 days or more in Afghanistan at the dislike of his troops in Mirage because of the time spent there. Some of the D&S Platoon from TSE accumulated more then the 30 days required so should have been issued with this as well. A Cpl coming back from Op Archer TAT will be receiving the SWASM for his 40 odd days spent in Kandahar. For the troops currently in Camp Julien (Roto 4) i wouldn't guess if they are going to rx'ed two medal.

 

[Good2Golf]

There are a couple of CANFORGENs out on the SWASM and ARCHER/ARGUS...can't recall the number but within the last month or so...

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

Member of 1 Svc Bn that  close out Unprofor in 95/95 worked at getting our vehs and equipment into Bosnia for Roto 0 IFOR did rx'ed both their UN and Nato medals because of of the change over from UN to Nato. Mbrs of Ett Roto 2 and those working for CFC-A received their SWASM while the rest of us on Roto 2 rx'ed the GCS due to their different Missions. The CO of Roto 2 TSE was awarded the GCS vice the GCM because he spent 30 days or more in Afghanistan at the dislike of his troops in Mirage because of the time spent there. Some of the D&S Platoon from TSE accumulated more then the 30 days required so should have been issued with this as well. A Cpl coming back from Op Archer TAT will be receiving the SWASM for his 40 odd days spent in Kandahar. For the troops currently in Camp Julien (Roto 4) i wouldn't guess if they are going to rx'ed two medal.

Exactly right.  Moreover, there's one other example of a "two for one" mission.  Roto 15 transitioned from NATO to EUFOR (Op BRONZE to Op BOREAS) last year.  Pers serving with SFOR received the NATO Non-Article 5 Medal because they filled the minimum time required, then received the new EUFOR medal because they fulfilled the time requirements for that medal as well.  I didn't agree with the concept, particularly as many jobs (particularly in the admin unit) didn't change at all, but there it is.

 

[reccecrewman]

Oh, undoubtedly they must deserve it.      A really rough tour of duty no doubt.

Pathetic! 

It is really all about the medals... isn't it?

This above is from Devil39...................  I have to say that for each soldier who does a tour overseas, they all have their own take on a tour of duty.  I see absolutely nothing wrong with asking a question WRT a decoration that was given as to why it can't be worn.  I recieved many answers that gave me a much clearer understanding on the topic, but this comment kinda took me by surprise.  Any medal that any soldier recieves, whether it's classified as a "gimme" medal or not, still is something that you should be proud of.  It really is all about the medals Devil 39????  Are you honestly going to say that it's about something else????  Like what I wonder???  A genuine heartfelt interest in the cause to help the people of a wartorn nation pick up the pieces and rebuild? Please!  How about the money we pick up to be overseas????  BINGO!  If we recieved the exact same pay overseas that we earn in garrison, then guess what?  We'd have a whole slew of troops dagging RED!!!!!! Because very few guys (or girls) are going to go spend 6 months away from their wife (or husband) and children for the same pay we take home in Canada.  Its all about the money, and if you take a swipe at somebody asking about a medal, how about coming down on all the troops whose only reason for going is extra cash?  Unless cash is an honourable justification to you...........................  I was merely asking a question, not looking for a talking down to.

 

[Franko]

It is really all about the medals... isn't it?

Obviously it is to you and the troops who are writing to their MPs  :

I see absolutely nothing wrong with asking a question WRT a decoration that was given as to why it can't be worn.   I recieved many answers that gave me a much clearer understanding on the topic, but this comment kinda took me by surprise.   Any medal that any soldier recieves, whether it's classified as a "gimme" medal or not, still is something that you should be proud of.

Yes....by all means be proud of your gong. You've earned it.

If we recieved the exact same pay overseas that we earn in garrison, then guess what?   We'd have a whole slew of troops dagging RED!!!!!! Because very few guys (or girls) are going to go spend 6 months away from their wife (or husband) and children for the same pay we take home in Canada.

Seems to me I remember you mouthing off about all the cash you were going to make and what you were going to spend it on PRIOR to B Sqn's departure.

Pot meet kettle    :

Its all about the money, and if you take a swipe at somebody asking about a medal, how about coming down on all the troops whose only reason for going is extra cash?   Unless cash is an honourable justification to you...........................   I was merely asking a question, not looking for a talking down to.

Question answered in spades. As for the troops going just for the cash...they have their reasons, so be it. Nothing anyone can do about it.

Regards

BTW...welcome to Army.ca  ;D

 

[Infanteer]

How about just sticking a handful of Afghani poo-dirt in your DEU pocket - that should get the point across, shouldn't it?

 

[reccecrewman]

Touche! Point taken.  Anyhow, thanks to all who responded, I got the vaild answers I was looking for.

 

[Franko]

Glad to help you out reccecrewman.   

We Dragoons have to stick together  ;D

Regards