6 Jan 2020 U.S. Events (Split from A Deeply Fractured US)

[Remius]

Compare Jan 6th with the summer of riots. You won't because it goes against your confirmation bias.

You just said not to compare now you want to compare? Pick one or the other. I just told you both are wrong. What do you want to compare exactly? The 10 000 people arrested and hundreds facing charges including terrorism charges that were at BLM protests? Nobody is minimizing that. You are inserting that into your argument when no one is arguing that lol.

 

[quadrapiper]

Compare Jan 6th with the summer of riots. You won't because it goes against your confirmation bias.

What Altair said. Fully peaceful protest to disruptive protest to riot is also a delicate series of potential disasters on the part of all players (one hothead, one idiot cop, one irritated bystander to kick things off), with, until the terminal stages where people are burning, looting, etc., fewer extremely clear boundaries. A legislature saying NO YOU CAN'T COME IN HERE, on the other hand, is entirely straightforward and enforceable.

 

[kkwd]

I couldn't find charges under 18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection in the current charges listed in Capitol Breach Cases. I would suspect if there was evidence of insurrection it would be charged. Wouldn't it be prudent to stop calling something an insurrection with no mention of it in official justice department documents. I better clear this up right now, I will get grief for saying I support the riot, I don't. It was a dark day and all that have participated in wrongdoing should pay the price.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

I don’t follow conspiracy theories. If you think jan 6th was peaceful there isn’t much I, or anyone else can convince you of. I hope all responsible are made examples of. One down with 8 months in jail, more to go.

im not confusing anything. I’m rational enough to accept that both are wrong. But it’s plain whataboutism. Plain and simple. If you think they weren’t “armed” I think you need a crash course on what “armed” means.

You mean like setting up autonomous zones in US cities? I would call that a threat to democracy, particularly as many of the residents were not consulted prior by their new "guardians". Besides the proclaimed zones, there are unofficial ones where police and other services rarely venture or if they do, they don't do much policing or other services.

 

[quadrapiper]

I couldn't find charges under 18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection in the current charges listed in Capitol Breach Cases. I would suspect if there was evidence of insurrection it would be charged. Wouldn't it be prudent to stop calling something an insurrection with no mention of it in official justice department documents. I better clear this up right now, I will get grief for saying I support the riot, I don't. It was a dark day and all that have participated in wrongdoing should pay the price.

Wouldn't be surprised if there's charges drawn up along those lines pending the outcome of the small-time cases.

 

[lenaitch]

Given the general level of firearm possession and carriage in the US population let alone by some known anarchists and anti-government groups that were there, I'm actually quite surprised at the apparently low level evidence of them at the Capitol in any of the images I have seen. Heck, some will openly carry an assault rifle 'just cuz'.

 

[kkwd]

Wouldn't be surprised if there's charges drawn up along those lines pending the outcome of the small-time cases.

Until that comes along what is the point of inflaming things with specious talk.

 

[Altair]

Until that comes along what is the point of inflaming things with specious talk.

Insurrection

a violent uprising against an authority or government.

Was it violent? Yes.

Uprising? Let's see.

an act of resistance or rebellion; a revolt.

It was an act of resistance, so yes.

Was it against authority? The senate and house authority to verify the election results, I would say yes.

Was it against government? It was in the building that houses two levels of government with a representative of the third branch present there and you can hear it from those there that it was against those branches of government, so yes.

It was a bloody Insurrection and I don't need lawyers who are treating these cases with kids gloves to tell me what it was.

It walks like a duck, it quacks like a duck, it looks like a duck, it's a damn duck.

 

[kkwd]

Insurrection

a violent uprising against an authority or government.

Was it violent? Yes.

Uprising? Let's see.

an act of resistance or rebellion; a revolt.

It was an act of resistance, so yes.

Was it against authority? The senate and house authority to verify the election results, I would say yes.

Was it against government? It was in the building that houses two levels of government with a representative of the third branch present there and you can hear it from those there that it was against those branches of government, so yes.

It was a bloody Insurrection and I don't need lawyers who are treating these cases with kids gloves to tell me what it was.

It walks like a duck, it quacks like a duck, it looks like a duck, it's a damn duck.

That's fine for you, you have no responsibility for conducting a fair investigation, coming up with evidence and laying charge according to that evidence. A personal opinion is one thing but the law is another. Evidence shouldn't involve a dictionary definition.

 

[QV]

Jan 6th was not an insurrection. That is hype. There was no armed violent attempt at taking over the US government, don't be ridiculous . They were there to protest. There were a handful of trouble makers.

But, your mostly peaceful summer of 2020 was a whole other matter altogether. Assaults on court houses, trying to burn state and federal buildings down with police inside, police officers targeted and killed. Part of a city taken over and occupied by armed thugs imposing their own laws for days and days.

Anyone who believes Jan 6th was an actual "insurrection" can't be taken seriously at all.

 

[Altair]

That's fine for you, you have no responsibility for conducting a fair investigation, coming up with evidence and laying charge according to that evidence. A personal opinion is one thing but the law is another. Evidence shouldn't involve a dictionary definition.

That's fine.

But you asked why call it a insurrection.

The reason is because it fits the definition of one.

Same way people who are charged in the blm riots may be charged with unlawful assembly, but we still call them rioters.

 

[Altair]

Jan 6th was not an insurrection. That is hype. There was no armed violent attempt at taking over the US government, don't be ridiculous

Insurrections don't need to be armed. And it was plenty violent.

. They were there to protest. There were a handful of trouble makers.

a handful of troublemakers made multiple lines of police fall back, and eventually retreat into the capital building? A handful of troublemakers were responsible for breaking into the capital building from multiple different entry points, trying to hunt down people like Pelosi and Pence?

Were these handful of people the avengers, with superpowers able to overwhelm the capital police?

But, your mostly peaceful summer of 2020 was a whole other matter altogether. Assaults on court houses, trying to burn state and federal buildings down with police inside, police officers targeted and killed. Part of a city taken over and occupied by armed thugs imposing their own laws for days and days.

Civil disobedience and attacks versus police will never be defended by me, but I don't think they were ever trying to overturn election results.

the part about a city being taken over does meet the definition of insurrection to me, but Insurrection in a city is on a far different scale than Insurrection versus the federal government.

Anyone who believes Jan 6th was an actual "insurrection" can't be taken seriously at all.

You trying to make it sound like a bunch of peaceful people were taking a tour of the capital building on the same day the election results were to be verified is absolute ridiculous.

 

[Good2Golf]

So the Antifa/BLM riots of 2020 is all just a conspiracy theory now. Quit acting like the actions of a few loons on one day was anything meaningful compared what had already gone on the entire previous summer. You're right about one thing; both are wrong. Where you err is thinking they are even remotely comparable.

Exactly.

One was a direct attempt to attack the heart of democracy and its periodic machinery of election of representatives by the citizens.

 

[Remius]

Yes, Capitol Rioters Were Armed. Here Are The Weapons Prosecutors Say They Used

An NPR review of federal charges against people involved in the Jan. 6 U.S. Capitol riot shows they were armed with a wide variety of weapons, contradicting a false claim that rioters were not armed.

www.npr.org

not sure QV why you keep saying they weren’t armed. You need a lesson on what armed means.

I hope all 500 arrested so far get everything they deserve.

 

[TheHead]

Yes, Capitol Rioters Were Armed. Here Are The Weapons Prosecutors Say They Used

An NPR review of federal charges against people involved in the Jan. 6 U.S. Capitol riot shows they were armed with a wide variety of weapons, contradicting a false claim that rioters were not armed.

www.npr.org

not sure QV why you keep saying they weren’t armed. You need a lesson on what armed means.

I hope all 500 arrested so far get everything they deserve.

Exactly, I hope they rot in jail for a long time. It's sad the rubes are the ones going to jail when Trump and his ilk like Alex Jones are still putting gas on the fire.

 

[Altair]

Exactly, I hope they rot in jail for a long time. It's sad the rubes are the ones going to jail when Trump and his ilk like Alex Jones are still putting gas on the fire.

Yes, it is sad. The TV commentators, the politicians, the lawyers, everyone saying that the election was stolen, and they had to "fight" for their democracy, they had to fight back, are suddenly surprised when the masses they told to assemble on Jan 6th go off and fight the police and try to overturn the election.

But the rich and powerful never get held accountable for their actions or words.

 

[QV]

Whew! That was a close one! The worlds greatest nuclear power was almost overrun by a fur rug and viking horn sporting nutcase with a wizard staff and a handful of troublemakers predominantly armed with less lethal weapons. Close call!

 

[TheHead]

I guess that whole hang Mike Pence thing never happened either. Just a bunch of good ole Q Anon boys out on a field trip.

 

[Remius]

And the baseball bats were for the annual proud boys vs odin’s sons baseball tournament in the rotunda.

 

[Remius]

Whew! That was a close one! The worlds greatest nuclear power was almost overrun by a fur rug and viking horn sporting nutcase with a wizard staff and a handful of troublemakers predominantly armed with less lethal weapons. Close call!

So it was only a handful? Lol. Want to compare handfuls? 500 charged so far. So at least a battalions worth. And counting. Testimony starts tomorrow. Feel free to watch.