Vimy

[bossi]

(from the Toronto Star):

Vimy battle raged around wounded gunner
Canadian Army gunner‘s harrowing survival in bloody World War I battle

CP/NATIONAL ARCHIVES OF CANADA
Gunner Sidor Crouch was wounded at Vimy Ridge in April, 1917. He survived the battle that claimed nearly 3,600 Canadian lives.

In 1915, Sidor Crouch, 19, enlisted in the Canadian Army and eventually ended up fighting at Vimy Ridge in France. Canada suffered more than 10, 000 casualties, including 3,598 killed, in one of World War I‘s bloodiest battles. His son, Philip Crouch, went to Sidor Crouch‘s home on Nov. 5, 1977, and asked him about his experiences at Vimy. This is Sidor Crouch‘s story as told to his son.
I had been in the trenches about nine months before arriving at Vimy Ridge with some of my comrades in the 20th Battalion, 2nd Division, in the Canadian Army. It was cold, muddy and swampy; we had to contend with lice and rats.

The battle at Vimy Ridge took place on Monday, April 9, 1917, but before then the engineering corps had built tunnels leading up to the German lines. They also constructed caves in the hills where men were gathered, sleeping on a single rubber sheet in the mud.

Before the battle there was a huge artillery barrage against German lines, which lasted for six days, day and night. I was part of a Lewis machine-gun crew. I was the gunner; there was also a loader and four men who were to protect us. Two of them were riflemen and two of them grenade men. All of us could handle any of the positions.

As the hours towards the start of the battle approached, the infantry soldiers were ordered into the tunnels. We machine gunners were ordered to crawl silently towards the German lines and to take up positions a short distance from them.

We were not to take any action until a signal was given — an artillery shell. We crawled silently towards the German lines and stayed there. We could see the Germans and we could hear them talking although they could not see us.

At 5:30 a.m. Easter Monday, the signal was given and the artillery opened up. We moved forward. The Germans in our immediate vicinity were so surprised that they immediately surrendered. The infantry orders were to walk slowly forward following the artillery barrage. Soldiers were to spray bullets in front of them as they walked. We had no trouble overcoming the first line.

There was a big battle for the second German line. They started running. Many of the Germans were paralyzed with shock from the bombardment. Even though they had not been wounded, they lay motionless with their cheeks twitching.

As we captured German artillery, our gunners would turn the weapons around to fire at the Germans. On the side to the east of us, huge tunnels had been dug in underneath German positions and dynamite had been placed there. The dynamite exploded and one huge blast ripped apart, and completely destroyed, the German positions in that area. There was a great deal of killing on both sides as the fighting continued.

I remember that the sun started to shine about 10 a.m. and that many German prisoners were taken. Many of these German prisoners were killed by their own artillery, which was shelling our lines. Our machine-gun group was moving constantly. We confronted a German machine gun position, and in effect a duel took place. As we fired at each other I decided to attempt to dig a trench with the bullets from my gun to the enemy‘s weapon.

After a while it appeared that we had silenced the German machine gun. It was my mistake, however. As I stood up I felt a blow like a baseball bat hit my right leg and I was knocked to the ground. I had been shot. Immediately another crewmember replaced me and shortly after this the German machine gun crew surrendered.

My group then moved ahead, leaving me on my own, in accordance with orders they had been given. The medics arrived, bandaged me and put me in a shell hole. They went to look for other wounded.

Right beside the hole was a dead German with a rifle. As I looked up I saw a huge crowd of Germans coming towards me. I thought it was a counter-attack and reached for the dead German‘s rifle to defend myself. To my relief, the Germans were prisoners, who were being chased to our rear lines by a few Canadians.

As I lay there, mules and horses passed by with ammunition. Darkness, and snow, fell and then I could see soldiers coming to collect the dead and wounded. I was hoarse and cold. I remember cavalry riding by at an extremely fast clip. I believe that they were East Indian, although I could not be sure about that. One of the horses came frighteningly close to me. I worried that I would not be picked up.

At one stage a sad looking German soldier approached me. He was unarmed, obviously frightened and anxious to surrender. He was small and underweight. I used the rifle from the nearby dead German soldier and motioned for him to come closer. He approached fearfully, and I indicated to him that I wanted him to carry me towards the Canadian side on his back. He finally understood, bent down and I got on his back, but he was not strong enough to carry me.

The pain of the movement was so bad that I gave up on that idea. I then sent him on his way and he ran off with great speed.

At 6 the next morning, young Canadian soldiers were out trying to find the wounded and one found me. He gave me water and said he would come back with a stretcher and other men. He did come back with others, including German prisoners who were being used as stretcher-bearers.

I was carried to a valley, where there appeared to be thousands of wounded, and wrapped in a blanket.

The injured included British and Australian servicemen, as well as Canadians. I fell asleep and was put on a truck and taken to an Australian tent hospital. One of my biggest problems at the time was that the lice were unbearable. I was washed and put in a bed and they gave me coffee and they fed me.

I spent a week there and doctors put a splint on my right leg and wrapped the wound.

An Australian doctor approached me when he learned that I could speak Russian and asked me to teach him to speak the language (Crouch was born in what is now Ukraine. His name was changed from Kravets during a document mix-up when he immigrated in 1913).

After a week, a number of us were taken to a field to await trucks to take us to LeHavre. As we lay in the field, German artillery started to shell areas nearby. I was afraid that they were going to hit us, but for some reason the shelling stopped.

I was put on a truck and taken to a boat at LeHavre, which proceeded to Dover, England. Hospital treatment followed and I arrived back in Canada on April 24, 1918.
--------------------------------------------------
Sidor Crouch died in 1980. Tomorrow marks the 85th anniversary of Vimy Ridge

 

[bossi]

On Vimy Ridge, Canada came of age

J.L. Granatstein
Times Colonist (Victoria)

Tuesday, April 09, 2002

EIGHTY-FIVE YEARS AGO today, the Canadian Corps attacked Vimy Ridge. The German position had successfully resisted earlier French and British attacks, and was heavily defended. But the Canadians took the ridge and in the process made the Canadian Corps‘ great reputation. The victory of April 9, 1917, has also been hailed as the birth of Canadian nationalism, the day Canada ceased to be a colony and became a nation.

Vimy is the Canadian victory, the pinnacle of Canadian military achievement. Soldiers then and the media at home painted it as a triumph of arms -- and so it was. Part of this myth-making for civilians was the sense that Canadians had scaled a cliff, struggling to the top of the great ridge in the face of enemy fire. In fact, most of the ground in front of the Canadians was characterized by a gentle upward slope. No one needed pitons to scale the heights of Vimy.

More important, while Vimy was an enormously strong position, and while its capture by the four divisions of the Canadian Corps fighting together for the first time was a significant victory, it was a battle without exploitation. No cavalry streamed into the gap blasted in the enemy lines; no reserves moved forward. Vimy was a costly battle that mattered little in terms of the overall conduct of the war.

For the Canadians, it was an undoubted psychological fillip; for Gen. Sir Julian Byng, the British commander of the Canadians, it was the culmination of his career; and for people at home it showed that "our boys" could do great things. But its military importance, regrettably, was slight. Nonetheless, the battle was so perfectly planned and executed that it deserves its place in our military history.

By 1917, Canadians had been fighting for two years. The raw levies that had held the Germans off at Ypres in April 1915 now were experienced, well-trained soldiers.

The key to the success at Vimy came when Byng sent Maj.-Gen. Arthur Currie of the First Canadian Division to study the methods of the French. Currie learned that they emphasized reconnaissance, putting every man into the line to see the ground and likely enemy resistance points. They used air photographs extensively, distributing them to the officers of the assaulting units, who then briefed every man. When the attack went in, the objectives were geographical features, not hard-to-find map references.

Moreover, the French believed attacks were more likely to succeed if they used fresh troops. Above all, Currie recommended that the Canadian Corps, like the French, adopt a flexible, manoeuvrable platoon organization. In the battle for Vimy Ridge, Currie‘s ideas played the decisive role.

Byng‘s plan for the attack was ready by March 5, allowing a month for preparation. Engineers cut large dugouts into the chalky ground so men could mass in safety, and water and telephone lines were laid. The Canadians had massive fire support for their attack, one piece of heavy artillery for each 20 yards of front, and one field gun for every 10 yards. The artillery program had been carefully devised and called for an escalating two-week bombardment on trenches, machine-gun nests, and supply dumps. When the attack itself began, a rolling barrage would move forward in 100-yard increments while other guns hit defensive positions.

"We had been practising and rehearsing the details for several days," wrote Lieut. Stuart Kirkland, "but didn‘t know the hour it was to start until the night before." Air photos and maps came well forward, and every man knew his task. Indiscreetly, Pte. Ronald MacKinnon of the Princess Patricia‘s Canadian Light Infantry wrote to his father: "I am a rifle grenadier and am in the ‘first wave.‘ We have a good bunch of boys to go over with and good artillery support so we are bound to get our objective alright. I understand we are going up against the Prussian Guards."

When the 15,000 troops from 21 battalions, fortified with a tot of rum and a hot meal, went over the top at 5:30 a.m. on Easter Monday, they attacked in snow and sleet, the wind driving into the enemy lines.

The attack began with "the most wonderful artillery barrage ever known in the history of the world," Kirkland said. Behind the rolling barrage, the men moved steadily forward over the badly broken ground, most of Currie‘s First Division units reaching German front-line positions while the enemy still huddled in their dugouts. At the second German line, snipers and machine-guns began to inflict heavy casualties. The Second and Third Divisions similarly moved quickly over their first objectives, one unit of the Third Division capturing 150 Saxons in a dugout.

The First Division moved on, helped by snow that hid its advance. The Germans now fled or fell, and by 7 a.m. the division had seized most of its second objective. The Second Division moved over flattened enemy trenches, capturing many prisoners, though casualties were beginning to mount. Still, by 9:30 the two divisions had their third objective, as the British Official History noted, "in precisely the same manner as it had been worked out on the practice fields." The final objective soon followed, though it took a bayonet charge by the 6th Brigade to overcome machine-guns firing at point-blank range.

"Hundreds of men were now walking over the open in all directions," wrote Padre F.G. Scott. "German prisoners were being hurried back in scores. Wounded men, stretcher-bearers and men following up the advance were seen on all sides, and on the ground lay the bodies of friends and foes." From the air, a Canadian pilot saw what seemed to be men casually wandering across No Man‘s Land. The young Billy Bishop could see shells bursting among the Canadians and men falling, while others continued slowly forward. It looked like something unreal, he recalled, a game, not war.

Only the Fourth Division met sustained difficulties in taking Hill 145, the point that provided the Germans with observation over the valley of the River Souchez. Here the defences were very strong. Careful preparation brought the Canadians to within 150 yards of the German lines, but surprise was difficult to achieve. But that night the 85th Battalion, the Nova Scotia Highlanders, a battalion new to the front, took Hill 145.

There now remained only "the Pimple," the northern tip of Vimy Ridge. In the early hours of April 12 in the teeth of a gale, the Canadians surprised the Guards Regiment manning the position. Heavy fighting followed and by 6 a.m. the Canadians had the position. The ridge was now wholly in Canadian hands.

Stunned by the Canadians‘ rapid success, the Germans pulled back their line to eliminate the advantages of observation offered by the ridge. The Canadian Corps, having suffered 10,602 casualties, dug in on the line of the Lens-Arras railway, a gain of 4,500 yards. The opportunity for a breakthrough, like others in this war of attrition, disappeared into the swirling sleet of April.

Still, it was a famous victory, cheered to the echo in Canada and France. Capt. Georges Vanier of the 22nd Battalion wrote that "The morale of our troops is magnificent. We cannot lose -- what is more we are winning quickly and the war will be over within six months." The Canadians had captured a hitherto impregnable position and taken 4,000 prisoners.

That all four divisions of Canadians fought together at Vimy undoubtedly contributed to the victory. Worth remembering, however, is that Byng was British, as were his superiors -- the Canadian Corps did not fight under Canadian command until Currie took over. Moreover, it was not until late 1918 that the Canadian-born made up more than half of the Canadian Expeditionary Force. British immigrants had made up two-thirds of the first contingent and made up almost half of all who served.

Did this make the force less Canadian? On the contrary, virtually every commentator then and since concluded that the soldiers became Canadian in battle, convinced that their corps, their nation-in-formation, was something special. So it was -- and is.

J. L. Granatstein, former director of the Canadian War Museum, is the author of Canada‘s Army, Waging War and Keeping the Peace, forthcoming from University of Toronto Press.

 

[CADPAT SOLDIER]

A Timeless Growth
(Anticipation of Aged Serendipities)

I’ve known of you for a mere two weeks,
My new acquaintance; I feel as if
Your ‘mere’ two years have turned you
Old.  Friend
Of mine, was a farmer, of no man’s land.
He dug for deep places to station young
Sprouts, and weeded out the unwanted,
Who crept closer, on the surface.

If you look hard enough, you’ll find those six degrees.  Your job entails you to
look hard,
Night and day, night and day.
Two years.
Whether insignificant or immense, is it a struggle to search out our differences?
You represented our country, now I see I represent you.

I’ll elaborate, yet it’s too late to help a friend I never knew, he too did not know
Me.  What was coming.
As small as the imperative poppy blowing across the pock-marked road.  Gunfire had forced this vast face of landscape into manhood.

The ironic truth of the Almanac.  And we parallel our companionship with empty stomachs.  A cultivator of inedible thoughts, on a far-off comatose soil; of previous lives lived, loved and tossed into the Seine.
A span of 20 flowing in his veins.  Carriers of soldiering motivation.  So much covered the contrasting ground; A great spill of red on white.
A wasted gift?  A generous donation of red, until the rain would visit to cleanse the skins enveloped in a uniform green.  All 19, 20, 21.
It’s done.  I’ll use their bitter sweet allegories to feed new allies, newer acquaintances.  An easier six degrees.  Yet, the closest witness is too out of reach in distance and in time. 
An inaccessible hero.




As is going over the top, I expect this to be just as hard.  Unripe.
Not every harvest turns out.  The Great War took many seasons; to this, she will testify.

You fought, I’ll inform ‘til all are allies.  As I lie within, I’ll grin, for all your
sadness and chagrin have been harvested.
A burden no more.

Your bounty is perfect, every right intention.
Sometimes things must be picked early so others can prosper.  A soldier is aware.
Yes, there is guilt, but not for volunteers.
Call me Lucky; I have time to grow.  Gratitude towards the swiftly aging who revealed this to the land.  Your dedication has taken root, nurtured by countless thank-yous.

Ninety years, Vimy, please meet me
Half way.
I could never in your 19 years describe your 19 years.  Too humbling for your views;
Chancing misinterpretation.  Your elation from here to there.

Another outlook we often overlook:
Was it for piece of mind?  Piece of land?
Until I find out, Sir,
I indulge myself in this peace.


In memory of
Private William Louis Armstrong
(January 17, 1897- April 9, 1917)
Occupation: Farmer
Force: Army
Cemetery: Givenchy-En-Gohelle

Alix Ferwerda
Miles Macdonell Collegiate
Winnipeg, Manitoba



Written by my friend and posted with her permission

 

[FascistLibertarian]

Hey all. First time poster and very intrested in military history.
I think what we did at Vimy was amazing, do not get me wrong at all, I have great respect for it.
My question is why does not one ever talk about Lens, 2nd Ypres, Amiens or breaking the Hindenburg line?
Some of these seem equally important and impressive!
By Lens i mean that battle for Hill ____ I just can not remember its #.
Thanks!

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

Because it was the first time the Canadian Corps fought as a unit and winning it was quite unexpected.  The victory was also largely due to innovative planning by Currie.

 

[1feral1]

EDIT: I hope many of you take the time to read these few paragraphs I put together. Vimy is personal for me, and no doubt many other Canadians, still to this day. Vimy, even now is a milestone in Canadian history. Aside from the obvious, its about standing you ground, putting forward your beliefs and sacrifice, and being there for your mates.

This war cost Canada over 60,000 killed, and then there is the casualties which numbered in the hundreds of thousands. The gassing, the bullets, and shrapnel, all causing the most hidious injuries. Many totally incompacitated for the rest of their lives, some living to be old men, still carrying these injuries. Some old soldier told me once 'there are worse things than death'. Blindness ,amputations and facial disfigurement.

We cannnot forget the shell shocked and the emotional trauma caused from this battle (and others), which even in today battles our soldiers experience. Life goes on, but battlefields are simply that, and only the technology changes. Maybe take the time to reflect the current operations both the CF and Allied Forces are currently on at this very moment you read this.

Many Canadians of that generation referred to Vimy ridge as the birth of the nation (Canada). For years the English and the French tried to take the Ridge from the well dug in and fortified Germans, and both dismally failed. The Canucks did it in a day with low casualties. The 'rolling' artillery barrage was born.

Try reading Pierre Burton's book VIMY, but be warned, once you start it, its very difficult to put down. In my entire life, its one of the best books I have ever read, and it makes one feel proud to be Canadian even from something so long ago.

09 April 1917.

I had two Great Uncles, PTE's Tony and Alf Meahan, and one 3rd cousin at Vimy that day. The cousin, PTE Richard Marlin (late of the 38th Ottawa Battalion) is buried not far from the Ridge itself. He was killed outright with his Unit's advance, and is buried in a communal grave with two others at a near by CWGC cemetery.

My two Great Uncles survived Vimy and the war, both enjoying life, living to be old men, marrying and having many children. Tony lived into his 70's, and Alf well into his 80's. Tony chose to live out his years in Detroit Michigan, and Alf in Vancouver. Both men were wounded, Tony so bad, that he (literally) held his guts in with his tin hat, somehow dragging himself back to the lines for help. Alf had shrapnel wounds to his forearms and the back of his neck. I remember his scars so vividly ever since I was a kid.

I always thought that Tony was tramuatised his entire life, and never spoke much about those times to anyone, as I can remember my Mom telling me never to discuss the war with him. I was about 12 (even at this age I was interested in the military) when he died. Alf was different. He mentioned the Ridge many times to me, and he loved his whisky and his cigars. He was proud of his accomplishments, and as a young Militia soldier, I remember him telling me how his Vickers would spout steam once it was hot, and give their positions away to the enemy. He died in 1979 or 1980. Two different men who handled the aftermath of The Great War differently.

Just a few thoughts about Vimy, as the 90th anniversary comes up in less than a month.

Cheers,


Wes

 

[time expired]

John Galt
            Lieut.-Gen.Sir Julian Byng may have had a little to do with the success of this operation
given the fact that he was the commander of the Canadian Corps and Currie was only a division
commander.
                                REGARDS

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

John Galt
            Lieut.-Gen.Sir Julian Byng may have had a little to do with the success of this operation
given the fact that he was the commander of the Canadian Corps and Currie was only a division
commander.
                                REGARDS

Currie is commonly credited with responsibility for the planning and tactics that were utilized ...

 

[AJFitzpatrick]

Hey all. First time poster and very intrested in military history.
I think what we did at Vimy was amazing, do not get me wrong at all, I have great respect for it.
My question is why does not one ever talk about Lens, 2nd Ypres, Amiens or breaking the Hindenburg line?
Some of these seem equally important and impressive!
By Lens i mean that battle for Hill ____ I just can not remember its #.
Thanks!

In many respects the choice of placing the monument on Vimy Ridge consigned the other battles of the Canadian Expeditionary Forces to unwarranted obscurity. Vimy Ridge was also one of the rare "glorious victories",  while the battles of "Canada's 100 days" were responsible for more casualties then any other comparable time period they are seen by some, however inaccurately, as "mopping-up".

 

[Michael OLeary]

Byng
Currie

Let's not forget Andy McNaughton

 

[3rd Herd]

Wes,
if you take the time/have the time to put together several paragraph's it is defiantly worth the read. From the teacher perspective you hit the nail on the head with the "Birth of a nation". Aside from Burton any work on this battle is a good read. Based on some on and off reading and a survey course on the battle I would cast my vote for Currie as to the success. Although Micheal does bring up McNaughton who later gave politicans fits will trying to fix the military. If your ever in Europe you should visit the site while it is still there.

 

[riggermade]

Wes

I want to Thank You for sharing your thoughts on Vimy.  As our veterans are almost gone it is in books and their thoughts shared with others that will carry the memory along.

I was always fascinated by WWI and did a speech on Vimy when I was 12 or 13 and it still fascinates me

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Wes,

Thank you for sharing your memories with us.  It can be too easy to forget that battles are fought by people in the end.

FL,

I believe that Vimy stands out in our collective national memory for a number of reasons.  It stood out at the time as a clear cut victory with a tangible objective captured as opposed to what had gone before (and after).  It represented the coming-together of the Canadian Corps, which was itself important (even though the Commander was British as noted by others).  I think that AJ hit on an important element as well.  The Vimy monument elevated the battle in the national conciousness after the war.  It should be noted, however, that the Vimy monument commemorates all Canadians in WWI, and the names of all Canadians who fell but have no known grave are inscribed there.  I had the privilege to visit Vimy a few years ago and I was deeply moved.

Perhaps it is not 'fair' that some battles become famous while others become obscure.  The 8th of August 1918 was a tremendous victory and few know of it (even in the military).  That battle, taken with the Last 100 Days show the Canadian Army arguably at its best ever but it lacks the resonance of Vimy.  The 8th of August was also a trememdous victory for the Australians and memories of it could be seen as being obscured by the tumult of events around it.  Vimy is isolated in time and space which makes it stand out in Canadian experience.  Although other nations were present, it was "our" battle.

I, for one, am glad that Vimy does capture attention as that keeps WWI alive in Canadian memory.  Vimy may capture the attention of people who can then learn about the other battles.

 

[reccecrewman]

One major reason is it was the first major offensive undertaken by the four Division's of the Canadian Corps acting together.  It was not the Canadian colonials under the patronage of the British Army, but the citizens of Canada in the Canadian Army accomplishing a huge feat. It's an old cliche that Canada wasn't born on 1 Jul 1867, but rather on Easter Monday 1917. There is some truth to that in the sense that after Vimy, Canada came into it's own as a Nation.

Secondly, it showed our British allies that the Canadian Corps was every bit as good (or better) than any formation in the British Army and Vimy provided an excellent reason to ensure that the Divisions of the Canadian Corps always stayed together as they fought extremely well together.

Thirdly, those battles you named as not getting much mention were built on the shoulders of our success at Vimy.  My final point to you is I find it hilarious that you ask why Vimy gets so much attention and battles you named do not.......... yet you failed to mention Third Ypres.  That my friend is the battle that the Canadian Corps participated in that gets virtually no attention whatsoever due to the fact that Third Ypres only brings back the horrorible memories of Passchendaele.

The British Army went through the meat grinder at Passchendaele for virtually zero gains after three months of bloody fighting.  Fortunately for Canada, we were spared the bloodletting of Passchendaele because we were in the Vimy sector at opening of the battle.
After three months of futile fighting, Sir Douglas Haig was desperate for some sort of tangible gain in his ill-fated Flanders campaign..... He needed somthing the British people could see as a reason for the terrible cost of lives.  The Canadian Corps with it's rapidly building reputation as a crack formation was selected as the tip of his spear to take Passchendaele.

Sir Arthir Currie accepted the assignment on the condition that after the Canadians took Passchendaele, they would be pulled out of the region immediately, he didn't want his Corps to be subject to being whittled down during the winter of 1917-18 holding the ridge.  Haig agreed and the Canadian Corps went in and took a position the Germans occupied since the beginning of the war (The German defences here were extremely good, and the Germans commanded virtually every height on an otherwise very flat piece of real estate) Coupled with these defences was the mud........... mud so soupy and slick that horses, men and waggons were known to disappear if they slipped off the duckboards.  In virtually open ground under the eyes and fire of the Germans, our men constructed duckboard roads to enable the artillery to follow our infantry over the morass of Passchendaele.  The Canadian Corps took Passchendaele ridge and the town at a cost of nearly 14,000 (Sir Arthur Currie's estimated casualty figure before the battle even started)

All in all, Passchendaele was a near disaster and to this day, an embarrassment to the British Army, but Canada should (We don't because very few are familiar with what the Corps accomplished here) take immense pride in Passchendaele.  It can also be argued that the Canadians in Passchendaele literally broke the back of the German Army, as the bulk of German forces engaged at Passchendaele were the flower of their Army - their best Divisions. Germany admitted to approx. 280,000 casualties over the course of the battle, however that figure has been disputed and could be as high as 350,000

As to those that vilify Sir Haig for continuing the Passchendaele campaign for continuing the offensive after the opening phases, obviously has no clue about what was going on.  The British Army had to keep pressure on the Germans because of the mutinies in the French Army that could have been doom for the Allies on the western front had the Germans known about it and went to exploit the weak link.  The French Army would not attack........... had the British opted to stand on the defensive as well, that allows the Germans to plan and mass forces for their own offensive that if delivered to the French could well have been victory to the Kaisers troops.  Passchendaele kept the Germans fully occupied with the British and allowed the French Army to recover from their inner turmoil. By the fall of 1917, the French Army had recovered enough that they could participate in limited offensives.

Vimy deserves every recognition it gets.............

 

[AJFitzpatrick]

  The Vimy monument elevated the battle in the national conciousness after the war.  It should be noted, however, that the Vimy monument commemorates all Canadians in WWI, and the names of all Canadians who fell but have no known grave are inscribed there.  I had the privilege to visit Vimy a few years ago and I was deeply moved.

Just a slight correction. Canadians who fell in Belgium with no known grave are commemorated at the Menin Gate in Ieper (formerly Ypers) whereas the Vimy Memorial commemorates those who fell in France with no known grave.

 

[FascistLibertarian]

Thanks all, these have been some well thought out answers.
Wes thanks for sharing that story.
On a personal note I have a soft spot for 2nd Ypres as my great grandfather got gassed there.  He had medical problems for the rest of his life I think although I am unsure of to what degree and I think he lived until the 1950's at least.
It was our baptism under fire and we held the line while the others ran!
Yes 3rd Ypres should have been mentioned I just do not know as much about it as the 5 other battles.
I can remember reading a story in english class in hs about vimy but not about any other battle in that war.

 

[Blackadder1916]

....the names of all Canadians who fell but have no known grave....

And not to forget those who served at sea.
http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/remembers/sub.cfm?source=memorials/ww1mem/seamen

The Imperial War Graves Commission erected the Hollybrook Memorial in Hollybrook Cemetery, Southampton, England. It records the names of those who went down in vessels mined or torpedoed in home waters, as well as elsewhere in the world, from transports to hospital ships, and whose graves are not known. The total number of officers and men named on this Memorial is 1,868, and 64 of these are Canadians.

But there are a few Canadians whose remembrance of The Great War does not turn first to Vimy but another place and memorial.  Beaumont Hamel.

 

[chriscalow]

Wes, Reccecrewman, thank you for bringing us back down to earth on this.  It seems most Canadians are so far from educated on things such as this.  Good posts, to both of you.

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

AJ/ Blackadder,

Absolutely correct and quite lazy of me! The point I was trying to make was that the Vimy monument is about more than Vimy Ridge.

As an aside, here is a thread from a little way back on Canada and WW1.  I never did find out if the fellow got his paper done, but it was an interesting thread at the time. 

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/34853.0.html


Cheers

 

[Blackadder1916]

Red Five, agreed.  Both Vimy and Beaumont Hamel are "National" memorials meant to respresent the total effort of each country in that war.  Beaumont Hamel may be more unique (along with the other Nfld memorials in France and Belgium) in that it represents both an "entire" country and a "single" regiment.

I've been lucky in having been able to visit that part of the world many times and have seen a lot of the memorials, cemetaries and former battlefields of the First World War.  (Can't say 'most' because there are just too many)  Though I 'may' be biased due to heritage, Beaumont Hamel and Vimy (in that order) arouse the most emotions though the sentiments are not necessarily the same. 

Beaumont Hamel, to me anyway, has always been a sad place that brings forth thoughts of the sacrifices made.  Vimy, on the other hand, raises different feelings; that, while men had laid down their lives in this ground, it was with a sense of deliberate purpose and hope of a greater future.