Using the Forces to fight terrorism in Canada

[acheo]

Why not using the Forces to fight terrorism in Canada and improve security in our home land?

We work very hard when we get deployed but let's be honest: back home we don't work too hard.  Go in the civilian industry for a while and you'll find out what working is all about.

Here are a few things we could do:

1. Inspecting shipment/containers
   In Montreal only 10% of the containers get inspected. In Vancouver they're a little bit better with a 25%.

2. Helping custom agents by patrolling the borders
   Spotchecking  small roads, lakeshores, beaches

A few good reasons:

1. Serving is country would then take a deep meaning. ;
2. In some cases this is better than training;
3. Tax payer money would be better used.

Of course this require vision by not only our political leaders but also by our military leaders.

salut!  

 

[Infanteer]

Why not using the Forces to fight terrorism in Canada and improve security in our home land?

...because that is what the Police do.  We are authorized provide Aid to Civil Power if the civil authorities lose control (and if requested), but one has to be careful when employing military forces against one's own populace.

We work very hard when we get deployed but let's be honest: back home we don't work too hard.  Go in the civilian industry for a while and you'll find out what working is all about.

A:  Are you in the Army?
B:  If so, what Army are you in?

My brothers-in-arms in the Infantry Corps appreciate your revelation that we don't know what working is all about.

<Ignore>...click.

 

[paracowboy]

Why not using the Forces to fight terrorism in Canada and improve security in our home land?

because that is not our role. There are other agencies that are designed specifically to do that sort of thing.

We work very hard when we get deployed but let's be honest: back home we don't work too hard.

  I got troops haven't spent more than 1 week a month in Garrison in the last 3 months. I got troops with two or more trips to Afghanistan. Yeah, we don't work too hard at all. Go slap yourself.

Go in the civilian industry for a while and you'll find out what working is all about.

Been there, done that. Doesn't compare. Just because you're too lazy or unimaginative to keep yourself occupied, and gainfully so, don't assume the same thing is true of me or my unit.

 

[acheo]

...because that is what the Police do.  We are authorized provide Aid to Civil Power if the civil authorities lose control, but one has to be careful when employing military forces against one's own populace.

own populace??? I believe I wrote  containers/shipment

Police Corps are out of funds and cannot get the job done. I've got a few relatives in different corps and they're simply overwhelmed.

A:  Are you in the Army?
B:  If so, what Army are you in?

My brothers-in-arms in the Infantry Corps appreciate your revelation that we don't know what working is all about.

A. I'm in the Canadian forces

I didn't mean to insult your brothers-in-arms and I'm sorry for the misunderstanding. I know we work hard when we get deployed. The problem is back home.

I worked 10 years in the aeronautical industry and there is no comparison. In the Forces we are spoiled and not too many people know it. When a typical day is like sitting at the desk telling war stories or spending your morning at the Petawawa Tim Horton or jogging and weight lifting I say: YES we don't work too much. In order to claim this however it requires a little bit experience in the REAL world.

Besides I wonder what you have against contributing a Little bit more to your homeland security?

 

[geo]

When a typical day is like sitting at the desk telling war stories or spending your morning at the Petawawa Tim Horton or jogging and weight lifting I say: YES we don't work too much. In order to claim this however it requires a little bit experience in the REAL world.

telling war stories while sitting at my desk sippin a cup of java from Timmie's?
Is that what I'm supposed to be doing everyday?
Wow...... am gonna have to get my act together! (NOT!)

 

[J.J]

1. Inspecting shipment/containers
   In Montreal only 10% of the containers get inspected. In Vancouver they're a little bit better with a 25%.

Only 3% get inspected....both in Vancouver & Montreal

 

[acheo]

For those who cannot read I said the problem is not when we get deployed.

Besides forums are used to debate ideas not to put them down. This illustrate this lack of vision I was talking about

 

[geo]

Police Corps are out of funds and cannot get the job done. I've got a few relatives in different corps and they're simply overwhelmed.

Besides I wonder what you have against contributing a Little bit more to your homeland security?

Gov't laws at they exist today requires the civil authorities at the Municipal level to ask for assistance. The Province must ask for assistance......

They don't ask... the CF can't act.

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

I'll sum this up:  the idea (aside from being asinine) is illegal.

Edit:  Ok, it isn't illegal, and others - along with myself - have explained the process for calling out the Army on other threads... I just woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning...

In the Forces we are spoiled and not too many people know it. When a typical day is like sitting at the desk telling war stories or spending your morning at the Petawawa Tim Horton or jogging and weight lifting I say: YES we don't work too much.

I don't know what Army you're in, buddy (although the "pilot" in your profile suggests you're not Army at all), but I'm sure we can find you a job instructing in Gagetown, Meaford, Wainwright or any of the other of the myriad of places that we can use "spare capacity" such as yourself. 

 

[GAP]

Without trying to get into the work ethic issue, the idea of utilizing the forces in areas that would enhance their training might not be that far out.
One example I can think off the top of my head, is the night observation of connecting waterways to the states. It supplies the potential of giving excellent training in night reconnaissance and other aspects.

On the dock inspections, I think there might be problems. While existing agencies might be overwhelmed, I can visualize the groups of troops being shunted off into makework stuff or left to do distasteful stuff. That whole issue would have to be carefully crafted for it to be effective

 

[acheo]

I could not have said better (in English anyway). Night flying observation was exactly what I had in mind. Great training, usefull ops and strong marketing tool (for those who care).

Inspecting the dockyards is not conceivable at this time because the mighty unions would strongly oppose to it. It is an idea nothing more......

 

[Franko]

As it was already alluded to earlier...we can't act unless ask for and enabled by the gov't. They haven't therefore we won't.

Also it's the RCMP, Customs, CSIS, and local authorities responsibilities for "Homeland Security"....not ours unless the above is done first.

If we acted outside of the above...it's called martial law and could also be misconstrued as a coup. Never thought of that 'eh?

Also I don't know what unit you're with but the average unit is quite busy enough with deployments, training for said deployments, and assisting in TMST / exercises for said deployments.

On top of all that we still have to try and squeeze in regular trade specific training when there is a window.

If all you do is sit around Timms and down coffee after coffee listening to such "war stories as":

"Remember that time outside of Bihac...." or "Remember on SG 05 when we got gassed..." seems to me the problem doesn't lie in the system...

It lies in you and your unit's inability to keep your troops up to snuff in training and busy enough in taskings.

Must be some nice to have all that time to sip coffee and whine about all that wasted time....

Regards

 

[acheo]

Couldn't expect less from you army guys.

Next time I go in Gagetown or in Wainright I make sure I give you a hell of a ride Teddy Roxpin 

 

[paracowboy]

Couldn't expect less from you army guys.

welcome to ARMY.ca

You don't like dealing with army guys, leave. Have an airborne day.

 

[Nicholas2004]

The following are a couple of suggestions on how the CF can help fight terrorism in Canada:

(1) The CF could provide EXTRA manpower at border crossings/security at ports.

(2) Joint training exercises with US military in the more remote areas of the Canadian/US border

While these suggestions might be at best symbolic.  They may go along way in calming America fears over the porous nature of the border eventhough it will always remain that way.  More importantly, using the CF might help some sections of the Canadian public realize that we don't live in isolation from the rest of the world and that the threat of terrorism is ongoing and does not end with the arrest of one  terrorist cell in Toronto.

My final point is that it is not as difficult to employ the regular forces in a domestic role in Canada than it is in the US.  Unfortunately, in the past this has made a certain mayor of Toronto think that the regular army can be employed sholving snow.

 

[Franko]

Couldn't expect less from you army guys.

Next time I go in Gagetown or in Wainright I make sure I give you a hell of a ride Teddy Roxpin 

Well if you put that degree (I'm going with what you have in your profile) to use before you started to type there wouldn't be any backlash.

Think before you type your tripe.    :

Have a lovely Recce day.....

 

[Franko]

The following are a couple of suggestions on how the CF can help fight terrorism in Canada:

(1) The CF could provide EXTRA manpower at border crossings/security at ports.

(2) Joint training exercises with US military in the more remote areas of the Canadian/US border

While these suggestions might be at best symbolic.  They may go along way in calming America fears over the porous nature of the border eventhough it will always remain that way.  More importantly, using the CF might help some sections of the Canadian public realize that we don't live in isolation from the rest of the world and that the threat of terrorism is ongoing and does not end with the arrest of one  terrorist cell in Toronto.

My final point is that it is not as difficult to employ the regular forces in a domestic role in Canada than it is in the US.  Unfortunately, in the past this has made a certain mayor of Toronto think that the regular army can be employed sholving snow.

We're having a hard enough time keeping up with the op tempo right now nevermind doing something like you're suggesting.

Even the MND understands this.

Regards

 

[paracowboy]

the entire Army is over-tasked, under-manned, under-equipped, and losing it's senior personnel at every turn. And you guys want to add tasks. Brilliant.

 

[KevinB]

cough - underfunded - cough


Teddy point about illegality is a MAJOR point.

Besides entities of the CF do have an inside Anti-terror mandate -- however IF they other servies do their thing it does not get to that point.

You, I or anyone else does not want the ARMY policing Canada -- that's a police state.

 

[Good2Golf]

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/44701/post-389671.html#msg389671

Niiiice.

Acheo, I hope for your own sake you are not a pilot at 427 (combo of your admission to being a pilot in your profile and talk about yakking at CYWA Timmies leads me to wonder.)  If you are, I think the we'll be having a chat once I get my rear-end out of a 10-12 hr/day desk job - a non-deployed (or to be more accurate, job after redeployment from AFG) that seems to bear absolutely no resemblance to the kind of BS you're spouting in your missives.

You know what, if your such an altruistic hardworker, leave the CF and go back to join your hardworking aerospace friends in industry.  I would rather operate my unit short by one more person...with the remaining "lazy folk".

Goodbye.