PUHLEMS Profile
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mikeninercharlie
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Here you go..
Physique
Upper limbs
Lower limbs (or 'Locomotion', as this includes the back)
Hearing (left)
Hearing (right)
Eyesight left (corrected / uncorrected)
Eyesight right (corrected / uncorrected)
Mental function
Stability (emotional)
Physique
Upper limbs
Lower limbs (or 'Locomotion', as this includes the back)
Hearing (left)
Hearing (right)
Eyesight left (corrected / uncorrected)
Eyesight right (corrected / uncorrected)
Mental function
Stability (emotional)
George Wallace
Army.ca Dinosaur
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mikeninercharlie said:
Someone just got a box checked in their PER......
Duplicated Hearing.
Duplicated sight.
Added the requirement for a Psychiatric professional to analyse you for Mental functionality and emotional stability.
Looks like it will take 365 days to get your Annual Medical done now....Just in time to start again...As if our Health Services weren't already strained enough.
medicineman
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George Wallace said:
MJP beat me to it...RT(F)Q GW ;D
George, this was related to a conversation I had with my father-in-law yesterday.
We were talking about psychometiric testing for the military. Once he had retired from the RCAF (where hee was a CR Clerk with the AVRO Arrow project at one point) he ended up back in the Brockville Rifles and was helping the Manning Depot as a clerk At the time they used the MMPI on recruits for the Militia as well as the regulars. I recalled a PzAuklrbtn Capt telling me that he asked the Div Psychiatrist to send his way conscripts who would do well on the Boeselager Team. I was amazed that the Bundeswehr psych screened every conscript - over 2000,000 per year.
On ALP at the CMR campus a few years back, I asked why we could not test 8,000 a yearvif the Germans could test 200,000. I said that ten more Clayton Matchees and we would not have an arrmy left. He told me that the top rungs in Ottawa were more worried about drug testing than Psychopaths.
When you look at pre-dispositions for OSIs and PTSDs, psychometrics would save a lot of resources.
We were talking about psychometiric testing for the military. Once he had retired from the RCAF (where hee was a CR Clerk with the AVRO Arrow project at one point) he ended up back in the Brockville Rifles and was helping the Manning Depot as a clerk At the time they used the MMPI on recruits for the Militia as well as the regulars. I recalled a PzAuklrbtn Capt telling me that he asked the Div Psychiatrist to send his way conscripts who would do well on the Boeselager Team. I was amazed that the Bundeswehr psych screened every conscript - over 2000,000 per year.
On ALP at the CMR campus a few years back, I asked why we could not test 8,000 a yearvif the Germans could test 200,000. I said that ten more Clayton Matchees and we would not have an arrmy left. He told me that the top rungs in Ottawa were more worried about drug testing than Psychopaths.
When you look at pre-dispositions for OSIs and PTSDs, psychometrics would save a lot of resources.
George Wallace
Army.ca Dinosaur
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TCBF
It will all boil down to dollars in the end.
It will all boil down to dollars in the end.
A big part of it.
I also still think that there are some influential people in our society who think that the military still has sufficient spine in its justice and administrative procedures to handle society's misfits.
Fact is, we no longer do. The oil patch has a more robust HR program than we do and our military justice system has been civilianized to the point of dysfunction.
We would save money throuth psychometrics. When I was an SSM, none of my soldiers getting help for 'non-visible above the neck injuries' had ever deployed overseas.
I also still think that there are some influential people in our society who think that the military still has sufficient spine in its justice and administrative procedures to handle society's misfits.
Fact is, we no longer do. The oil patch has a more robust HR program than we do and our military justice system has been civilianized to the point of dysfunction.
We would save money throuth psychometrics. When I was an SSM, none of my soldiers getting help for 'non-visible above the neck injuries' had ever deployed overseas.
medicineman
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I can say this, as I'm sure M9C can as well, that when I did medicals on folks (enrollment, PHA's, whatever), I certainly picked up on a lot of stuff from them - you just have to look and listen for it. Body language about how questions are answered, words chosen in speech, mannerisms, even how medical questionnaires are answered - you can tell who's actually reading them and those that are just checking off the "I have no problems in my life" stuff to go on deployment...nobody's life is perfect. The reason I'm (and most of my colleagues are) like that is because I've seen what happens when you don't pay attention.
I think it's a good idea actually, but until we hire enough shrinks to do this, it's left up to the primary care folks - another reason why we should be going back to intimate medical units within the Battalions and Regiments, so we get to know our patients better. As a company medic/unit PA, I knew who all my guys/gals were, how they acted normally and when they were stressed or sick; who were malingerers and who were too hard to show they had a broken leg; and of course those who were the "broken between the ears". Another rant for another day though.
MM
Edit to make up for a grammatical oops.
I think it's a good idea actually, but until we hire enough shrinks to do this, it's left up to the primary care folks - another reason why we should be going back to intimate medical units within the Battalions and Regiments, so we get to know our patients better. As a company medic/unit PA, I knew who all my guys/gals were, how they acted normally and when they were stressed or sick; who were malingerers and who were too hard to show they had a broken leg; and of course those who were the "broken between the ears". Another rant for another day though.
MM
Edit to make up for a grammatical oops.
Blackadder1916
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TCBF said:
A few days I fell into conversation (socially, not professionally) with a psychologist, German born, who had served in their army. Recalling this thread, I asked him about psychological/psychiatric screening of Bundeswehr conscripts. Since he had not been a psychologist during his service (went in as a conscript private, left as a conscript private at the earliest opportunity), his knowledge of the specifics of the screening was somewhat limited. However, his recollection of his induction (late 1970s/early 1980s?) leads me to believe that their screening was not much more different than ours at the time, but with variations to account for Teutonic efficiency. While there may have been a lot of psychologists employed in the screening of conscripts their function was probably similar to Personnel Selection Officers as well as performing some of the administrative duties that our recruiting centre staff do, i.e. overseeing aptitude testing. There did not seem to have been a focus on the "clinical psychology" aspect to their screening process other than what an "arzt" could glean during a properly conducted medical examination.
It should also be noted that in that conscript military there is a benefit if the individual is found unfit for military service, he gets to go home and doesn't have to do alternate service. I suppose a more professionally trained person interviewing conscripts (vice a serving soldier who may not be as skilled in that realm) may be able to better identify malingerers.
While I haven't found much on-line about specifics of Bundeswehr screening (at least not in English, and reading German makes my head hurt) I did find this which deals with their conversion to a computer based testing from pencil and paper.
http://iacat.org/sites/default/files/biblio/wi80-01.pdf
For a discussion of faking (both to look good or bad) during screening of conscripts (Switzerland, however) https://www.uni-saarland.de/fileadmin/user_upload/Professoren/fr53_CKoenig/PDFs_Publikationen/BossKoenigMelchers_preprint.pdf
And for those who want a much more detailed explanation of PULHEMS, it's all in
http://wartimecanada.ca/sites/default/files/documents/Physical%20Standards%20and%20Instructions%20for%20Medical%20Examination%201943.pdf
Blackadder1916
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TCBF said:
You're welcome.
It should be noted that the Germans didn't recruit like we had to, well not very much. They didn't have to find individuals who may be interested in trade "x" or "y" and then see if they had the aptitude. Every year the gross numbers needed showed up and then through aptitude testing they found the ones best suited for trade "x" or "y", regardless of the wishes of the conscript (though they probably were asked what interested them). Perhaps that's why there was such a large number of psychologists in the screening process - matching the best job to the individual, often someone who did not want to be there.
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