Harper government may face rough ride over military purchase

[kilekaldar]

Great, from what the article says this Heavy Lift purchase will turn into another Sea King debacle.
We need cargo planes, both tactical and strategic and these guys can only bicker about politics and whose ridings are getting pork barrels.
Guess a few Hercs will have to crash with my friends and coworkers(or me) aboard before we get planes.
Pathetic, and so emblematic of canadian politicians.

http://www.canada.com/topics/news/politics/story.html?id=37a352eb-23ea-45f8-9fc9-a97e72da33d2&k=51063

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Excuse my frankness but fuck the province of Quebec or any other province that wants kick backs.  AKA the LSVW.  We need all methods of tpt and the C17 is tried tested and true.  Harper should wait until parliment is on their summer siesta and make the announcement.

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

I'll admit that I was completely mystified by this article and what its point was.  The author appears to be comparing a potential purchase of C-17s with the cancellation of the EH-101, even though the scenarios are completely different.  Then, he trots out a retired bureaucrat, one who bears a significant amount of responsibility for our current dismal situation, who wants us to investigate "alternatives".  What "alternatives"?  Russian aircraft?  Seriously?  As I have posted on other threads, there are no rational alternatives to the C-17.

Here's the problem as I see it.  The CF managed, after years of trying, to get the previous government to actually buy into a coherent policy.  Part of that effort was an attempt to manage expectations.  Jean Cretin said that we didn't require strategic lift, so that was left off the agenda, as were tracked vehicles - both because they couldn't be sold to the government of the day.  Did this mean that heavy lift wasn't required?  No.  Instead, the CF took a look at the priorities and at what was then the art of the possible and decided to drop heavy lift from the list of "must haves".

Now, we have a new government - one that's promised to provide all the items agreed to by the previous Liberal government PLUS add heavy lift.  Who is going to say no, particularly if other requirements have been addressed.  I certainly don't agree with everything proposed by the Conservatives in the defence arena, but they're not wrong here.

This article smacks of politics of the first order and a feeble attempt by a petrified bureaucracy to defend its turf and bleating by the BQ in its traditional attempt to ensure pork for Quebec.  Perhaps Mr Blanchfield could have done a modicum of reading and research before publishing such tripe.

TR

 

[Fishbone Jones]

He's already got my backing, and a timely decision, without worrying about the pigs at the trough, will only strengthen my support.

 

[Enzo]

Teddy - You said what I was thinking while I was reading this, so I'm just simply going to support your position 100%.

I can only laugh at the BQ over this, I can see it now: "The BQ proposes that Bombardier undertake to develop and produce the required transport aircraft ready for the CF in 2007, with full subsidization by the Federal Government of course."

And don't get me started on Dosanjh. I will never understand how a politician feels that by the mere action of being appointed to a post (defence critic) that in any way makes their opinion more than just that; an opinion since qualification and experience are less relevant than a timely soundbite.

 

[geo]

Excuse my frankness but frig the province of Quebec or any other province that wants kick backs.  AKA the LSVW.  We need all methods of tpt and the C17 is tried tested and true.  Harper should wait until parliment is on their summer siesta and make the announcement.

Please stop making 1st kicks at Quebec........... over and over again (ad nauseum). Am black and blue and have had enough - thank you very much

Chimo!

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Never heard the BQ and the lieberals bleating when their boss 'la gangster de shawinigan' bought two new jets from his son in law at Bombardier, with defence funds. That process took what? 2 or 3 days? And we didn't even need those, just left over from a deal gone bad in South America. But hey , can't have his daughter's hubby looking bad to the shareholders, could he?

 

[Enzo]

Never heard the BQ and the lieberals bleating when their boss 'la gangster de shawinigan' bought two new jets from his son in law at Bombardier, with defence funds. That process took what? 2 or 3 days? And we didn't even need those, just left over from a deal gone bad in South America. But hey , can't have his daughter's hubby looking bad to the shareholders, could he?

Sweet  ;D

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Did the RG-31's face any kind of competition?

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Did the RG-31's face any kind of competition?

RPGs and IEDs mostly. At that point, what else matters?

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Well if our oppostion parties have RPG's there should be an investigation as to if they went through the equipment competition rules and if these RPG's were made in Canada.

 

[Franko]

First off where does Dosanjh get his info because it sure isn't from end users. This is yet another one of his knee-jerk reactions to the PCs spending on the CF.

He must have a buddy that has a vested interest in Bomardier    :

Well here we go into yet another fric frac over the procurment process.

Let the nagging begin.

As for the IL-76 purchase idea....it'll never happen from what I've been told about how AC are brought into the system. Too much money needed to train and convert things to Canadian standards IIRC.

My $0.02 worth.

Regards

 

[Cdn Blackshirt]

I'd have to say the writer seems to have his own axe to grind with Harper which taints the rest of what appears to be a long whiney uneducated bitchfest.

That will be good news for Boeing, the American manufacturer of the C-17, as well as for the Bush administration.

WTF is that?


Matthew.  :

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

I missed that little nugget buried in the pile of excrement...  So much for unbiased reporting.  :

Then again, I don't expect much lately...

 

[Brad Sallows]

>''It's easy to guess, well, we like C-17s. But you don't know until you test the marketplace whether or not it is the best product,''

"Test the marketplace"?  What marketplace?  What is there in production that is comparable?

 

[Enzo]

>''It's easy to guess, well, we like C-17s. But you don't know until you test the marketplace whether or not it is the best product,''

Amazing how once again a commercial mindset is applied to the M-I-L-I-T-A-R-Y.

It's just so assinine. Look at this guy's credentials; politics at its worst once again. Do you hear that sound? It's our ancestors rolling in their graves.

>

 

[Long in the tooth]

All DND is to the Government, in the end, is a PR tool.  Right now we are highly visible due both to A-stan and the presence of the charismatic Gen Hillier.  We're still viewed as a big, slow and fat target by the pols and will be the first to be cut  So either we'll get new planes pronto or it will be studied and contracted to death, just like the helicopters.

Take a look at the subs - if the government wants it could be a decade of upgrades, trials and studies before we have 4 effective ships.  No matter how principled Harper is in his military views, we're still a political instrument.  In any contest with health or education we end up third.

 

[Bobbyoreo]

I've explained this to many people. Mostly Civy's but how hard is it to understand that the forces need planes now..not in the 8-15 years that they want to play around with a bidding process. Everyone I explain this too understands...now do I need to sit down with the librails and explain this with crayons and paper!!! Just buy the stuff we need. We already have SOME crews or people trained on the C17...lets just do it!!!

 

[Kirkhill]

Alan Williams, a retired federal public servant who knows more about buying military hardware than just about anybody else in official Ottawa, said the plan to buy C-17s without competition is a bad deal for taxpayers because it robs the government of all leverage in negotiating.

Alan Williams, wasn't he the guy in that sweet little polka-dot bow-tie that "negotiated" the deal on the Subs.  What else did he negotiate between 1993 and now?  The Griffins and the Challengers?

I can't think of much other stuff that has been negotiated since then.

 

[Enzo]

Alan Williams, a retired federal public servant who knows more about buying military hardware than just about anybody else in official Ottawa

That really isn't saying much is it. It's right up there with, "Kim Campbell was the best female Prime Minister that Canada ever had."  >