Communications and Electronics Engineering ( CELE )

[Tyrnagog]

I am interested in joining the Army, as a DEO with a career path in CELE. The recruiting officer says that this [ath was just split into 2 areas, one specialing with the army, the other with the air force. Does anyone here no anything about this?

Thank you!

 

[Bert]

I guess this reply is a bit late but here goes.

Check out this link:

http://www.img.forces.gc.ca/commelec/school/cfsce_e.htm

About half way down the page, look for the miliary occupations. From my understanding, the CELE program is split for job specifics rather than anything else. Heres a cut and paste from the program description:

"PHASE IV - Formal Training
This phase marks the separation of air and land CELE officers into the different environments. The aim of this phase is to complete your basic training and prepare you for your first employment as a CELE officer. While earlier phases are more structured, Phase IV more closely resembles military post-graduate education. Prior to starting this phase, you will be assigned to the Land or Air environment for contact employment at selected air and land units. This will provide you with an opportunity to exercise the skills that you have until this point. You will then be returned to Kingston for the final phase of advanced training at the junior level. Land training is approximately 13 weeks in duration and Air training is approximately 10 weeks in duration. The topics covered in this phase are related to the strategic, operational and tactical communications systems as employed in larger combat formations. You will learn how to support operational commanders in every facet, including knowledge of communications employment in military operations, maintenance, and requirements. You will also receive some basic knowledge of communications and electronics project management.

PHASE V - On-Job Training
Following Phase IV – Formal Training, you will undergo a period of "On-Job Training (OJT)" that will provide the necessary "real world exposure" to complete your training. You will perform the actual tasks of a CELE officer, under supervision, in a land or air operational unit. You will then be ready to be assigned to a leadership position at your first unit."

 

[devrik]

Hi all, my big lug (well ok so he‘s a little pale and willowy from possibly wasting his last 4 years getting a CompSci degree) is Waiting on the Call. Looks like he‘s got plenty of company!

Here‘s what I got from Wpg recruiting and various news articles:

1. Next basic Sept19-Dec19 with 2 weeks off for Xmas

2. No more IAP-BOTP or whatever...now the first ten weeks, all officer candidates mix in with everyone else, last 3 weeks split out for the leadership bit

3. Bonus is 40k, 25k payable on successful finish of basic, 15k a year later. Keeps you around, keeps you from getting killed in taxes.

4. Minimum contract for DEO 4 years, says Globe & Mail.9 years, says some Captain downtown. Surely not for the DEOs? Anyone know this one?

Clarifications/corrections welcome.

p.s. How did everyone else end up here? My guy was sure he could get a job at the CSE back in the old days when jobs were fast and thick on the ground. Remember those old days, oh, a couple years ago?!!

CELEwife

 

[McG]

The obligatory service is 4 years, the contract is for 9. That means that if he leaves of his own choice prior to the 4 years, he pays back the money. Leaving before the 9 years (but after the 4) has other penalties, but he can keep the money.

 

[Tyrnagog]

hehehe... CELEwife... My wife is going through the exact same thing right now..

All of your info sounds correct, except I am not so sure with your point 2 (IAP/BOTP).. afaik, IAP/BOTP is still around. But then I may have some wrong info too...

McG is correct about the terms of the contract for the 40k signing bonus.

How did I come around? Well, I graduated last year with a Bachelors of Electronics Engineering. I was sure to get a job except for one thing. The dot-bust.

My job prospects sunk about as quickly as Nortel stock (!)

Ah well... Since my brother-in-law joined up as a Gunner, I have been kinda jealous of the training he‘s gotten... and there is also some family history for me..

Great-Grandad.. PPCLI (WW1)
Granddad... fought in WW2 (Armoured)
Father (Reservist)
Uncle (Member in the signal corps until he retired)

So I guess it‘s in my blood... Best of luck with your hubby getting in this round.. I know the wait is **** .

Is he bilingual? I know that‘ll make things quicker.. and seeing how you are from Winnipeg...

[edit] You may want to post this same message in the recruiting board. It is a lot more active then the engineering board, and there are a lot of people with a lot of experience there as well...[/edit]

 

[devrik]

Thanks for your reply Tyrnagog, will take your advice and move to ‘recruiting‘. Now all I gotta do is find out if spouses can visit in the Megaplex. It‘s so huge, there must be a spare room for me somewhere! Ok, so I should wait till he gets in, right? But I want to know what‘s possible and what isn‘t.

McG thank you for clarifying that 4 years and 9 years were both right re contracts. Should I worry about these ‘penalties‘ you spoke of? Jumping the gun I know! But when you‘re waitin on the Call, you do a little speculating.

 

[Wingman]

Hi all,

I was wondering what the difference is between a CELE (83) and Signals Officer (84). I applied to be a DEO CELE when it was Army or Air Force. Now it has separated and would like to hear the differences from military personnel in the vocations. I have read the new job descriptions.

A few general questions:
What different equipment does each vocation work on?
Are the postings purely Army or Air Force?
Where are the main postings for each (Army - Gagetown, Shilo and Edmonton - I think)?
I would like to be posted internationally (NORAD as a possiblilty); which vocation has the better chances (I worked in the US for 4 yrs as an Engineer)?
Any other differences that I have not questioned?

Thanks
Wingman

 

[Tyrnagog]

To answer a couple of questions as best I can (I am currently waiting to hear from the officers board in this occ.)...

Signals Officer (84) is the land designation and CELE (Air) (83) is the Air Force designation.

What are the differences? Well, as I am not there yet I can‘t tell you for sure.. but the website gives some good examples.

83: As a CELE (AIR) officer, you will become involved with numerous high tech electronic systems that support our Departmental command and control environment such as the computer networks and communications systems that support surveillance/ reconnaissance/intelligence, data/information/knowledge management, air traffic control, the full spectrum of terrestrial radio and satellite communications from HF to EHF, radar and navigation, electronic warfare, cryptography, electronic intelligence, and communications and network security

84: As a Signal officer, you will become involved with Army Command Support systems such as Land Force Command, Control and Information Systems (LFC2IS), Intelligence Surveillance Targeting and reconnaissance (ISTAR) systems, the full spectrum of radio systems from HF to EHF, electronic warfare systems, cryptographic systems, and systems for communications security.

So there is a fair bit of difference.

As for where you will be posted, well I can only partly answer that for the army, as that is where all my questions have been directed. As far as I know, the places you mentioned (Shilo, Edmonton and Gagetown) are fairly popular, as well as Petawawa, Kingston, etc... however, it is possible that you oculd be attached anywhere, to any unit (again, afaik).

It is possible to get posted overseas. When I had my interview, the capt. said that Signal men were among the first in bosnia, setting up some of the critical infra-structure (anybody, please correct me if I am wrong).

I know I didn‘t touch most of your questions, but I hope I answered them somewhat...

 

[Wingman]

Tyrnagog, thanks for the info.

I guess I‘m trying to get an idea of what each job work environment is like. Also my wife wants to get her masters degree and we are currently in a city with no university and no job opp‘s for her. Therefore I would like to be eventually posted in a city with a good university.

 

[Wingman]

For those interested. I just heard the CELE board has convened and we will hear the results in a couple of weeks.

 

[dddenisss]

Hi all,

    Like many people here, I am in the process of applying for officer in CF.  My choice is Signals Officer.

    I talked to my recruiter, memorized official CF website and left no thread unturned on this forum.  However, I still have unanswered questions concerning my future profession. 

  -what status/image do Sig Officers have in the army? Are they labelled as paper pushers by Navy/Air?
  -can I expect to participate in combat?
  -do Sig Officers get weapons practice after they finish their training?
  -I am a bit crazy about crypto and computer security. Should I expect to see that as part of my day-to-day activities?

    I would appreciate unofficial, straight-from-the-source answers.

    Thank you!

 

[bossdog]

As aCELE officer, you will many opportunities to do many different things. Do yourself a favour and don't worry about labels. From the men (NCM's), you'll rarely measure up - that's just the way it is, don't take it personally. If you want some hardcore hands on communications and electronics work then you should join the regular NCM force. We are the ones that handle most of the items that sound interesting to you. A CELE officer will be mostly doing paperwork and trying to organize a section, signing leave passes, approving tasking orders, etc, etc. Everyone that goes through initial military training will qualify on the C7 rifle while officers normally qualify on the Browning 9mm pistol. NCM's also qualify on the 9mm and other weapons depending on their unit. Again the men are the ones with all the medals on their chests from deployments. When an officer has more than two medals, it usually means that they started out as an NCM.

Again, this is my personal experience and I try to remain objective. Other pers may have other opinions from their experiences. My unit is a high readiness unit that deploys on a regular basis. I can not speak for CELE officers that are posted to static positions (Ottawa for example).

Hope this helps a little bit. Feel free to PM me with other questions.

 

[dddenisss]

    Thanks! I appreciate your reply.

    I understand that officers go through C7 and handgun training.  After I have done my training and get posting, are there places where I can practice marksmanship?  As you can tell, I am a bit of a weapons lover. :threat:

    Thanks again for your answer!

 

[bossdog]

After that, you train when you are told to train.

 

[rdschultz]

I've got a question that this topic reminded me of.  When I first starting checking out joining, there were CELE (Air) and CELE (Land) occupations.  Some time after that, they changed the CELE (Land) to Signals Officer.  Was this simply a name change, or did anything else change along with this?  Does anybody know the reason for the change?

 

[bossdog]

There you go, I didn't even know that it changed. I couldn't say why.

 

[wongmanfei]

RE: Reply from Kingston Jimmy

To: Kingston Jimmy

Can you please stop talking about officers in the CF being paper pushers ? All officers in CF have basic and combat training (handling weapon is part of the training requirements). Officers are the leaders in the CF. They do tactical planning as well as administration planning. They don't behave as Kingston Jimmy described in his reply here.

Thanks,

Wong Man Fei

 

[Rushrules]

The CELE trade likes to change it's spots every few months or so.  Still doing the same job- officers and NCMs ensure Comms always avail.

 

[bossdog]

If you look for the key words in my posts you would see that I am speaking only from my experiences and from what I see. I thought that I made that clear in original reply. Hopefuly I haven't hurt anybodies feelings here 

 

[spacedog]

Good afternoon all,

Just joined this site recently and noticed a few threads regarding CELE/SIGS.   I remember having a difficult time finding answers to a lot of my questions when I was applying, so I figured I'd offer my services to any potential CELE/SIGS Officers.  

I'm a SIGS DEO with 1 year in and I'm currently posted at CFB Kingston at the CFSCE.   Still waiting to finish my training, so I obviously don't have answers for everything, but I definitely know a lot more than I did a year ago

So feel free to ask whatever.   You can also email me at spacedog@canada.com if that's easier.