Comm Res No More?

[2929]

I've heard some RUMINT recently from friends at multiple Com Res units that basically states the Communication Reserve as we know it is no longer. As the rumor goes, we are no longer our own separate little organization and now fall under Land Force command w/ units from the respective Comm Gp's being part of the regular old reserve brigades (i.e. 74 Comm Gp units now fall under 39 Bde).

Now having heard nothing official about this matter and knowing how fast rumours travel in the Comm Res I am taking this news to be pure poppycock (as should you if this is the first you have heard of it) but, being the curious cat I am, I'm wonder if anyone else has heard this rumour?

This idea (true or not) intrigues me as I have wondered if having the Comm Res fall under the same command as the rest of the Army Reserves would allow for more integration with/support of Army Reserve units and, in turn, more effective trg for Comm Res units. For example, the trg we currently do at my unit usually involves:

    1) Setting up at different locations and having a bunch of Sig Ops try to talk to each other.
    2) Trying to get the LCT to actually work.
    3) Setting up a giant CP just to have someone come by, call it pretty, and then have us tear it down.

I have always found this can you hear me now and look at our giant CP type trg, for the lack of a better word, stupid. The most useful trg I ever received was when I actually supported other reserve units on their exercises, you know doing our job by providing commanders and their staff the means to exercise command and control. I'm not trying to question the direction we are going in (DOMOPS, etc), but the integration of the Comm Res w/ other Army Reserve units.

So I ask, do you think that having the Comm Res fall under the same command as the rest of the Army Reserves would allow for more integration with and support of Army Reserve units and, in turn, more effective trg for Comm Res units?

Sorry for the double question, but I'm curious if others have heard this rumor and what others think about the general idea of the rumor.


Edit for Clarity

 

[medaid]

Funny thing because I have heard of this as well, and I am of the Health Services World. I think the reintegration of all assets into the Army would have its ups and downs. I will not elaborate because my quips are more for the Medical side, but ya... I've heard of this little rumor.

 

[career_radio-checker]

I've heard this rumour too and am quite glad to see it happening. I have been on my fair share of Exercise Jupiter-can-you-here-me-nows'? and Exercise-F***ing Mod! I can only agree with you whole heartedly that the best training I've ever received was supporting other units. I was still talking to other jimmies but at least my log book wasn't filled with RC // LC (hence my army.ca name). The only downside I can see is that unit budgets might be effected as training gets amalgamated. But who cares, the commres is actually part of the army now!  ;D (... well of course here's to hoping that RUMINT is a reliable source )

 

[sigpig]

While I was at 746(Calgary) Comm Sqn, 1991-98, we supported the local Militia units a great deal and had a very good rapport with them. Note that I don't know about the situation since I've been away.

From a selfish point of view, I would hate to see the Comm Res units amalgamated into the Militia. We always had more trg money per soldier and were able to conduct more training nights, exercises, and other support tasks because of this. If the Comm units join the Militia, that money goes into the big pot and will be thinned out. Again, I point out that this situation was as of 91-98 and things may have changed that I'm unaware of.

Another positive, from the Comm Res point of view, of the existing system, is not being caught up in the bureaucracy and politics of the Militia world. That in itself made life great many times.

 

[Staff Weenie]

It'll be interesting to see if this is actually happening now. I've been aware of this intent for years now. When I first came to Ottawa (2000) to start working on moving the Med Coys out from the Army, I had many discussions with the LFRR folks, and some with the Comm Res world (to see how they had managed 'the divorce').

Back then, the Army was upset in that they had, when the Comm Res became its own entity, given up approx 400 funded positions for the founding of the Comm Res (Baseline Transfer, as was done for the Health Services Reserves I think). This was done with the tacit agreement that the Army would get all the support it ever needed from the Comm Res, whenever, however. But.......the Comm Res (I'm speaking in very general terms here) began heading off and away from the tactical level support that the Army so acutely required. The Army has been less than happy about it ever since.

In the end, the Army has been slowly pushing since around 2001 (that I know of) to get them back.

Makes we wonder if they'll try to get the Res Field Ambs back some day????

 

[Sig_Des]

I held off on posting about this. Until recently, only senior and day staff at Comm Res units was aware of this being pushed on. From what I've heard, speaking with a CO, is that there will be a 1 year transitional period. Yes, Res Sigs, we're back in the army. Yay!

I think there's some good and bad on both sides:

Individual Training:

-BMQ/SQ/PLQ will most likely go back to Regional Levels. This means no more flying all Comm Reservists to Shilo for summer training. Access to Bde training courses. Possibly more positions. Good

-Not having the recruit school in Shilo to be manned means more staff to teach at F Squadron at CFSCE during the summer. Good

- Comm Reservists will have better opportunity for summer taskings. In the Past, certain Comm Gps wouldn't approve summer taskings unless all the positions at Shilo and CFSCE were filled. Basically, unless you had a good reason, no tasking unless there's no more Comm Res taskings. Good

-Access to more soldier skills training. Good

-May lower the ammount of Comms skill training during the year. Bad

Unit Training:

- I think what we'll see is less of a Comm Gp comms ex, and more of a Bde spprt capability. Ex: Det A of 7** Comm Sqn will be assigned to 3X Field Engineer Sqn. When 3X deploys on weekend Ex, Det A will provide a CP and Comms support. Probably good. The downside in this, will a Bde G6 staff have the resources to write up multiple comm plans and CEOIs for multiple excersizes, or will units have to incorporate more Comms planning in their ops cells, or will this revert to the Comms unit to make up CEOIs for units they're attached to?

- Less cross training with other Comm units in regions.

- Will there be specific funds available to Comm Res units? Comms are expensive.

- What will happen with the R291 initiative?

This is all I can think of off the top of my head. But like I said, all speculation til we see the directive come out.

 

[muffin]

My understanding is that this is not limited to Res - I have heard that the Joint Signals Regiment is going back to the army too.

 

[Sig_Des]

My understanding is that this is not limited to Res - I have heard that the Joint Signals Regiment is going back to the army too.

The difference is that Reg F Sig Ops ARE a part of the Land Element. Comm Res was it's own element.

 

[muffin]

Good point

 

[career_radio-checker]

The difference is that Reg F Sig Ops ARE a part of the Land Element. Comm Res was it's own element.

Proud passengers of the short yellow bus, right Des? 

 

[Sig_Des]

The passengers of the short bus weren't all bad, it was the drivers and sometimes the dispatch 

 

[chrisf]

I'm depressed about this, solely from the point of view that the comm res always had more money, and more training time...

I know from the point of view of our unit, to say that we weren't supporting the local army units was ridiculous, we gave them all the support they asked for. I know from personal experience, at least half the exercises the local units did, we sent out a CP. And about half of those worked out. The problem was that we were generally left out of the planning process for the exercises, even left out of pre-deployment o-grps for that matter... end result is, we provide what they request (A tac rad CP), they don't always get what they want (Or even WHERE they want it, I've actually been in situations where they failed to give us a LOCATION). End result is we're frustrated because they exclude us but still expect the full level of support, they're frusted because they don't get what they expected, and as a result, don't bother to request our support in the future.

Sticking the comm squadrons into the brigades will NOT fix this lack of communications.

 

[career_radio-checker]

I'm depressed about this, solely from the point of view that the comm res always had more money, and more training time...

I know from the point of view of our unit, to say that we weren't supporting the local army units was ridiculous, we gave them all the support they asked for. I know from personal experience, at least half the exercises the local units did, we sent out a CP. And about half of those worked out. The problem was that we were generally left out of the planning process for the exercises, even left out of pre-deployment o-grps for that matter... end result is, we provide what they request (A tac rad CP), they don't always get what they want (Or even WHERE they want it, I've actually been in situations where they failed to give us a LOCATION). End result is we're frustrated because they exclude us but still expect the full level of support, they're frusted because they don't get what they expected, and as a result, don't bother to request our support in the future.

Sticking the comm squadrons into the brigades will NOT fix this lack of communications.

First point: We spent our extra training time cleaning out the cages sometimes 2-3 weeks in a row. That's if we were able to find the mystical keys to the very real locks on the cages which no one seemed to have. Great use of time  : Although I must give credit to the Senior NCOs for improving the training schedule and putting a lot of effort in to training the stuff that they know from personal experience (tricks of the trade). But that still wasn't unit training because we never really got a chance to get out in the field to apply that knowledge.

Second point: Yes I have seen that too, when comm res sqdns were left out of the planning phase. Talking to the Bde staff that was because most of them were unsure who to contact Comm Res or the local unit, nor were they sure if they could even use Comm Res because supporting local militia units was like our 7th mandate!!!

Third point: finding the location is easy: "Sir where are you sleeping? Right here? ok we'll bring the truck right up."

Fourth point: bringing everyone under the same roof SHOULD, in theory, improve communications.

 

[chrisf]

First point: We spent our extra training time cleaning out the cages sometimes 2-3 weeks in a row. That's if we were able to find the mystical keys to the very real locks on the cages which no one seemed to have. Great use of time  :

Sorry, but if the training time isn't being spent wisely, it's the fault of the unit, joining with the brigades isn't going to help. We had effective training pretty much every time we were signed in. We ran regular refreshers on everything, we had extra money if we needed to run unofficial courses on anything the unit felt people needed to be trained to do, and it wasn't at all abnormal to show up on a thursday night at 1900 with orders to have your truck deployed by 1930.

Second point: Yes I have seen that too, when comm res sqdns were left out of the planning phase. Talking to the Bde staff that was because most of them were unsure who to contact Comm Res or the local unit, nor were they sure if they could even use Comm Res because supporting local militia units was like our 7th mandate!!!

Sorry, but I don't consider that an excuse either. Our local militia units regularly requested our support, and we were in direct contact with the people planning the exercises. They just chose to make the requests and then ignore us until the day before the exercises, even when we flat out begged to be included in the planning phases. But to heck with the planning phases, we generally weren't even included in basic things like the pre-deployment o-grps.

The comm res has been around a long time... if they don't know by now who to contact, doesn't sound like a fault with the comm-res...

Third point: finding the location is easy: "Sir where are you sleeping? Right here? ok we'll bring the truck right up."

Nonsense. For weekend level exercises, the CP generally deployed with the advance party, because we were given no move orders, we had no choice but to either find somone who looked like they knew what they were talking about within the advance party, and check with them  (Generally the quarter-master, who somtimes had the information we needed, and if he/she didn't, it certainly wasn't their fault) or follow the advance party to where-ever they were setting up, which usually ended in somone else being angry because we weren't in the location they wanted us to be (Despite having been asked earlier where they'd like us to go)

Fourth point: bringing everyone under the same roof SHOULD, in theory, improve communications.

How?

I'm not saying that shifting us to the brigades is nessiscarily a bad thing (It is if we get our funding cut), I'm just saying don't expect it to fix anything.

 

[Sig_Des]

I remember one excersise, it was a Cambrian Patrol Ex in support of a Bde.

We were tasked with a Det. Bde said, don't worry, we have everything, we just need the ops.

So being a believer in problems, I snagged a couple RRB Cables from our QM. We sent one guy ahead on the advance party the friday morning, and that afternoon the rest of the Det drove to Pet in a milcots.

I actually have a video, of me on my cell phone, talking to the guy with the advance party. You should see the look on my face when I'm told that they only have one vixam mast between 2 trucks, and that it doesn't have any guy wires or a base plate. That on friday afternoon, they wonder if we have suggestions as to where to place an RRB. That they want us to program all the 521s Friday night. And finally, when we get there. No CEOIs. A list of frequencies..that's it.

So they tell us: Fine, you're sigs. Make us a plan. This is around 1-2 AM in the morning, Ex starts at 6:30. We made it work, but it was something that rhymes with blustertuck.

What was the problem?

They didn't have proper CEOIs. They didn't know what equipment they needed. We were only told "we have everything ready. Just provide the operators".

Now, I worked with the G6 cell of that Bde after. I dealt with one Sgt in particular, who would call me up the week before, and ask me what he should have, what could he get from us. That's what the G6 cell is for. They should find out what the unit in question needs, see what they have, and liaise with the Comms unit to plan the comms aspect of the ex.

Involving the Sigs is key. If we know what you want, we can do our damndest to provide it. Wether we're a Comm Res or Area/Bde asset, this has to happen.

 

[sober_ruski]

This means no more flying all Comm Reservists to Shilo for summer training

Meeting people literally from one coast to another was actually rather interesting.
On the other hand, i never want to go back to shilo ever again .

 

[geo]

I remember a time that Comm res had much more of a budget than the remainder of the Army type reserves.  Much training & special projects were conducted under their funding...... too bad that`s about to dry up.... but I would venture that if the Med branch also rejoins the army, all land reserve units would fall under local command.... time will tell, time will tell"!

 

[2929]

Involving the Sigs is key. If we know what you want, we can do our damndest to provide it. Wether we're a Comm Res or Area/Bde asset, this has to happen.

This is somewhat what I was trying to get at in my original post. In my experience (BC Comms Unit) we've rarely been involved with anything but ourselves, maybe 1 or 2 support ex's in a trg year. As to the factors that caused this I have no idea, I'm just a lowly Signalman w/ a rudimentary grasp of army politics.

That being said, do you think that being an actual Bde asset lead to more involvement of Sigs with other units? From my point of view, it would indeed lead to better communication and therefore more involvement with other Army Reserve units (and in my opinion better and more effective trg) just from the simple fact that we would generally fall under the same chain of command (correct?).

I know I may have answered my own question but, I'm curious as to what others think will happen and why.

 

[sigpig]

That being said, do you think that being an actual Bde asset lead to more involvement of Sigs with other units?

Your profile says Vancouver so I'm guessing you are with 744 Regt? Being in the same chain will mean attending O Gps and conferences and such so that so remind the Militia that you exist and raise your profile.

But I have to wonder why a unit that is in the same city as so many Militia units and a Bde HQ seems to have such little contact with them now? 1 or 2 sp ex's in a year with all those units around? That's unbelievable. 746 would get that a month during the trg year back when I was in.

 

[dapaterson]

The difference is that Reg F Sig Ops ARE a part of the Land Element. Comm Res was it's own element.

There are three elements: Sea, Land and Air.  Comm Res is Land Element.  They are, however, a seperate sub-component of the Primary Reserve.

That, in a nutshell, is why there is an increasing call to move some elements back to LFC from CFSTG, CANOSCOM and ADM(IM) - to ensure the land-centric portions of training are better integrated.  It should also enable better co-operation - as the replies in this trhread have shown, it's hit and miss right now whether Comm Res units work closely with their Army Reserve bretheren.