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A students view on our history...

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Coniar

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I have been reading up on Canadas military historys, mostly in the 1st and 2nd world wars. I just thought I would say that it is a shame that more Canadian history is not taught in schools. In Social Studies this year (for the second year in a row) we studied the Middle ages Egypt Rome and Greece all good subjects but ones we already covered several times in elemetary, we did not onec talk about Vimy Ridge, Paschendale, Deppie or Juno beach we did not talk about Canadian politics, issues or problems. The history of Canada military or otherwise was never mentioned once all year we had Social Studies every other day for an hour and a half and I never heard a word about our fomer Primeinisters our founding the Natives of our country or the wildlife. I find it sad that the school system deems the crop rotation system of the French 700 years ago more importants than the people who gave there lives for Canada. Most if not all of my friends have never heard of Vimy Ridge or Juno beach some have heard of D-day in general but not of the Canadian part of it. Does everyone know about this and not really care? or is this a shock to you? Is it schocking that our school system has decided to forsake patriotism for world history? The US high schools call the class History not Social Studies, probably because theres actually teaches American history, The reviloutinary war the founding fathers the civil war. I know this because I have many American friends. Does everyone know about this and not really care? or is this a shock to you?

Coniar
 
No, not shocking at all.

I had history class in an Ontario High School, and the Canadian content portion was the weakest section, and other than a very quick general overview of the wars, probably less than one day on each, very little was mentioned of these great Canadian battles. I think the name Vimy Ridge were dropped maybe once, but no real information was given on them, other than it had something to do with Canadians. My best recollection of Canadian War history in school was when the teacher turned out the lights and played some kind of national Film Board Video about Cdns in WW1. Of course, nobody was paying attention, most of the kids were sleeping or doodling or talking. Very little if any Cdn war history was on the tests or exams, and I can recall no projects assigned for that unit. I have complained about this alot on other sites, and wished I had confronted my teacher about it back then, but of course I was young and didn‘t care. Also there are many around in positions of authority who feel that teaching about war is the same as glorifying war and therefore should be discouraged.

If I were you, I would ask what your teacher had to say about the matter.

Canadian content in general is very poor in Canadian education, I beleive I read somewhere that only 2 provinces have a set curriculum for Canadiana and that 2/3 Canadians can‘t even name a single Canadian invention or inventor!
 
In grade 9 I got taught about the railroads and the creation of canada ALOT. IN grade 11 we had like 2-3 months about Canada in ww1. And we learned about Vimy, Pachendale, Ypres, etc. However, we never learned anything about ww2 untill grade 12 history.
This was in BC btw.
 
in my grade 10 history class we covered both world war 1 and 2 and covered each for a month each. This is ontario by the way. We learned a lot about what happened amd i really enjoyed the class.
 
Defence Minister Ignorant of Dieppe:
‘I never learned any of this in school,‘ McCallum says of 1942 battle

Chris Wattie
National Post

John McCallum, the Minister of National Defence and titular head of the Canadian Forces, has conceded that until last week, he had never heard about the 5,000 Canadian troops who stormed ashore for the Dieppe raid, one of the greatest military disasters in Canadian history.

The former banker, who was appointed Defence Minister last May, has no military experience beyond four years in his private school‘s Air Cadet corps and says he has a lot to learn. He replaced Art Eggleton, who was fired.

"I had a pretty good -- you could even say a privileged -- education," Mr. McCallum said during his visit to the French port last week to mark the 60th anniversary of the raid. "But I never learned any of this in school. I haven‘t even been to Vimy Ridge ... yet.

"This is, in a way, a sort of crash course in the military and military history," he said. "So I‘m getting everything all at once: from the [liberation of] the Netherlands or Dieppe to Afghanistan."

Duane Daly, the dominion secretary for the Royal Canadian Legion, was saddened by the Defence Minister‘s ignorance.

"It‘s really unfortunate," he said yesterday. "But it‘s not just McCallum: It‘s all MPs and Cabinet ministers. So few have any military experience or even knowledge of our history."

Mr. Daly said the ignorance of Canada‘s leaders reflects broad and long-standing flaws in the teaching of history in Canadian schools, but wished Mr. McCallum well in his "crash course" on military history.

Peter Stoffer, the NDP defence critic, said: "It‘s incredible that he wouldn‘t know that. No one can expect him to know about every battle in every war, but Dieppe was one of the most important battles in our history. You would think the Defence Minister would know that."

Leon Benoit, the Canadian Alliance defence critic, said Mr. McCallum‘s ignorance of things military is in character for the entire federal Cabinet.

"This government shies away from things military," he said. "They feel uncomfortable talking about anything to do with the military, particularly the combat capabilities of our military.

"So I‘m not surprised."

Mr. Benoit said he takes some comfort from the Minister‘s apparent interest in learning about the soldiers, sailors and airmen under his command. "I think he‘s finally starting to realize the importance of a strong military. And that‘s a good thing."

To help him make up for lost time, the Minister has arranged for National Defence historians to give him private tours whenever he visits such historic sites as Dieppe.

Last week, an historian walked Mr. McCallum and a handful of aides along the stony beach where Canadian soldiers stormed ashore in 1942, showed them the seawall and the wide esplanade where the town‘s German defenders mowed down the men, and patiently explained the progress of the battle.

As crowds of French sunbathers stared curiously and gulls wheeled and shrieked overhead, Mr. McCallum was told about the 907 who were killed and nearly 2,000 who were captured, and was given a brief prÈcis of the causes of the disastrous operation.

"It was amazing to me ... It was very moving," he said after his tour. "I have a new respect for the military.

"You can draw a parallel between what these 80-year-old [veterans] did in Europe and what the 18-year-old [Canadian Forces soldiers] did in Afghanistan."

However, the Minister‘s grasp of historical parallels is not yet perfect. In a speech to veterans of the raid and government officials in Dieppe last week, he vowed: "to do the best I can ... to see that our modern generation of soldiers and airmen and seamen have the same resources to fight for freedom and democracy that you did."

The Canadian army, navy and air force was tiny, ill-equipped and underfunded when the Second World War broke out in 1939.

"I sure hope they‘re better prepared than we were," one veteran said with a chuckle.

And in an interview shortly after his visit to Dieppe, the Minister evoked the disastrous raid in musing about possible Canadian participation in any U.S. attack on Iraq.

"One thing we can learn from Dieppe is we must not rush into combat. We must be very careful," he said after a ceremony to honour the Canadians killed during the 1942 raid.

Mr. McCallum, whose father was a decorated veteran of the Second World War, is being given the benefit of the doubt by many members of the Canadian Forces and appeared to impress most of the veterans of Dieppe he met last week.
 
I know it‘s not the topic, but as feedback from the events concerning the 60th anniversary of the Raid of Dieppe was one of the most touching events i‘ve ever experienced. Old people coming to shake your hand and thank you! Kids, adults, people of all ages are showing a great respect of canadian military. It‘s weird to see that this respect isn‘t even partially present here, in our own country. It was a great event, and i‘m lucky to have went to Dieppe and remembered them of this event.
 
ok pardon my franch but John McCallum is a ****ing idiot and should be kicked from his position right now. A man with very little knowledge of military history (especially ours) should not have that extremely important responsability.
 
Like i just posted on another board, it‘s truly sad when someone with such a "privilaged" education doesn‘t know F*** all about the history of Canada militarily.

Here in Newfoundland, we learned about the Canadian contribution to WW1 (army mainly since that really was the only considerable contribution that stood out) and the navy‘s contribution in WW2. We learned about it in two courses, Canadian History 1201 and World History 3201 (both of which I‘ve done in my newly ended high school life).

I don‘t recall us learning about Canada‘s army much in WW2, and that was disappointing. Luckily, I was probably the only person in the class who knew a lot of Canadian Military History (my favourite reading subject) so I managed to teach them a few things when I got the chance. I will agree that it is disappointing to see the provinicial history curriculm to become more and more ignorant of the great Canadian battles and our armed forces as time passes. It does pride me though to see many of my age group and the younger ones attending events like Memorial Day on July 01st, however, due to the lack of education on military history in schools, those crowds grow smaller and smaller each year unfortunately.

Let‘s face it, history courses are becoming downright boring. There‘s rarely any interest in the courses and I personally think that learning more about Canada‘s miltiary heritage would increase interest in those courses. If there is one thing that teenagers in high school finding interesting, its hearing stories about the past wars. It‘s really the only interesting part of a historical cirriculm in high school, yet it is very vague.

I recommended a few books to my class last year to read if they wanted to learn more about Canadian Military History, too bad most will never even look at the cover of those books. One of the better books I‘ve read is "A Military History of Canada" by Desmond Morton. I think that that book should be a course onto itself in Canadian schools, it is very informative and, unlike history books now, it presents the ups and downs of the battles more so and the situation of the Canadian Military at the time. History books in schools tend to repeat wartime propaganda which inflates everything about the military events like WW1, and WW2, while not providing a proper, informative, critique and overview of military events.

I‘ll stop my rant there, I‘m sure there are points where I‘m incoherant, if so, don‘t hesitate to ask questions, I have a habit of going off on a tangant when I am ranting :)
 
Linc said:
Canadian content in general is very poor in Canadian education, I beleive I read somewhere that only 2 provinces have a set curriculum for Canadiana and that 2/3 Canadians can‘t even name a single Canadian invention or inventor!

I have to agree with you there. In our high school we had a Canadian Studies course, basically for the rompers while the rest of us did French. The teacher had a loud voice so you could listen to his lectures throughout the school and one day he asked them who the current Prime Minister of Canada was...two people raised up their hands of the class of 20, only one of them got the answer right. That is just shameful don‘t you agree? We really do need to have more Canadian content in our courses as well as more public knowledge of Canada.
 
Since the 1970‘s, the canadian secondary education system has taken a "revisionist" approach to history. Most history before that period was military and empire oriented, particularly after WWII. Sadly canadians (in general) took on the american impression of Vietnam, and decided that we need to focus on "social" history, having the battle orientated stuff left in the closet. I know this as I tutor History 12 and throughout my university degree I had the frustration of trying to pursue course work geared to military endeavours. It sux, but is true. here in Vancouver, my regiment has a storied history, and has been a landmark for most of the 20th century. I mention that I am a reservist to people at parties, etc., and somehow they think i am a baby killer. Great. Not that that will stop me in doing what i believe and trying my best to support Canadian sovereinty. We can thank the feds for this kind of respect of our great achievements in the past, and lack of recognition. The reallity is that Canada‘s independence was formed on the battle fields of WWI and WWII, not during the Trudeau era...dang, I am starting to get mad and on a roll.... :mad:
 
...and another thing...most of the university profs and second ed teachers are a bunch of ex-hippies anyway.....blah blah blah
 
Haha, great to know that I‘ll have a bunch of hippies teaching me my minor in history, LOL!
 
I think a Noufoundland hippie is different than a British Columbia Hippie... :)

So I speak tongue in cheek here, and biased probably because I don‘t (and will not ever) wear birkenstock‘s......but I do have a Volkswagen Westphalia...I kinda look like this in it... :tank:
 
haha. Newfoundland hippies weren‘t pot smokers, they were alcoholics in most cases according to my parents. I had some "Newfoundland Hippies" in high school for teachers, it was pretty comical.
 
Coniar, although I agree with your general sentiment that Canadian schools do not go far enough in teaching Canadian history, I wish to point out a couple of things:

- French crop rotation 700 years ago is actually probably crucial stuff to know. It is a basic progression of agricultural techniques, which revolutionized productivity. In a more refined form, it continues today, and the end result is you have food on your table. It may not be the sort of "practical" knowledge you will need to apply in your everyday life, it nevertheless will expand the character of your wisdom to understand a little of basic farming back then, and your knowledge of how it‘s done now. If you should ever find yourself a general one day, commanding an army in some far away place, it is entirely possible that your troops may have to educate a fractured populace in basic farming principles, if for no other reason than to feed your troops. But, I digress...

- Much of what Canadian history I learned in school, I have since learned is probably a result of some revisionism, or at least, ignorance of other issues (perhaps for political reasons?). For example, I had always heard in school that Louis Riel was a pretty important guy, along with his co-conspirator, Gabriel Dumont. If I were Metis, I‘d surely agree that yes, these folks did a lot for my people. Perhaps, if I were even from the Praries, I‘d even say they were significant folks. But, the historical truth is closer to this: They were rebellious criminals who led an uprising and were eventually exiled/arrested, but that eventually the government gave in to some of their demands in order to avoid a wider uprising. The same could be said for the Republican agitator, William Lyon McKenzie, who led the Upper Canada Rebellion, such as it was, and would eventually become Mayor of Toronto, bringing disrespect to that position, in my opinion. But never mind, Toronto‘s present Mayor does a fine job of continuing the tradition of bringing disrespect to that title.

- I never learned in school that, in fact, it was British regulars and Loyalist irregulars who fended off the impetuous attacks from south of the border during the War of 1812. All I knew was that a fellow named Brock was killed by an American sniper, and that eventually Canada won the war. Not entirely accurate, the latter, but I got the gist. Thanks to self-study, and a course in Ontario Frontier history at the university level, I now know that the defence of Upper Canada would probably have been impossible if not for chance, and a few hundred Indians following Tecumseh‘s leadership. Britain‘s pressure on America‘s navies certainly helped, and most of all, when Britain concluded it‘s war with France and had thousands of veteran troops suddenly available for a new campaign, this could have persuaded the Americans to agree to a settlement as well.

Embarassingly enough, you are certainly right about more modern Canadian history. I am ashamed to repeat that, when the movie "Dieppe" was being filmed in my old neighbourhood, I had believed that we Canadian‘s had kicked *** . Lo, I was brought back to reality! School never taught me!

For me, history is almost a passion now. I read till my eyes are blurry, in particular about the Royal Navy in the Med and West Indies during the Napoleonic period, as I can trace ancestors to that time and place. History with a connection hold my interest much better than history taught in school ever did.
 
Hello all. I‘m new to this site, and an American to boot, so I hope no one will take offense to what I‘m about to say, but...
CANADA WON THE WAR OF 1812?!?!?
[suppressed laughter]
I‘m sorry, but is that what they teach up there? I mean, how do you define your victory? That the Canadian militia was able to fend off a few weak attacks by a disorganized US Army which the American militia refused to support? Or are you counting the burning of Washington by your (then) Imperial masters as your own win? I‘m not trying to dump on you guys, I‘m genuinly interested in how it‘s taught there. The war in usually ignored here because: 1) it was unpopular to start with, 2)it really didn‘t accomplish much and had minimal impact on American history and 3) it really was a stupid war. As far as who won it...well, yes, Canada fended off several American attacks, but we fended off every Canadian excursion onto US soil. The British blockaded the US coast and burned Washington, but the US Navy outpreformed the Royal Navy in many one-on-one engagements. And to top it off, Andrew Jackson kicked British *** at New Orleans...after the war was over. So it‘s pretty hard for anyone to claim a win. So seriously, how‘d Canada beat the US?
 
Sgt Smedley writes:
_______________________________________________________________________
"The war in usually ignored here because: 1) it was unpopular to start with, 2)it
really didn‘t accomplish much and had minimal impact on American history and 3) it really was a stupid war."
_______________________________________________________________________
Something like Vietnam? Just because the US didn‘t gain anything (except maybe some humility, no matter how short lived), does‘nt mean it was an insignifigant action (war) to the other side.
 
It was a war and the Canadians won. As hard as that is to belive for a self absorbed american like yourself Sgt Smedley it actually did happen. It wasnt a big war but we did win and it is most certainly signifigant. It is not talked about much in the US because you LOST and from my limited experince most Americans dont like admitting that they have ever lost anything. Ive actually had friends of my parents from Washington State explain to me how the Americans never really lost Vietnam and there just waiting for the right time to go back and win!
I just finished reading "A Military History of Canada" by Desmond Morton and it is an excelent book probably the best book I have ever read about the whole of the Canadian military.
French crop rotation may very well be a relevant subject for a week or two but by the end of grade eight we had spent 2 weeks studying the specifics of it and besides that we had already learned all about the middle ages Rome and eqypt in grade 6 and 7 so we where just covering old ground. Its very nice you like to read about history portcullisguy but most kids in highschool dont (I do but thats just me) and Instead of re-learning old boring subjects I think it would be better if we studied more Canadian history and less french farming techniques. World history is certainly important but so is Canadian history and I would like to see at least a 50/50 split rather than 95/5 like it is now.

Coniar
 
The British did not just attack and burn Washington from the water. Militia Units from Ontario made their ways south through Enemy lines and proceeded to burn the White House (then PINK) down.
 
Umm did we not also take detroit without firing a shot only to give it back for some lame reason.
You can have New Orleans and all that french because we have enough of it up here!
 
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