Missing Titanic Sub

[KevinB]

The part that gets me is that Paul-Henry Nargeolet is an expert diver and deep-sea explorer who has made something like 30 previous trips to the Titanic wreckage and must have known that there problems with the Titan sub

Don't worry, some ghoul somewhere will try.

Lots of smart people do dumb shit, often for money or fame.

 

[lenaitch]

If it makes it cheaper & easier to skirt rules, if it ain't happening, wait for it.

No doubt; 'tis the way of free enterprise' but I imagine there are numerous other factors that impact going above the ocean more than below. Also, unless the business model relies purely on tourism, commercial space operators need to make income from launching satellites, and owners and their insurers will be more insistent on things like certifications and accreditation.

 

[KevinB]

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/06/22/us/titanic-missing-submarine?campaign_id=190&emc=edit_ufn_20230622&instance_id=95779&nl=from-the-times&regi_id=112483158&segment_id=137011&te=1&user_id=8d7d6aec56e938bb0d8c632c51238996&smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

 

[Quirky]

Pretty much covers it.

 

[FSTO]

I heard that this very vessel had dived down several times? Or was this it’s first dive?

 

[Navy_Pete]

So interesting story over on CBC that goes over some previous drama on it's lack of actual certification;

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/oceangate-warned-2018-david-lochridge-1.6883432

Kind of ironic they decided to ignore class certification standards, which grew out of general marine safety standards (SOLAS), which all started as a response to Titanic sinking without enough life rafts.

This is pretty niche, so I doubt it will lead to additional IMO regulations (which is a UN agency that almost every country on the planet has signed onto), but with the company being headquartered in the US do expect some massive lawsuits, regardless of the waiver.

 

[daftandbarmy]

So interesting story over on CBC that goes over some previous drama on it's lack of actual certification;

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/oceangate-warned-2018-david-lochridge-1.6883432

Kind of ironic they decided to ignore class certification standards, which grew out of general marine safety standards (SOLAS), which all started as a response to Titanic sinking without enough life rafts.

This is pretty niche, so I doubt it will lead to additional IMO regulations (which is a UN agency that almost every country on the planet has signed onto), but with the company being headquartered in the US do expect some massive lawsuits, regardless of the waiver.

 

[Kilted]

There are a few parrells to the Titanic here.

 

[Ping Monkey]

From WSJ: https://archive.ph/pSpem

U.S. Navy Detected Titan Sub Implosion Days Ago
"... U.S. Navy acoustic detection system designed to spot enemy submarines first heard the Titan sub implosion hours after the submersible began its mission, officials involved in the search said."

 

[OldSolduer]

Say what you like about Bezos and Musk but I am pretty sure they probably had actual rocket scientists working on their projects.

Did this vain jerk have a submarine expert or two?

 

[Quirky]

There are a few parrells to the Titanic here.

They both caved under the pressure.

 

[KevinB]

I heard that this very vessel had dived down several times? Or was this it’s first dive?

This vessel had not done the trip before.
The original Cyclops-1 had, the Titan was originally called Cyclops-2 but renamed after some cancelled trips.

Based on what had been posted about the design and history the only check dive the Titan had done was 1,500m with 1 occupant (the deceased owner and designer) for 3 hours.
Sounds like a legit test right
Edit after the check dive (where they had lost comms with the data stream ) he had them remove the voice comms as he was annoyed at being asked for status updates) and decided only for the data stream…

 

[ModlrMike]

There is also the suggestion that he fired the person who pointed out that the viewing window was only rated for 1300m when the sub was expected to approach 4000m. In addition, according to this article, he wasn't keen on hiring people with experience.

 

[daftandbarmy]

There is also the suggestion that he fired the person who pointed out that the viewing window was only rated for 1300m when the sub was expected to approach 4000m. In addition, according to this article, he wasn't keen on hiring people with experience.

James Cameron was pretty clear... this was an avoidable tragedy:

Titanic director James Cameron: 'OceanGate were warned'​

Cameron also suggested that there was a "terrible irony" in the loss of Titan and its crew, likening it to the loss of the Titanic itself back in 1912.

"We now have another wreck that is based on unfortunately the same principles of not heeding warnings," he said. "OceanGate were warned."
He said the company had had people working internally who quit but he did not specify why.

He went on to say that some within the deep submergence community, not including himself directly, had written a letter to OceanGate saying they believed, in his words, "you are going on a path to catastrophe".

Cameron is not the first to raise concerns about the tourism firm's operations.

A letter sent to OceanGate by the Marine Technology Society (MTS) in March 2018 and obtained by the New York Times stated "the current 'experimental' approach adopted by OceanGate... could result in negative outcomes (from minor to catastrophic)".

Separately, US court documents show a former employee of OceanGate warned of potential safety problems with the vessel as far back as 2018.
The documents show that David Lochridge, the company's director of marine operations, raised concerns in an inspection report.

Titanic director James Cameron: 'OceanGate were warned'

James Cameron, who did 33 dives to Titanic's wreck, tells BBC he suspected immediately the sub was lost.

www.bbc.com

 

[lenaitch]

And now cue the discussions of legal liability. The victims' families have deep pockets to push the issue and US civil juries have heartstrings to pull, and some believe that, despite the high seas venue, existence of waivers, etc. there might be some success. How deep Rush's pockets were remains to be seen.

Tourist sub’s implosion draws attention to murky regulations of deep-sea expeditions

NORFOLK, Va. (AP) — When the Titan submersible made its fateful dive into the North Atlantic on Sunday, it also plunged into the murkily regulated wat...

www.thestar.com

 

[mariomike]

Might be in poor taste to ask so soon.

But, I wonder how multi-international billing for rescue operations works?

Or, if it "on the house?" So to speak.

Eg: Non-City residents who have traffic accidents in our town are charged $543.03 , minimum, for each TFS vehicle dispatched, per hour.
Including 400-series highways within the city.

 

[Blackadder1916]

. . . How deep Rush's pockets were remains to be seen.

It can be assumed approximately 12,500 feet.

 

[FSTO]

So, people are getting pissy about folks who are memeing the deaths of the 5. But what is the number of people who were put at risk to try to rescue these folks? My biggest fears were for the crews of the aircraft searching for the submersible because flying relatively low level over the ocean is risky business.

 

[FSTO]

I wonder if Hamish said this to Stockton?

 

[Brad Sallows]

More likely the last thing anyone had time to say was something briefer. "Shit" and "Oh fuck" apparently are common.